Your thoughs: Rules/Regulation/Race Operation Changes for 05

[Snrub]

Since we're almost through the 2004 season, what rules/regulation/generally how CC puts on a race would you like to see changed for 2005? For example, I think we can all agree that we can't have a repeat of the yellow laps in Vegas, but how? Personally I don't like the new points system. It hasn't effected things all that much, but I hate the "cruise for the championship" mentality.

I realize we've had similar threads in the past when we thought 2005 would be a year where everything was overhauled, but I think we can now look at it differently.

[Kicking-back]

With an 18 to 20 car field, I'd switch to the F1 points system, 10-8-6-5-4-3-2-1.

I'd also scrap pit windows - you can stop for fuel as and when you like.

I'd also make an effort to keep FCYs on road courses to a minimum.

[Hazza]

No Pit Windows =

And not for road races, for everything. And make sure they stick by it, none of this mid series rule changing buisness, my small head can't keep up to date with it.

Also maybe ford could engineer on a Boost knob, then we'd realy be back in the hey day 90s. I'm not saying that it'd make greater racing, but i'd just be cool.

If the Three Amigos realy don't like the idea of no pit windows on ovals, they could try the whole "Pits closed 'cept for the 'green flag this time by' lap" idea.

Also maybe they should solidify the set up and keep the one set up for Street/Oval/Speedway. And while they at it, bump up the drag on the rear wing to get drafting going on.

And mandate a car for CDM and his "voice of leather" as James Allan put it.

Thats all for me!

[macdaddy]

Excellent thread, Snrub! But now what are we gonna talk about during the offseason?

We'll think of something, I'm sure...

But to address your question, I'd scrap anything "mandatory" about pit windows. This was an idea that looked really good on paper, but it's obvious that the fans aren't agreeing with it.

"The Buck Stops Here" should be made applicable to the Vegas caution and somebody's got to take the blame for that. This was ChampCar's long-awaited opportunity to reach out to a new market and somebody blew it. That "somebody" shouldn't have the same opportunity next year. I simply cannot believe that the stewards hadn't discussed that scenerio the same day that the rules were released. I mean "C'mon now!" - we discussed it here for crying out loud!

Keep P2P. Even increase the time limits.

Rid the "avoidable contact" rule as it is now written. This hinders the racing, exactly the opposite of what they're trying to accomplish.

Work diligently at landing some oval contracts. I know that it's easier said than done, and that many of you disagree, but let's get back to the diversity.

Having said that, don't look at Vegas as a failure simply because it was an oval. It was really late at night (esp for travellers), there was too long a gap between events, the caution period which has already been addressed... LVMS could be successful if done differently.

Adopt F1's habit of clearing parked cars on roadcourses. How much could it possibly cost to rent a dozen MiJacks for the weekend?

Make the concession stands cut their beer prices by 50%

[macdaddy]

...I added that last part simply out of greed...

But I'd like to add this re: mandated stops...
I feel that the lack of a fuel adjustment knob should, in itself, eliminate mandated pitstops. The drivers are unable to "turn down the mixture" - they're supposed to be running near-rich all the time, all cars equal. Add in the fact that it's a spec-engine, and it appears to me that things are not the same today as they were a few years ago. The days of Mario's Grandson's Father winning in Toronto by the virtue of 65 pitstops could not happen under the current situation. So let's dump the mandatories, eh?

[LadyRaceFan]

Originally posted by macdaddy
...The days of Mario's Grandson's Father winning in Toronto by the virtue of 65 pitstops could not happen under the current situation. So let's dump the mandatories, eh?

Nice wording macdaddy

[JohnSSC]

CC needs to get more "professional" if you will in the steward department. Kneifel can't make a decison to save his life and it is not usually a good one. They need someone who is experienced, balanced and thoughtful for the job. Rick Mears would be perfect.

I agree with losing the "pit window" thing. The more they try to manipulate the strategy the worse the racing gets.

Nice wording macdaddy, but before the Michael bashing begins PT for example is nowhere near Michael as far as wins and laps led. Michael's success wasn't all pit strategy. He was a pretty doggone good driver in his day. When he was on PT and company (no offense) couldn't hold his helmet bag.

I know he is an easy target because of personality/business issues but in his prime he was top-notch. In fact I would love to see a matchup of he and Little Al on their best days vs Emmo and Nigel on their best...

but that is food for another thread!


Rant over!

[racerkeke]

The only problem with trying to get Rick Mears as a steward is that he doesn't want to be one. He was asked before Wally retired (the first time) and said no. He has been asked since then, and always says no. So unless conscription is legal I don't think we're going to see it.

To tell the truth I cannot see anyone wanting to be chief steward. It's gotta be like trying to herd cats -- cats who call you "clown" and other less-savoury names off-camera. Which makes it less likely that who you do get is the one you really want in the job.

keke
-with a soft spot in my heart for Wally-

[macdaddy]

John, in no way was I suggesting that MGF's success was entirely the result of strategies. I was simply using his Toronto race as an example of why the mandatory windows looked so good on paper.

[JohnSSC]

macdaddy: got it!

Thanks for the clarification!

[macdaddy]

Expand/or/Contract the schedule so as to avoid these long breaks in-between events, both at the beginning and end of the season.

[brightline]

(road course)

Mandatory Stops

If mandatory stops stay, I like the current (latest) iteration of the rules with one mandatory stop. It allows for strategy, but if CC officials do there homework correctly, it eliminates fuel conservation races.

Push-to-Pass

I also would love to see the P2P increase to 75 seconds at all tracks. It more or less eliminates push-to-block. Also make it visible for the fans on the colling or sidepods to see when drivers have it engaged (similar to the ALMS light system).

(Ovals)

Mandatory Stops

??? I'm torn about the fuel window because it keeps everyone pretty honest and eliminates fuel conservation runs. However, too much is decided in the pits, it also makes yellows extremely boring (luckily very fiew incidents this year on ovals).

(General)

Car Numbers

Car numbers are entirely too small. Sure just about everyone in this forum knows that the Pacificare car is Bruno, but the average fan doesn't. This was evident at Vegas. There were NASCAR fans in front of us that enjoyed the race thoroughly, but they didn't know who was who. The scoreboard Clearly illuminates:
1.2
2.6
3.55
but you can't tell from the grandstands who they are on the oval. Reading those tiny numbers is tough enough, but telling apart matching cars such as Forsythe or Herdez was pretty damn tough and I'm a 25 years old with 20/20 vision and had a grasp of the competion and the drivers involved. Casual fans or potential fans most likely are lost telling cars apart based on the car number.

Option tire

I like this option. However I thought it could have been utilized differently. Rather than mandate that one or two sets are used during the race, just gives teams equal quantities and use as needed during the weekend. Too many silly ever changing requirements confuse casual fans.

This was/is a perfect opportunity for Bridgestone!!!!
Rather than call them blacks and reds call them different Bridgestone brand names!!!! The blacks could be the Turanza and the quicker special reds are the faster Potenzas or whatever. Bridgestone guys I know your reading and your missing the boat. Possibly even incorporating the red sidewall into consumer products, I think the red sidewalls are hot stuff. This creates some inter-brand competition and gets bridgestones name out more.

Television

more improvement needed. They know this. Hopefully they're working on it. At least it got better as the season progressed.

Ford-Cosworth

Hoping for the best, learned unfortunately to expect the worst. At least we know Ford is happy in Champcar, but will it continue?

Dangerous Curves

Would work better if it proceeded the race kind of like the NFL pregame show. Would definitely gain viewers on both ends. ON race weekends it could always end with Stay tuned for the Grand Prix of "blah," coming up next on "blah."

Thats all I can think of for now, but seriously Bridgestone is missing out on this one.


edited to fix html...it's late, time for bed

[rustyfan]

Very good points there Brightline.

[D.R.T.]

Good points on the current point system. Its ****e. However championships all over the world currently are having brain explosions when it comes to point systems, with Nascar at the top. I'd go back to the 1 point for pole, 1 point fastest lap, 1st 20, 2nd 16, 3rd 14 ect.

Mandatory pitting laps gone. I dont mind the current, you must pit once between laps whatever, that has worked okay. The pit rules early on in the year like at Road America were a bit ridiculous.

[LadyRaceFan]

Originally posted by brightline
(road course)



Dangerous Curves

Would work better if it proceeded the race kind of like the NFL pregame show. Would definitely gain viewers on both ends. ON race weekends it could always end with Stay tuned for the Grand Prix of "blah," coming up next on "blah."

Thats all I can think of for now, but seriously Bridgestone is missing out on this one.


edited to fix html...it's late, time for bed

Speaking of Dangerous Curves. Since this is Spike show will it be shown on CBS or Speed when the series changes it's television package? And I too think it should come on just before the race it could add so much to the show.

[Flatspot]

* Trash can Chris Kneifel, "circus clown" was too kind.
* Forget the mandatory stops.
* Keep the option tire but possibly only one set.
* Start a new tire war.
* Minimum of 90 seconds of push to pass
* Run speedway setups on the speedway with the Hanford device. Make lifting a mandatory skill.
* Do everything possible to keep the natural road courses.
* Add another oval.
* Free beer for spectators

[Hazza]

I like the idea of giving them the regular and sticky tyre - that ones a keeper!

Maybe push to pass should be scrapped and the boost knob bought back in, then you have the ability to pump the power and get by someone but with out the "novelty toy" so as to speak. Don't go down the F1 track of trying to spice up product so hard that you loose site of the fact the meats not cooked.

[macdaddy]

Hazza, the LAST thing I want is for the driver to be able to control fuel consumption via any knob. This is why, when we get new manufacturers, I think it important to have a spec-ECU. This is also why people felt the need to introduce mandatory windows in the first place.

[codename_47]

One thing I'd like them to address is the sometimes downright shoddy rolling starts over the last couple of years.

Either ensure the field is completely bunched together like "the good old days" or chuck in a couple of standing starts...that'll show them how to bunch up!

[JohnSSC]

"Shoddy" is not the word for them. They should be embarassed to even call them starts.

There needs to be an infusion of folks who can perform race control functions. Most Showroom Stock races have more orderly starts.

If the point of the rules is to have all cars on an equal footing, should not the starts be more even as well?

[brightline]

on the subject of poor starts I always wondered why Champ Car has never used a set acceleration point, such as a line or cone. It does work for NASCAR and IRL. They'll have a predetermined point at or past turn 4, where as the Champ Cars were hitting race speed going into turn 3 on restarts. Road Courses has been as bad if not worse.

[Omega99]

Good call, Brightline.

And I agree with most of Flatspot's ideas, but a tire war would liely drive up costs that can't be afforded just yet. In a couple of years though, it'd be just what the doctor ordered.

[JohnSSC]

You can stay with one manufacturer of tires - just have Bridgestone present a sticky and a "hard" compound for each race and let the teams decide which they will use.

Teams would declare before the race which compound they want. It would add an element of strategy particularly if you dump the pit windows.

[racerkeke]

CART, and now Champ, *does* and always did use an acceleration cone. It's just not always visible on TV. There is usually a cone for the start, and there may be a different cone for re-starts (Mid-O had two, and I believe there were other road courses that did as well).

It's one of the interesting parts about working comm at the last few turns before start-finish, calling thru whether the pack is strung out or bunched. One of the main things that the starter wants to know is "how many rows", because unless we have at least two rows in line they will have to wave off.

I believe the ragged starts are almost an over-reaction to the multiple wave-offs we experienced in 2000-2002. There was a lot of whining about how it made CART look bad on TV ("See, they can't even start the race...") so they loosened up -- in my opinion, over-much -- on those beautiful starts and re-starts. I miss them too, especially after watching two Star Mazda races on tape yesterday in which the starts were PERFECTLY lined up. Of course, it all went to hell in a handcart right after that but hey, you can't have everything.... :-)

keke