Acura/HPD's future plans

[AU N EGL]

Originally Posted by JAG

Some rumours about a three car Le Mans P1 program also.

So what will happen to the P2's, customer cars?

Tag Sale ?

[chernaudi]

Acura vs Porsche is starting to remind me of Audi vs Peugeot in the LMS. Like Peugeot, Acura started out slow compared to Porsche, but now have come to equal them on speed-now if only they can match the Captian's strategy.

[HORNDAWG]

Sorry I have a hard time with that view. You have to go back to Acura's debut race at Sebring in 07 to find a gap of more than a second between the two in Qing! Acura in their debut year were right on the Spyders (Penske) behind, pushing them the whole season. In a season where the Spyders were killing the previous years track records, which they had set themselves, with the Acura's smashing them as well. I do not see that as a slow start at all. They even beat the Spyder in their (Acura's) debut.

L.P.

[chernaudi]

Originally Posted by HORNDAWG

Sorry I have a hard time with that view. You have to go back to Acura's debut race at Sebring in 07 to find a gap of more than a second between the two in Qing! Acura in their debut year were right on the Spyders (Penske) behind, pushing them the whole season. In a season where the Spyders were killing the previous years track records, which they had set themselves, with the Acura's smashing them as well. I do not see that as a slow start at all. They even beat the Spyder in their (Acura's) debut.

L.P.

But the final score(which most outside observers will judge this by) in '07 was Acura 1, Porsche 11

To date, it's been Acura 2, Porsche 4-a lot more even in my book. Also, it wasn't all that frequent that the Acura guys were even around in most races to hassle the Penske guys when it was cruch time, though '07 being Acura's first season probably had a lot to do with it, as well as luck often being on Penske's side.

This year, it seems that since Audi defeated them in a resounding fashion at St. Pete(#2 Audi dominant in qualifying and race), it seems that the momentum for Penske has started to slow. Granted, they won at SLC, but if things went right, Audi and Acura easlily could've stole that show.

I think that IMSA's rule changes have played into Acura's hands, and even Dyson have taken a few whacks at Penske, too-not damaging, but Penske knows they're there.

Penske's almost impeccable strategy has saved his Porsche's from defeat numerous times-first from Audi, then Acura. But everyone's gained, Audi can dominate them if they want to at most circuits, and Acura is now fully equal.

Not to go off topic too much, but could this be a sign of a lame duck period for Penske, or is Acura really on the attack to learn for their LMP1 program, or is it both or neither?

[HORNDAWG]

I'm sorry, neither of us would qualify as "outside observers" in the sense that is being used, would we?
And taking a while to repeat the debut win does not mean that "Acura started out slow compared to Porsche". As to the 'feel goods' about other marques...


L.P.

[Dead-Eye]

Originally Posted by chernaudi

Acura are running brake shrouds like what Audi and Peugeot have: http://auto-racing.speedtv.com/artic...mid-ohio-blog/

Hasn't Audi done away with them? I seem to remember reading something to that effect...could be wrong though.

[dxk1]

Originally Posted by chernaudi

But the final score(which most outside observers will judge this by) in '07 was Acura 1, Porsche 11

Last year was a lot like the year Affirmed beat Alydar in the three horse-racing tirple crown races by a nose in each race. Alydar could of won the triple crown if he had come along in another year. Last year, the Penskes were just amazing and dialed in perfectly for each race except Sebring. The Acuras made a spectacular debut and would have done quite well except for the fact that the Penske Porsches had a perfect year. That perfection will probably never be repeated.

DK

[HORNDAWG]

So it looks like someone thinks it will be an even split of teams in the ALMS in 09 with 2 in P-2 and 2 in P-1. So which teams will be moving to P-1, and will we still have the same 4 teams running Acura's next year? Also will the 2 teams that remain in P-2 expand to 2 car teams?
And some think that the program will expand even further by moving beyond just the ALMS. Does this just mean Le Mans in 09 or are they thinking that Acura will be on Continent for more than a single race?


L.P.

[WMUCarGuy]

Originally Posted by HORNDAWG

So it looks like someone thinks it will be an even split of teams in the ALMS in 09 with 2 in P-2 and 2 in P-1. So which teams will be moving to P-1, and will we still have the same 4 teams running Acura's next year? Also will the 2 teams that remain in P-2 expand to 2 car teams?
And some think that the program will expand even further by moving beyond just the ALMS. Does this just mean Le Mans in 09 or are they thinking that Acura will be on Continent for more than a single race?


L.P.

The more the better!

[HORNDAWG]

I would agree. Somewhat curious though if they do apply for Le Mans spots in 09 will the ACO grant them for P-2 (deserved in my book) or try for P-1 in the first year of competition in that class (not so sure if I think they would deserve it). And I think teams in the LMS next year would be great. And maybe a team in the Asian Le Mans series.

L.P.

[Dead-Eye]

A european operation would be great...they'd have to call it Honda though

[Mike_Wooshy]

Wasnt Acura due for a European Launch in 2009 so a tie up maybe ?

[HORNDAWG]

Not sure what the launch date is anymore. But if it is in 09' or 10' it would work as a pre-launch or launch campaign tie-in.


L.P.

[The Badger]

Honda had intended on a GT1 project for Le Mans in 2009 I think it was ..... with the demise of GT1 as we know it , maybe they have decided to go down the LMP1 route instead , as they already have the goodies ?

[dxk1]

Originally Posted by HORNDAWG

I would agree. Somewhat curious though if they do apply for Le Mans spots in 09 will the ACO grant them for P-2 (deserved in my book) or try for P-1 in the first year of competition in that class (not so sure if I think they would deserve it). And I think teams in the LMS next year would be great. And maybe a team in the Asian Le Mans series.

L.P.

While you are correct in your reasoning, hasn't the ACO encouraged new cars to apply and granted many applications for new cars? It seems that, based on Honda/Acura's record in P2 in the US a P1 effort at Le Mans would be encouraged by the ACO based on past precedent.

DK

[HORNDAWG]

Originally Posted by dxk1

While you are correct in your reasoning, hasn't the ACO encouraged new cars to apply and granted many applications for new cars? It seems that, based on Honda/Acura's record in P2 in the US a P1 effort at Le Mans would be encouraged by the ACO based on past precedent.

DK

Hmm, usually it seems to me that is to draw a mfg./team to the game. But we are not dealing with that here and add in the fact that the grid is pretty oversubscribed with applicants and of a fairly high quality at the moment (not all). Add in that there is a very good chance that an Acura will be invited as the P-2 rep from the ALMS, even if Penske wins. Unless Penske does win both Petit/championship and then Porsche decide they want to compete in a non overall winning class(which I highly doubt).


L.P.

[TWK]

The ACO will do anything required to get Honda/Acura on the Le Mans grid as soon as possible.

(I've heard they conducted a seance to get Dante's advice.)

[AU N EGL]

Originally Posted by TWK

The ACO will do anything required to get Honda/Acura on the Le Mans grid as soon as possible.

(I've heard they conducted a seance to get Dante's advice.)

Now that is powerful MoJo

[HORNDAWG]

Originally Posted by TWK

The ACO will do anything required to get Honda/Acura on the Le Mans grid as soon as possible.

(I've heard they conducted a seance to get Dante's advice.)

Hmm, I'd of thought the would have been trying to reach the Flautist of Hamelin!


L.P.

[joeb]

Does anybody think that Highcroft might be one of the P1 teams next year? On their website there are videos of Sharp talking and in one he says "....Duncon wants to elevate the team, whether thats next year or next race..." So I guess on a race by race basis, you can elevate your track position, but on the next year basis, the only place to elevate from P2 is P1. Or I guess they could just be talking about winning the P2 championship. Highcroft is arguably the most successful of the Acura teams, but for next year, who knows....

[HORNDAWG]

Originally Posted by joeb

Does anybody think that Highcroft might be one of the P1 teams next year? On their website there are videos of Sharp talking and in one he says "....Duncon wants to elevate the team, whether thats next year or next race..." So I guess on a race by race basis, you can elevate your track position, but on the next year basis, the only place to elevate from P2 is P1. Or I guess they could just be talking about winning the P2 championship. Highcroft is arguably the most successful of the Acura teams, but for next year, who knows....

Yes, But I am biased. If it is awarded on merit of performance then in my mind they are the leading candidate at this point!
But elevating the team could mean, just improving on driver exchanges etc.., being the team that is pursued every race rather than the one doing the chasing, moving to a two car team or as you mentioned being the class champion.


L.P.

[The Badger]

Originally Posted by joeb

Does anybody think that Highcroft might be one of the P1 teams next year ?

Considering that Highcroft were the first confirmed Acura team , and looking at the terrific job that they have done ..... I reckon they deserve it more than any of the other teams . GDF motorsports will probably get a LMP1 , cuz of the mans connections with Acura .

Love to see Brabs back in LMP1 again .....

[joeb]

I guess one thing I didn't take into consideration was if Duncon actually wants to be in P1. If he doesn't and Acura doesn't push him, I think he might be happy to just run at the top of P2. He does have experience in the top class though, so maybe he is itching to get back.

Also, I agree Badger, having Brabs be competing for overall wins sure would be fun to watch!

[AU N EGL]

Do you guys think Accura / Honda would have cars in BOTH P1 and P2 classes?

[HORNDAWG]

Originally Posted by AU N EGL

Do you guys think Accura / Honda would have cars in BOTH P1 and P2 classes?

Well, let me put that in a different light. There are 4 teams in P-2 and every one of them own the cars that they are racing, and there will probably only be 2 teams that move to P-1. What do you think Acura will do about the other two teams that own their cars? Which is the reasoning behind it seeming to me that there will be Acuras in both classes.


L.P.