Nissan LMP1 Discussion

[Adam43]

The fastest Nissan at Le Mans? (joke)

[Adam43]

Second fastest. Upgrade is on the way.

[Keycube]

This is the kind of sports-related p!ss-taking that hopefully everyone can agree is pretty funny.

[Adam43]

[J Jay]

It's a refreshing break from the last 30+ pages and I think everyone who has read even half a page of it has earned the right to laugh at those jokes.

Nevermind aiming for the factory cars, Rebellion, ByKolles, etc. - Nissan should be looking to match the number of laps the circular arguments have done in this thread. That would put at least one car on track come sunrise!

[TF110]

I watched their onboards for a good bit. They have no issue driving past gte's. Its their braking thats the problem. They seriously start to coast maybe 150m before the other lmp1's!

I was watching when Mardenborough's fast lap (3:37) and he would coast way before the blue 200m marker from the first chicane. His trap speed on that lap was 323.9kmh. Thats a real bright spot for this car. If they can get their braking together (the hybrid would surely help) they'd improve significantly. I cant see how they even do over 310 braking that early. Relying solely on the engine for acceleration, I guess they need to coast like theyre going downhill to save fuel. If they had the hybrid running, I bet they could get close to 350kmh.

[kvenom]

Bowlby sounds frustrated in this video.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2wuk2E7-hUk

[Keycube]

Originally Posted by TF110

I watched their onboards for a good bit...

Feels good to read something encouraging; thank you! Just read a nice interview with Darren Cox and his hackles certainly seemed to be up regarding those who claimed the program may be in disarray or not taking things seriously. Amidst all of the smiles and hyper-optimism from the team (which has been great), it was also nice to read some tough words from a man defending his "child". Not going to post it though; I don't want anything to come off as provocative, and I figure the people that want to feel good about the program will go and find it.

[skycafe]

Astonishing to me to dislike a racing effort based on the hubris of the team's PR efforts.

[Adam43]

Agreed.

Astonishing to get worked up about people saying a racing team isn't doing very well too.

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by skycafe

Astonishing to me to dislike a racing effort based on the hubris of the team's PR efforts.

I totally agree and find it ridiculous.

[Pandamasque]

Originally Posted by 908-HDI

So honestly answer me this: Why are you so mad at Nissan? Why do you care what they spewed in their PR?

I'm allergic to bullsh*t. And they do give a crap judging how they're now more defensive than Kolles
more bullsh*t alert http://www.crash.net/le-mans/news/21...struggles.html

Now, we know that other manufacturers have had their dramas. Everyone remembers the first time Audi came here; two different concepts of car, not sure which way they were going, doors falling off. Last year Porsche had their struggles, but we haven't hidden our problems. So that means everyone thinks that we are the only ones that have any problems

Seriously? I wonder why they didn't mention AMR-One because the 919 was competitive out of the box and that Audi finished on the podium on its debut.

"but we haven't hidden our problems"
What problems? Reading Cox's interviews is like listening to "Everything is Awesome".
When you say you're the most open team every 5 minutes it doesn't make you actually open and fan friendly, it makes you a liar.

[miatanut]

Originally Posted by TF110

I watched their onboards for a good bit. They have no issue driving past gte's. Its their braking thats the problem. They seriously start to coast maybe 150m before the other lmp1's!

I was watching when Mardenborough's fast lap (3:37) and he would coast way before the blue 200m marker from the first chicane. His trap speed on that lap was 323.9kmh. Thats a real bright spot for this car. If they can get their braking together (the hybrid would surely help) they'd improve significantly. I cant see how they even do over 310 braking that early. Relying solely on the engine for acceleration, I guess they need to coast like theyre going downhill to save fuel. If they had the hybrid running, I bet they could get close to 350kmh.

Interesting! Think that might be part of the 20 seconds?

They might be saving fuel, but they might also be saving brakes. When they redid the braking because they knew they weren't going to have the 8MJ car they originally thought they would have, maybe they redid it for 4MJ, or even 2MJ, but now they have 0MJ and the brakes have to do all the work. Maybe cooling issues? Even if they upgraded the cooling enough for the brakes to do all the work, that means now they have more drag than the original concept of the car had.

Lots of disconnects between the car as realized and as originally intended. Hopefully in the next few months they can close those disconnects.

[Adam43]

Originally Posted by Pandamasque

I'm allergic to bullsh*t ...

The point the post you quoted is trying to make is why eat so much bullsh*t, bathe in it, expose yourself to it, live it, get hung up on it, when you can simply just watch the racing, engineering and development. Surely that is more interesting to a sportscar fan than what Daz says?

I'd like to talk about the merits (or as I see it lack of at the moment) of the concept. However that's not really on.

[MoMedic9019]

Originally Posted by Pandamasque

I'm allergic to bullsh*t. And they do give a crap judging how they're now more defensive than Kolles
more bullsh*t alert http://www.crash.net/le-mans/news/21...struggles.html

so. You are allergic to yourself? Because you are full of it.

Seriously? I wonder why they didn't mention AMR-One because the 919 was competitive out of the box and that Audi finished on the podium on its debut.

imagine a world where you choose to copy everyone else, throw a tom of money at it, years of testing and development, and then debut the car... Nissan chose to be different. Get over yourself.

"but we haven't hidden our problems"
What problems? Reading Cox's interviews is like listening to "Everything is Awesome".
When you say you're the most open team every 5 minutes it doesn't make you actually open and fan friendly, it makes you a liar.

Did you ever stop to think that perhaps, their definition of "open" means you get more access than a typical LMP1 program?

Is sure as hell doesn't mean you get to know everything. So. Instead of being a useless troll. Bring something to the conversation.

[Adam43]

And that last post is just as bad.

[Akrapovic]

Originally Posted by skycafe

Astonishing to me to dislike a racing effort based on the hubris of the team's PR efforts.

Agree to an extent, but some of nissans PR has been fictional and criticised other teams. Whilst some say we should support the sport as a whole, some of nissans PR has not been doing this.


My problem is we don't seem to be allowed to criticise a car which is further behind the leaders than the AMR-One and the Lavaggi LS1 without being told to support innovation, or in some cases be told to shut up.


Whilst I support nissans attempt at bringing Motorsport to more homes (blancpain steams for example) and attempting to make it more accessible, I don't see why they should be immune to criticism where others were not.

[brakedisc]

I have really enjoyed this thread. I really cannot keep away from it and would like to make a contribution.

I have been designing and building racing cars for fun for over thirty years (fifteen different designs) and the knowledge gained in that time tells me there is no way this car is anything but a disaster. It was the same with the Deltawing. Hype against science. How can anyone say that the Nissan project has positives when they find themselves with a car that is so far off the pace and deficient in so many areas?

BB is trying to be different and fair play to him, he has got everyone talking about his last few projects, but until the laws of physics change he is not going to taste success. The poor boy is way out of his depth as he was at the now defunct Lola cars.

I have said it before and I will say it again, the whole Nissan project is like the "Emperors new clothes" you either see them or you do not.

The smart ones on here see through the hype.

[skycafe]

Originally Posted by Adam43

The point the post you quoted is trying to make is why eat so much bullsh*t, bathe in it, expose yourself to it, live it, get hung up on it, when you can simply just watch the racing, engineering and development. Surely that is more interesting to a sportscar fan than what Daz says?
.

Exactly. If you are bothered by the PR, ignore it. Why in the world would anyone become so invested in PR?

This project is interesting. It isn't working. The teams is having to create a puzzle that is lacking pieces. They are there. They got pretty far to even get there.

[FormulaFox]

Originally Posted by brakedisc

I have been designing and building racing cars for fun for over thirty years (fifteen different designs) and the knowledge gained in that time tells me there is no way this car is anything but a disaster.

Okay, simple question:

How EXACTLY is the idea of a front-engine AWD hybrid a disaster?

It was the same with the Deltawing. Hype against science.

And yet, the Delta Wing WORKS. It hit the exact performance marks Bowlby said it would. I have said before that it is NOT a coincidence that the Delta Wing did great in the hands of Bowlby and Nissan and then went to crap as soon as they left the equation. Elan/Panoz is simply NOT capable of developing a radical concept like that.

[joeb]

This thread has been closed until after Le Man's. Then the ***** fest can continue. I would like to enjoy the race and don't want to have to keep reading this. If you continue the same conversation in other threads don't be surprised to get an infraction.

[Adam43]

Good close. A shame, but good close.

After seeing it in action there is lots to talk about, but it is clear that it is impossible due to a few people. Crikey it's like primary school.
Friendly sportscar fans? Must be a lie.

[joeb]

Ok, it has now raced. We can make inferences and discussion on what we saw on track. I thought the team did better than I expected. I thought it would be a stretch to see them make the 6 hour mark, but damned if they weren't there at Sunrise. Of course the pace was lacking, but I think we all expected that. Their spirit of fixing the cars and sending them back out was pretty great to see from them. I hope they learned a lot and will be better prepared for next season. I don't know how much more development there will be during this season, but I hope they show up for the remaining rounds.

One piece I caught in a driver interview on RLM was that the driver (can't remember which one) said they are already working on the 2016 gearbox. I thought it was odd that they singled out the gearbox but it made me wonder if this was the part that was the trouble in mating the hybrid.

[FormulaFox]

Did about as well as I expected. They were able to run within two seconds of their qualifying times, but reliability left something to be desired. Though that's pretty common, to be honest - it's a first year program, you shouldn't expect it to be reliable out of the box.

Something else I realized while watching the race, though, is that Nissan has actually built a competitive LMP2 car. Or rather, what WOULD be a competitive LMP2 if it had been reliable. The engine is within P2 rules, close to P2 power output, and it posted lap times that were in the upper P2 range. If front engine/front drive is P2 legal and the car was meant to run P2, this would've been a great success(despite lack of victory).

[mikuni]

From what I saw it made me excited for the cars future potential. I have to admit, seeing the Porsche and Audi carving the Nissan up through the higher speed curves was striking in the speed differential, but just served as a reminder as to how much more development the Nissan needs.

It will be exciting to see the further growth of this car, and whether Nissan change anything significant, or are committed to deliver the original design.