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Originally Posted by Taxi645
Better wet performance of the tyres means the cars are better able to drive in wet conditions. This means less boring laps behind the safetycar, less race interruptions and yes also less chance of a cancelled race.
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Again, is it that much of a problem? I don't think it is. Especially with respect to how much time is either spent behind a safety car or races not happening due to extreme weather. See my comments at the end about actual data.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taxi645
As said, since wet races are the most interesting to watch (I think most would agree), every opportunity (within reason  ) to improve the chances of the cars being able to run in the more wet conditions is welcome. |
See above.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taxi645
With that argument we could even race lawnmowers and call it the pinnacle of motorsport. |
That is a fair comment. But F1 as some type of technological showcase (with a few exceptions such as the current power units) long ago stopped being particularly innovative due to the rules continuing to box them in. Next year will be even more so. Regardless, nobody is ready to open up wheel regulations for "competitive" or "technology demonstration" reasons. At best you might find interest in more than a single tire provider, but with standard wheel sizes (see comments below about tire manufactures likely wanting to gravitate toward larger diameter wheels). As cool as it might be, nobody is looking to replicate something like Tyrrell small diameter wheels in which each team might have their own bespoke tire? If we want to lower unsprung weight, might we just move brakes back inboard, etc. Nobody really wants to do these things because the ability to gain over a rival is small and temporary.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taxi645
Let's be serious. I reckon 18-inch was chosen, because they were afraid the fanbase would reject rims smaller than on their own car and wanted the new car to look good. Secondly it is more inline with endurance racing sizes. The difference is, endurance is not open wheels so they are not as much effected by the drag and dirty air from the wheels.
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While visual difference between F1 and pretty much most everything else was a factor, I believe your second point is the primary reason. Tire manufactures didn't want to continue to invest in technology that pretty much supports only F1. Other top level series are going in the same direction. Why not build data on wheels that are 18" and with a specific diameter and be able to apply that to multiple series?
Regarding aero issues. That is a red-herring. Overall diameter is generally the same. If they are concerned about the delta with respect to aero by the wheels themselves then they can aero covers if they want. Which I believe is exactly what F1 is doing for 2022.
There are pros and cons to both 13" vs 18" wheels. The smaller 13" have lost that battle.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taxi645
F1 cars have been gain more and more weight each year and it's getting out of hand. Some were because of safety reasons (good) and some in my view are the result of ill chosen technical regulation (current drivetrain and now 2022 wheels sizes).
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Generally this is a topic that is unrelated to wheel and tire sizes. Yes, the new combo is slightly heavier. But the teams generally have a strategy that if there is something new, instead of working to adjust to a new minimum weight, they rather push for the minimum weight to be increased. The teams want the cars to be as heavy as they are.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taxi645
Nope I have been saying this for quite a while.
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Yes, I was overly broad when I said "nobody" is talking about this. I expect there is a very, very small group who is pushing for this. You included. But when looking at the big picture. The advocates for smaller width tires (especially to try to increase the amount of time spent running in wet weather) is effectively zero. Does it make you wrong? Not up to me. IMHO, it does question the validity of the size of the problem and solution you propose.
Apologies for my bluntness, and I really don't mean to offend, but IMHO, this proposal is very Don Quixote-esque.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taxi645
As said, the performance of the tire in really wet conditions is just one of the drawbacks of the wide tires. Yes, a race cancelled because of the rain is really a corner case. A race paused due to heavy rain or endless rounds behind the safetycar have been a regular occurrence.
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Endless round behind the safetycar? Can we move beyond the hyperbole? To be fair, you called me out for making small numbers zero. But don't make small numbers huge or infinite!
Can you provide some data? Look back over a few decades and total up the number of races cancelled due to extreme wet weather. And what is the number of wet laps run under safety car vs. green flag, but wet conditions? I don't have the numbers. My gut tells me that cancelled races and ratio of safety vs. green laps (in wet) is extremely low.
I am not trying to make this argument FOR this. If I was, I would show the data. Show the benefit (especially with respect to what you think it will do with regards to wet weather outcomes) I think it's up to you to make the case and that should include actual data. Show me where you are right and I am wrong with data. Even then. Lets look at the recent spa race. How much of a change would have to have been made to the tires and cars to really keep the spray down enough to allow racing? I suspect it would have taken drastic changes (so drastic as to gather no real support) to the tires and cars to make that happen. It will always eventually rain so hard that whatever solution you bring is not enough.
Richard