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Old 20 Nov 2017, 12:33 (Ref:3781674)   #926
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In fact, the last Honda win was 2006 Hungarian GP, done by Jenson Button. The last decent season of Honda in Formula 1 up to today (for the moment).

2007-08 seasons of their team were simply strange... With the earthdreams "sponsoring" the car, that made a mistery what they had in their minds about the matter...

During their absence (2009-14) they were concentrated in their engines for Indycars and for their domestic F. Nippon-Super Formula series, then their racing department was active on that time.

And their 2015 return to F1 as an engine maker, is also very strange... With its ups-and-dows, it seems on the last races they're starting to work it out with this, but we have to wait to 2018 to see if that finally flourishes...

I'm sure Honda is still capable to do the things well, but it something that could not understand in this... That's why do not understand...
Engines for IndyCar come under the auspices of Honda Performance Development, Inc., based in Santa Clarita, California, which is a wholly owned subsidiary of American Honda Motor Co., Inc. They've been responsible for Honda's involvement in the American Le Mans Series, Le Mans Series, the FIA World Endurance Championship and Super GT.

With Honda themselves being out of the loop for 5 years, that would go some way in explaining the lack of progress in F1. Maybe they should have gone to HPD.
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Old 25 Nov 2017, 20:30 (Ref:3782967)   #927
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Mekola should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridMekola should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridMekola should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
Perhaps the biggest problem McLaren has, is the lack of a major sponsor(s) since Lewis left the team, and not precisely the fortunes of its engine suppliers...
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Old 25 Nov 2017, 20:51 (Ref:3782970)   #928
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the automotive arm of mclaren is making solid profit, i'm sure it's not as much of a problem as it appears.
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Old 26 Nov 2017, 00:24 (Ref:3783016)   #929
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the automotive arm of mclaren is making solid profit, i'm sure it's not as much of a problem as it appears.

Rule 1: Never go racing with your own money!
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Old 26 Nov 2017, 00:54 (Ref:3783024)   #930
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Perhaps the biggest problem McLaren has, is the lack of a major sponsor(s) since Lewis left the team, and not precisely the fortunes of its engine suppliers...
I’m sure this is why they are running the car with so much downforce. To try to fool prospective sponsors they have no power but are great in the corners - and all will thus be well with Renault. Hoping to sign a title sponsor who won’t find out until it is too late.
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Old 26 Nov 2017, 21:42 (Ref:3783277)   #931
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They should have put more downforce on the back of Vandoorne’s car!
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Old 21 Dec 2017, 23:10 (Ref:3788610)   #932
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For the McLaren fans... get your team gear HERE.

I'm guessing the prices being so low is because of the Christmas sales yeah?
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Old 22 Dec 2017, 01:50 (Ref:3788627)   #933
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Apparently McLaren, won't have a title sponsor next season.

http://classic.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/133602
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Old 22 Dec 2017, 11:07 (Ref:3788681)   #934
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I'll try again.

I fear Mr. Brown is long on promises and reassurances, but very short on delivery!

Be interesting to see what the contributions from the "partners" looks like against what would be required from a headline sponsor plus supporting sponsors.
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Old 22 Dec 2017, 13:51 (Ref:3788694)   #935
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Hopefully they'll still have enough to survive without a title sponsor as they have done already
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Old 24 Dec 2017, 10:41 (Ref:3788965)   #936
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I'll try again.

I fear Mr. Brown is long on promises and reassurances, but very short on delivery!

Be interesting to see what the contributions from the "partners" looks like against what would be required from a headline sponsor plus supporting sponsors.
The real problem for the last 3 seasons is that the cars have been performing poorly on track. No amount of first class travel, trackside champagne rooms or bouncy castles offered hope that the performance was on the improve.

Everyone has a boss, if the sponsor sees the promised benefit of association not showing up as planned, it is a difficult conversation to have with the marketers, with the CEO, with the board each week after another crap performance.

To keep alive the proof of concept, if not the choice of partner, it can explain why sponsors may jump to another operation if the offer as a whole is better..
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Old 25 Dec 2017, 14:35 (Ref:3789110)   #937
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What do we make of Zak Brown's assertion that title sponsors no longer fit the F1 business model? Acceptance of a new reality, or special pleading?
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Old 25 Dec 2017, 14:41 (Ref:3789111)   #938
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What do we make of Zak Brown's assertion that title sponsors no longer fit the F1 business model?
An excuse for awful performance off track?
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Old 25 Dec 2017, 15:37 (Ref:3789118)   #939
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What do we make of Zak Brown's assertion that title sponsors no longer fit the F1 business model?
Tell that to Red Bull, Petronas Mercedes, Martini Williams and even Alfa Romeo Sauber.
Zak Brown seems to have caught a dose of Ronspeak.
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Old 25 Dec 2017, 15:48 (Ref:3789119)   #940
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Tell that to Red Bull, Petronas Mercedes, Martini Williams and even Alfa Romeo Sauber.
Zak Brown seems to have caught a dose of Ronspeak.
To be fair, Red Bull aren't quite a title sponsor, in that they own the team (and Toro Rosso).
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Old 25 Dec 2017, 15:56 (Ref:3789122)   #941
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To be fair, Red Bull aren't quite a title sponsor, in that they own the team (and Toro Rosso).
Sounds remarkably similar to McLaren, who (/their shareholders) own their team and who in the main are currently are funding said team themselves, as with Red Bull with minor secondary sponsors.
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Old 25 Dec 2017, 17:11 (Ref:3789125)   #942
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And like Benetton too
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Old 25 Dec 2017, 18:21 (Ref:3789129)   #943
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Sounds remarkably similar to McLaren, who (/their shareholders) own their team and who in the main are currently are funding said team themselves, as with Red Bull with minor secondary sponsors.
Actually Red Bull’s commercial income covers around 98% of their budget.
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Old 29 Dec 2017, 12:23 (Ref:3789580)   #944
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Mekola should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridMekola should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridMekola should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
BTW, who owns McLaren now?
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Old 29 Dec 2017, 14:20 (Ref:3789598)   #945
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BTW, who owns McLaren now?
McLaren are owned by Bahrain Mumtalakat Holding Company, which in turn is wholly owned by the Kingdom of Bahrain and TAG Group (Holdings) S.A..

In June this year, Ron Dennis sold his 25% shareholding in the McLaren Technology Group, to the other shareholders, as well his shares in McLaren Automotive.
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Old 29 Dec 2017, 15:23 (Ref:3789613)   #946
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The sale has been agreed in principle, however the payment for his shares are to be made in instalments. The first tranche went through fairly recently, but McLaren needed to borrow the money to make the payment for that 1st tranche.
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Old 29 Dec 2017, 17:05 (Ref:3789629)   #947
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He sold his shares 100% although being paid in tranches secured by mortgages on assets.
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Old 29 Dec 2017, 17:12 (Ref:3789634)   #948
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He sold his shares 100% although being paid in tranches secured by mortgages on assets.
Which is what I wrote, although until he receives the full amount, the shares are held in escrow. McLaren have used a number of their old cars as security for the first loan; no idea what they will pawn to raise the rest of the money.
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Old 29 Dec 2017, 18:11 (Ref:3789645)   #949
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Not quite what you wrote before. The shares aren’t sold in “principle.” They are slid and RD took mortgages in the old cars as security for the debt. Big difference as the shares cannot revert.
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Old 29 Dec 2017, 20:26 (Ref:3789665)   #950
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Not quite what you wrote before. The shares aren’t sold in “principle.” They are slid and RD took mortgages in the old cars as security for the debt. Big difference as the shares cannot revert.
Without getting too tied up in this, I do believe that McLaren raised the money from outside sources and it is they that hold the lien on the assets put up by McLaren - not Ron Dennis. And that was only to cover the first instalment. They still have to find further funds to pay for the balance of the shares, and I am pretty sure that Dennis will not let them go without receiving the full amount.

This could yet end up in court if he doesn't get his money!
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