Ron Dennis' pride

**Born Racer** · 29 Jul 2006, 13:33 (Ref:1667114)

Okay, firstly I'm not going to judge De La Rosa too much just yet, as he's had less than 2 grands prix in which to get back into the racing fold.

However, I don't think he's as good as Montoya. And I assume Ron Dennis doesn't/didn't seeing as he chose to sign Montoya as his race driver. So, with his decision to "put him on the bench" as he described it, has he shot himself in the foot with his pride?

After all, McLaren's priority should be to get as many points as possible this year. To drop Montoya for the reason he did seems short-sighted and selfish, putting his own personal interests/status before that of the team.

deejay · 29 Jul 2006, 13:49 (Ref:1667126)

An unmotivated Montoya wasn't driving well though and was unlikely to pick up many - if any - more points than his replacement. .

De La Rosa will be disappointed by the way qualifying went today, but it's too soon to write him off.

**Peter Mallett** · 29 Jul 2006, 13:52 (Ref:1667129)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Born Racer

Okay, firstly I'm not going to judge De La Rosa too much just yet, as he's had less than 2 grands prix in which to get back into the racing fold.

But you will anyway.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Born Racer

However, I don't think he's as good as Montoya.

Too early to judge as someone said being only 1.5 grands prix in.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Born Racer

And I assume Ron Dennis doesn't/didn't seeing as he chose to sign Montoya as his race driver. So, with his decision to "put him on the bench" as he described it, has he shot himself in the foot with his pride?

Well we haven't seen Padlo take his teammate out yet, nor have we seen him driving to less than his perceived capability.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Born Racer

After all, McLaren's priority should be to get as many points as possible this year. To drop Montoya for the reason he did seems short-sighted and selfish, putting his own personal interests/status before that of the team.

See my above comment. Monty was definitely not performing to his best for whatever reason. When he broke his contract (allegedly) I suspect Ron took the only team decision he could and brought in Pedro. Of course all of your arguments suggest Monty wanted to continue anyway. Are we certain he did?

**Born Racer** · 29 Jul 2006, 14:19 (Ref:1667140)

Quote:

But you will anyway.

Hehe, true. Well, I mean that I'm prepared to give him more time to compare him to Raikkonen overall. But even so, a real top driver should be more or less driving to their potential from the start (especially when they've accumulated the amount of miles DLR has this year.) I mean, look at Yamamoto. Now he hasn't been given enough miles and this alone is reason not to take him on just yet. In any case he is clearly nowhere near Sato and it makes all this toing and froing to get an All-Japan team look silly and badly planned. Montagny was doing a solid job.

Quote:

An unmotivated Montoya wasn't driving well though and was unlikely to pick up many - if any - more points than his replacement. .

I'm not convinced he wasn't motivated. Apparantly he was having trouble adapting to the understeery nature of the car, which I'm not using to justify his performances.

Quote:

Well we haven't seen Padlo take his teammate out yet

He's a racer. It happens. What about De La Rosa turning into Ralf Schumacher today thus losing him important qualification time?

Quote:

Of course all of your arguments suggest Monty wanted to continue anyway. Are we certain he did?

No, we're not. I suspect this may be better for Montoya stopping F1 now anyway, because he has more time to prepare for NASCAR. I'd love more confirmation on whether he himself did want to stop now or not. Anyway, if he did or if he didn't, it doesn't change the fact that Ron dropped him from the race seat (as he openly admitted.)

And can someone confirm that Montoya broke his contract? If so, in what way? I'm not saying he didn't, but again I need confirmation on this before I can comment.

I admit I'm defending Montoya a lot because I'm a fan of his, but I'm a fan of his because I believe in his abilties. Was watching an old Canadian Grand Prix the other day and Montoya put a move on Alonso that came from quite far back and should have been rather easy for Alonso to prevent. And yet he came sailing through because he had the confidence to just stick his car there and prove how it is possible to overtake if you're as good as he is. You've just got to show the other driver the way and the space can be there. What's more the move was executed tidily with no lock up or raggedness. Most drivers aren't prepared to have a go.

I miss him.

**Peter Mallett** · 29 Jul 2006, 14:26 (Ref:1667143)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Born Racer

I miss him.

*Sob*

Yes, a good point would be to establish whether Monty wanted out rather than criticise Ron for his actions.

And Pedro is possibly a lesser driver than a motivated Monty but is he achieving his potential? If so he's doing what the team wants.

Marbot · 29 Jul 2006, 14:51 (Ref:1667154)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter Mallett

*Sob*

Cheer up,he could afterall still finish sixth in the championship.

**Born Racer** · 29 Jul 2006, 15:13 (Ref:1667165)

Well if Montoya had wanted out so quickly, why didn't Ron say that rather than choosing to show us how powerful he is in his position by saying that he "put him on the bench"?

**Peter Mallett** · 29 Jul 2006, 15:21 (Ref:1667170)

Wasn't there something about family matters and the pair taking a joint decision?

Knowlesy · 29 Jul 2006, 17:22 (Ref:1667239)

There was that, but by god that was a glossy way of putting it.

At the end of the day, I feel Montoya didn't want to continue and Ron didn't either. Bringing in Pedro (or Gary) really was the only option, as much as it hurts to say that.

And Martin Whitmarsh has said that, due to the similarities in driving style between Pedro and Kimi, the team is moving forward easier instead of catering for two drivers who really were chalk and cheese.

CATMAN · 29 Jul 2006, 19:54 (Ref:1667306)

Montoya was rumoured to be a little to critical of the cars performance and easily miffed by any mention of his own performance

Mr V · 29 Jul 2006, 20:35 (Ref:1667338)

Quote:

Originally Posted by CATMAN

Montoya was ... easily miffed by any mention of his own performance

The team (privately) blamed him for the Indy accident, he didn't agree (neither did i for that matter fwiw) and he decided he didn't have a future with the team (which seemed obvious by McLaren signing Alfonso, not taking up the option on JPM and openly hankering after Kimi's services in 2007) so he decided to switch series next year.

It seems it's ok for McLaren to announce their intentions 2 seasons in advance, but not ok for a driver to announce his for the following season.

As for Ron's pride, he made his decision, he's still having to pay someone for not racing and the replacement isn't doing any better.

CATMAN · 29 Jul 2006, 22:34 (Ref:1667439)

Believe what you like, but in F1 reasons for leaving and what the pay arrangements are, are normaly far from what is in the press.
A driver still has to give 100% to the cars development no matter how good the car performs on race day. Pedro may not being doing any batter but he may have a more positive input to the cars advancement.
Any negatives from a driver planning to move on can be very costly if he is not tuned in 100% to the job in hand re car development! Even if he is on full pay it could still be cheaper for the development test budget to be rid of him

deejay · 29 Jul 2006, 23:29 (Ref:1667473)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Born Racer

I'm not convinced he wasn't motivated. Apparantly he was having trouble adapting to the understeery nature of the car, which I'm not using to justify his performances.

I'm talking about for the rest of the season. He'd signed to a different series, had a car that he didn't like, a team that didn't like him, no future at all in F1. I do not think that was a position for good motivation for the rest of the season.

deejay · 29 Jul 2006, 23:38 (Ref:1667480)

Quote:

Originally Posted by CATMAN

Pedro may not being doing any batter but he may have a more positive input to the cars advancement.

Yep. And now they can have no qualms about treating Kimi as No. 1 for the rest of the season and trying to get some decent results.

Also, I don't think you can say Pedro isn't doing any better yet. Despite terrible hold ups in traffic he was only 16 seconds behind Kimi at the end of his only race this year. Monty has often been much further behind than that.

Korr · 30 Jul 2006, 02:42 (Ref:1667523)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr V

... he's still having to pay someone for not racing and the replacement isn't doing any better.

Pay him for not racing, or pay him for racing and breaking cars and driving team mates off the road....hm, what choice to make?

Mr V · 30 Jul 2006, 07:50 (Ref:1667596)

That happened once, at Indy.

Splatz the Cow · 30 Jul 2006, 08:58 (Ref:1667622)

Mods, this thread has degenerated to a driver bash inside of one page; seems like all of the school-yard cowards are trying to get a kick in before the teacher comes.

Credit to those trying to make reasonable points.

**Peter Mallett** · 30 Jul 2006, 09:06 (Ref:1667629)

Don't see much bashing. FWIW there is one post that was a bit harsh but its true that Monty was underachieving and its also true that Pedro has so far done what he's supposed to do.

Korr · 30 Jul 2006, 10:21 (Ref:1667687)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Splatz the Cow

Mods, this thread has degenerated to a driver bash inside of one page; seems like all of the school-yard cowards are trying to get a kick in before the teacher comes.

Credit to those trying to make reasonable points.

And your point was entirely reasonable, too!

**Peter Mallett** · 30 Jul 2006, 10:22 (Ref:1667690)

Closed.

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