Nissan LMP1 Discussion

[GasperG]

From my knowledge Turbo engine can be tuned to achieve absurd power, but efficiency goes down the drain. Also with direct injection you can get more power and torque but again you are running rich and efficiency goes down. This tricks can work very well in road cars as they are very rarely on the full throttle but in a race car with fuel flow restriction you apparently need a bigger engine to overcome that.

[cokata]

With a FI engine you trade combustion efficiency for reduced frictional losses. Even if you have some sort of super intercooler, the exhaust backpressure is always going to leave some amount of residual heat in the combustion chamber, forcing you to have smaller CR/ER, and/or running a richer mixture.

Toyota have done a mega job with their engine. No turbo, DI, high pressure fuel pump, intercoolers, etc. Their engine is much simpler and cheaper then all the others, and yet it achieved unheard of efficiency for a Petrol engine.

[Ephaeton]

Originally Posted by CyberMotor

I had replied that Marshall Pruett's photo of the rear of the Nissan LMP 1 reminded me of the old Nissan GTP and its huge tunnels.

Someone posted about what a tunnel looks like. I think the rear of the Nissan LMP1 is a huge wing with big a$$ tunnels.

I took the liberty of going into PhotoShop and modifying Marshall's photo to remove a couple of the items clouding the view. Here's the result after I removed the 'clutter'...

That's where the experience with this sort of packaging from the DW-line of cars seems to come in handy. You don't need to be worried for them in case of front vs. rear impact; anything piercing the inner hull from any direction will give them headaches Just hope one of their cars survives without it.

[GingerPixel]

Indeed. Mr Cox seemingly thinks Toyota are being uninventive using 'just a Super GT engine', but I think that is a little rich considering the Nissan has a boat anchor for a motor and Toyota are WEC champions.

[miatanut]

Originally Posted by Ephaeton

That's where the experience with this sort of packaging from the DW-line of cars seems to come in handy. You don't need to be worried for them in case of front vs. rear impact; anything piercing the inner hull from any direction will give them headaches Just hope one of their cars survives without it.

The ducts aren't tissue paper.

They are carbon fiber and will offer some (but not a lot) of resistance from side impacts before getting to the "real" car, which is pretty much the same as any single seater, except for not having a lot of oil coolers, control units, etc, which add nothing to side-impact crash protection, in the sidepods.

Oh, I guess that turns into an advantage, because the sides of the car contain nothing but air, and maybe they could throw some new bodywork on it and keep going where a single seater would be done for the day.

[cokata]

Some more info from the comment section in the Top Gear article.

- It's a single flywheel. They are not too worried about the gyroscopic effect (it is horizontally mounted so may even reduce body roll somewhat)

- The flywheel is connected with a 3speed clutched transmission, instead of CVT(efficiency?)

-They went for the bonnet exhaust exit because it was the shortest route (improved efficiency = more power), and are aware that it might cause trouble in the dark, working on improving that.

-The engine has ~550 lb/ft=745nm torque "the front driveshafts are the diameter of scaffolding poles"; 6500 rpm redline

-Equal length driveshafts in the front to deal with torque steer.

-65:35 weight distribution (should really be without RW for Le Mans if true)

[carbon_titanium]

65:35 weight distribution and FWD... porsche sector will be a nightmare...

[MyNameIsNigel]

Originally Posted by cokata

Some more info from the comment section in the Top Gear article.

- It's a single flywheel. They are not too worried about the gyroscopic effect (it is horizontally mounted so may even reduce body roll somewhat)

- The flywheel is connected with a 3speed clutched transmission, instead of CVT(efficiency?)

-They went for the bonnet exhaust exit because it was the shortest route (improved efficiency = more power), and are aware that it might cause trouble in the dark, working on improving that.

-The engine has ~550 lb/ft=745nm torque "the front driveshafts are the diameter of scaffolding poles"; 6500 rpm redline

-Equal length driveshafts in the front to deal with torque steer.

-65:35 weight distribution (should really be without RW for Le Mans if true)

That would be logical in that the flywheel is likely an evolution of Flybrid's patented CFT (Clutched-Flywheel-Transmission) as previously used by Hope Racing and Dyson Racing, which adopts three separate "clutched" gears.


Besides, I am still of the opinion that CVT transmissions are not permitted pursuant to Article 11.4.6 of the Technical regulations.

[wolfhound]

If you use a generator to drive an electric motor is that not a CVT transmission?

[MyNameIsNigel]

Originally Posted by wolfhound

If you use a generator to drive an electric motor is that not a CVT transmission?

I believe that the relevant provision (Art. 11.4.6) should be understood as being specifically directed to mechanical transmissions, especially since this provision is part of the provisions pertaining to gearboxes (Art. 11.4):

Continuously variable transmission systems are not permitted to transmit the power of the power unit defined in Articles 1.16 and 5.

[wolfhound]

Originally Posted by MyNameIsNigel

I believe that the relevant provision (Art. 11.4.6) should be understood as being specifically directed to mechanical transmissions, especially since this provision is part of the provisions pertaining to gearboxes (Art. 11.4):

Hmmmm the more rules in regulations, the more likely there is to be a great big loop hole.

[AFC-911]

Go Porsche!!!!!!!

[cokata]

Are there any pictures of the intercooler? From what i have seen it must be from the water-to-air variety.

[Articus]

Originally Posted by MyNameIsNigel

That would be logical in that the flywheel is likely an evolution of Flybrid's patented CFT (Clutched-Flywheel-Transmission) as previously used by Hope Racing and Dyson Racing, which adopts three separate "clutched" gears.


Besides, I am still of the opinion that CVT transmissions are not permitted pursuant to Article 11.4.6 of the Technical regulations.

Do we think that the KERS up and downshifting is linked to driver flappy paddles and the main transmission or on it's own speed logic (wouldn't that count as a semi-auto gearbox on recovery and release if so)?

[cokata]

Originally Posted by Articus

Do we think that the KERS up and downshifting is linked to driver flappy paddles and the main transmission or on it's own speed logic (wouldn't that count as a semi-auto gearbox on recovery and release if so)?

Ollie from top gear said it was all done by the ECU. The only driver inputs are throttle and brake, and the ECU does the rest

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by AFC-911

Go Porsche!!!!!!!

There's always one...

[TF110]

The car will be touted at the chicago auto show this thursday and friday with motoman tv, looks like a q&a session http://youtu.be/8E0u86I2fHE

[skeeskirrt]

I'm a little late in joining the party. Here's my quip for the evening. . .
How long before Panoz files another lawsuit against Nissan? He invented the front-engined LMP, right?

[skycafe]

I would say Ford/Zakspeed were around before the Panoz, and while not an LMP, a GTP would seem to fall into the same sort of bucket.

[skeeskirrt]

Noted. I was only joking because they already sued Nissan over the Zeod / Delta Wing. It seems like a logical progression

[miatanut]

Originally Posted by skeeskirrt

Noted. I was only joking because they already sued Nissan over the Zeod / Delta Wing. It seems like a logical progression

Well, I got the joke.

[MyNameIsNigel]

Originally Posted by Articus

Do we think that the KERS up and downshifting is linked to driver flappy paddles and the main transmission or on it's own speed logic (wouldn't that count as a semi-auto gearbox on recovery and release if so)?

I would indeed expect that the appropriate KERS gear is selected semi-automatically in dependence of speed and the actual ICE gear selected by the driver, and with a view to achieve optimum transmission efficiency. Considering that the ICE's gearbox is reported to be a five-gear transmission, we are in effect talking about fifteen possible gear selection combinations between flywheel and front wheels. Coupling of the KERS and selection of the appropriate KERS gear evidently has to be controlled by some ECU as this cannot be left to the driver.

[mikuni]

Not to mention under heavy breaking and energy harnessing, the flywheels are spooling up at 19,000rpm/s, through 3 gears up to a maximum of 60,000rpm. So, under breaking a lot would be going on, between up changing the flywheel gear set, and changing down through the gears for the ICE. It has got to be managed by a computer.

[miatanut]

Why can't they just allow CVT? Even for the main transmission. Development of energy efficient CVT's would be worthy thing for WEC to encourage.

[cokata]

Originally Posted by miatanut

Why can't they just allow CVT? Even for the main transmission. Development of energy efficient CVT's would be worthy thing for WEC to encourage.

They can make an otherwise great sounding engine super annoying due to the constant RPM.