[Rules] Future Rule Changes

[wnut]

Another no solution to the problem set of regs coming up!

http://www.racer.com/f1/item/126394-...seconds-faster

Who cares if they are 3 secs a lap faster?

Can they race one another?

[old man]

I agree with chillibowl, result will be mixed up grids with critical timing of a change to new tyres catching people out. We always get good races when grids get mixed up, this may be an attempt to deliberately create them.

[Casper]

I have a radical idea, no qualifying, it will cut down on costs and some motors will last all year. Line everyone up on the grid and drop the flag, the last man on every lap gets eliminated until we have a winner.

[Mike Harte]

Even more radical. Why not just put all the drivers in a room, and play musical chairs until there is a winner. Would save hundreds of millions of dollars, plus help save the planet at the same time.

[S griffin]

I prefer to keep it simple with a conventional qualifying session or two, rather than over complicating it

[Razor]

What about a 20 minute free for all? Like what the V8 Supercars do.

[steve_r]

Ripped from Sky Sports:-

'A new qualification format was unanimously accepted by the F1 Commission. The new system is being evaluated for introduction, potentially as soon as the beginning of the 2016 season.


Q1

•16 minutes

•After 7 minutes, slowest driver eliminated

•Slowest driver eliminated every 1 minute 30 seconds thereafter until the chequered flag

•7 drivers eliminated, 15 progress to Q2

Q2

•15 minutes

•After 6 minutes, slowest driver eliminated

•Slowest driver eliminated every 1 minute 30 seconds thereafter until the chequered flag

•7 drivers eliminated, 8 progress to Q3

Q3

•14 minutes

•After 5 minutes, slowest driver eliminated

•Slowest driver eliminated every 1 minute 30 seconds thereafter until the chequered flag

•2 drivers left in final 1 minute 30 seconds

The final elimination in each session occurs at the chequered flag – not when time is up.

[steve_r]

I don't see anything wrong with the current rules, but the change will at least make sure that there is on track action straightaway - no more will the green light come on, and everyone stays in the pits.

[Mike E]

Originally Posted by bella

i can't see how this is going to be anything other than a big confusing mess for anyone actually watching it at the circuit. it's a bit ballroom dancing, isn't it?

There's the rub, Bella. The people at the circuit are the last people they will be thinking about. It's for 'The Show'.

Imagine a world where drivers compete against each other to see who is fastest. Some people come to watch because they want to see drivers and cars on the ragged edge. The winner is the driver who completes the race distance in the shortest time. There is no 'show', just a motor race. Pure fantasy, I know.

[Mystery]

I hope someone can point out the problem that this is the solution for. It's qualifying - it's not the race. It's not meant to be as exciting as the race. It shouldn't be a highlight of the weekend. If promoters have asked for change in order that they can sell more tickets to try and lose only a large sum of money rather than an eye-wateringly vast sum of money then actually £cclestone doesn't really need to look too far in order to find a solution to that one.

But of course this isn't going to improve the trackside event at all unless you happen to have a screen nearby with times on it, so the promoters will have been given change for change's sake.

I think there's lot of poorly thought through elements of this plan. If cars need to be on track throughout then there's no tyre changing so as mentioned by someone above the first couple of laps will set out pretty much how the session will go, removing any semblance of drama we at least had with the previous system.

Yellow flags are very likely to have an influence in several sessions with drivers who slow down to proper safe yellow flag speeds being penalised and as before those who go steaming through the flagged zones are ignored. After Jules's accident I thought they'd clamp down on this but there's been none.

And what if wet weather improves during a session. Are they going to allow a tyre change, or do they expect everyone to cruise around on threadbare rubber.

This change is enough that I probably won't bother with qualifying at all this season. I suppose it's not a "caution clock" but it's not much less contrived.

[Pingguest]

The new regulations truly proves the decision makers do not have any clue about what is wrong with Formula One. In fact, they make it even worse. Both the new qualifying format as well as the new tire regulations will be in-creditably complex and probably impossible to explain to casual viewers.

[bella]

Originally Posted by Mike E

There's the rub, Bella. The people at the circuit are the last people they will be thinking about. It's for 'The Show'.

Imagine a world where drivers compete against each other to see who is fastest. Some people come to watch because they want to see drivers and cars on the ragged edge. The winner is the driver who completes the race distance in the shortest time. There is no 'show', just a motor race. Pure fantasy, I know.

heh, getting a bit existential but you highlight the one ideological problem i have with timed races rather than distance - you just keep going round and round till you run out of time. it's like pre-defined musical chairs. obviously it doesn't end up like that, and often the guys who win were going flat out 100% for every minute of the race but... there's just something wrong about it isn't there!

the thing is, these tinkerings with the quali system to make it more thrilling for the viewers would be great if they had the systems in place to include the crowd in that, ie with heavy duty mobile telecom upgrades so everyone could use data (or - omg - a free wifi network that travelled with the tv crap, enabling 80,000 people to hook up to the timing server on their own devices instead of those kangaroo thingies before). but they don't. so it's nonsense. what does it tell ticket holders? that they're paying through the nose to be a tv extra -_-

(shh. it's poetic licence.)

[Mystery]

They want to be on pay-TV so in their utopia there won't be any casual viewers!

[bjohnsonsmith]

F1 are thinking of removing the fuel limit, for next year.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/122945

[BSchneiderFan]

That would be welcome. Can't stand to see GP drivers lifting and coasting. For endurance racing, maybe, but Formula 1 should be flat-out lights to flag.

[VIVA GT]

I've just thought of a 'what if?' regarding this new qualifying plan:
So, Driver 'A' is found to currently be the slowest and is given this information over the radio by his team and is told to do a cooling down lap and bring his car into the pits. What if during his slow lap he gets in the way of other, quicker cars & snookers their "It was honestly going to be at least a second quicker than my previous best, governor" lap? Surely the potential protests wont be sorted out until after the race if there are a few?

[old man]

Each session is about 10 laps, give or take, and you still want to be fastest on the last couple of laps so what do you do about tyre choice? The softest tyre available will go off before the end of the laps so do you start on a scrubbed set and gamble on making a tyre stop or do you go with a tyre that you know will still be good at the end?

Do I remember talk of teams being free to select tyre grades?

Like I said, objective is, mixed up grids

[Pingguest]

Originally Posted by BSchneiderFan

That would be welcome. Can't stand to see GP drivers lifting and coasting. For endurance racing, maybe, but Formula 1 should be flat-out lights to flag.

Until quite recently, Formula One never used to be going flat-out the entire race. Things changed when mid-race refueling was (re-)legalized in 1994, competing tire manufacturers improved durability and relatively short stints were promoted as a consequence of the post-qualifying parc fermé.

Things changed again as soon as mid-race refueling was banned. Because fuel comes with a weight penalty, teams opted to run their cars 'under-fueled' and therefore with a reduced load.

The current regulations only allow a fuel consumption of 100 kilograms per race, but stil teams 'under-fuel' their car pretty often. In some races, no more than 90 kilograms of fuel used consumed. Hence, it is very unlikely an abolition the fuel consumption limit will bring a change, let alone a desirable one.

[Mike Harte]

What about out laps, in laps and laps actually in the pits; they will be the slowest? How will they truly balance out the fact that some cars are inevitably going to be slowed because of a yellow flag at some point?

The whole idea seems to be heading for mass protests by those who think that they have been disadvantaged at some time. I hate the fact that more and more of F1 potential results are being artificially manipulated by those in charge of the purse strings.

I truly hope that when the teams come to their senses they will reject this barmy idea; they have until the next meeting to regain their sanity at which time they have to decide whether to change to this ridiculous format!

[chillibowl]

Originally Posted by old man

We always get good races when grids get mixed up, this may be an attempt to deliberately create them.

right!

to me this makes sense or at least makes more sense than deliberately lining up the cars in order of fastest slowest and then wondering why the finishing order is the same as the quali order.

anyways looks like you and I are in the minority on this one!

actually the one positive aspect of this (largely vague) format is that it is new and new means a more difficult challenge for the drivers. hopefully the fact that it is confusing means the smarter drivers will be the ones who are rewarded.

time will tell.

also curious how we are defining what a casual fan is? given the price of tickets i would think buying one makes you more than a casual fan but regardless it certainly it places you in a demographic that has a smart phone with a data plan.

between the jumbotrons, live timing app, a stream on your phone, trackside radio broadcast, talking to those around you etc how much more information does a casual fan need access to to make the event accessible?

[Gingers4Justice]

Originally Posted by bjohnsonsmith

F1 are thinking of removing the fuel limit, for next year.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/122945

Good. It's fine for endurance racing, but I always found it an....interesting...theory that young kids and hippies the world over would suddenly start following Formula One because Lewis Hamilton lifts off the gas 100 yards before he used to.

Of course lift-and-coasting has always been part and parcel of Grand Prix racing, but I think it's gone too far in recent years. Commentators talk about fuel consumption and tire wear far more in a 90 minute Grand Prix than their colleagues do in a 6 hour WEC race.

That can't be right.

[Gingers4Justice]

If you want to make qualifying exciting, what about just giving teams one lap? As in literally, just one lap.

Car in the garage? Tough luck. Drive span on his hot lap? Tough luck.

I think it would be really exciting as it would put a heap of pressure on drivers to deliver, and the inevitable mistakes would create some interesting grids.

[ECW Dan Selby]

I'm fine with it. Let's try it for one season and see what happens. It should hopefully promote some driving errors.

The idea is to create some messed up grids, and let's face it, they're always the most fun races.

Plus, it's the same for everyone. It's not like DRS. I'm totally fine with giving it a try.

Selby

[Pingguest]

Although I have been a Formula One fanatic for about twenty years, the constant artificial manipulation seriously makes me lose interest. I am really sick and tired of it. What purity is left in Formula One? Twenty years ago, Formula One fans were saying 'their' series was a sport and NASCAR a fake show. But nowadays, Formula One goes far beyond the typical United States series.

[BSchneiderFan]

Originally Posted by Gingers4Justice

If you want to make qualifying exciting, what about just giving teams one lap? As in literally, just one lap.

Car in the garage? Tough luck. Drive span on his hot lap? Tough luck.

I think it would be really exciting as it would put a heap of pressure on drivers to deliver, and the inevitable mistakes would create some interesting grids.

Worth a try. Would certainly pile the pressure on.