US Grand Prix- Austin (USA) - Page 5

wnut · 27 May 2010, 05:09 (Ref:2699001)

does Tilke write the sporting and technical regulations as well, because they are about as good as his tracks?
Bet you Laguna is a better track than this next plastic mess bad luck Austin!

Porta loos are cheap and plentiful and for 1 day well ....

Quintin03 · 27 May 2010, 05:16 (Ref:2699003)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tall Chris

We all think we could do better than the Tilke Group circuit wise, but we just might not know how many toilets etc, a crowd of 100,000 people need

Ever seen the MyTracks section of the forum?

johntt · 27 May 2010, 06:18 (Ref:2699015)

Quote:

Originally Posted by wnut

does Tilke write the sporting and technical regulations as well, because they are about as good as his tracks?
Bet you Laguna is a better track than this next plastic mess bad luck Austin!

Porta loos are cheap and plentiful and for 1 day well ....

Tilke doesn't write the regs, but he has to follow them.

If the rules weren't so restrictive then we'd see some better tracks from him (this is a guy who races on the Nordschliefe in his spare time).

wnut · 27 May 2010, 07:21 (Ref:2699035)

Quote:

Originally Posted by johntt

Tilke doesn't write the regs, but he has to follow them.

If the rules weren't so restrictive then we'd see some better tracks from him (this is a guy who races on the Nordschliefe in his spare time).

Well he wouldn't want to spend any time on one of his tracks would he!

Andy77 · 27 May 2010, 08:02 (Ref:2699057)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tall Chris

...
We all think we could do better than the Tilke Group circuit wise, but we just might not know how many toilets etc, a crowd of 100,000 people need

We have european wide standards for public buildings/arenas and stuff. If it isn't covered european wide then there are usually national standards in use. I bet it is similar in the US. However, actually it isn't the architect who needs to know about them standards. This is the supply engineers and technicians job.
In easy words : the architect draws something up and the supply engineers and technicians have to make fit their trade into architects draw.

Quote:

Originally Posted by johntt

Tilke doesn't write the regs, but he has to follow them. If the rules weren't so restrictive then we'd see some better tracks from him (this is a guy who races on the Nordschliefe in his spare time).

LoL .... Here in Germany we got something that says "Please don't let Tilke even close to the Nordschleife. We'd end up with a 20 squarekilometer wide and plain skidpad where are some lines painted to the tarmac in order to show the circuit." Ironically, the saying is older than his trunk lorry parking lot style circuits.

Yannick · 27 May 2010, 08:06 (Ref:2699062)

Why Tilke? The USGP circuit must be designed in a way in which US fans will like it. The track and facilities must be designed in a way that makes spectators feel at home. Tilke's past track designs were mostly meant for governments as a prestigious project to show off their capabilities and hence were bordering on the megalomanic (Sakhir, Shanghai, Yas Marina, Singapore and Valencia Marina to some extent as well).
I don't think US fans would like that approach to a sports facility. So Mr Tilke, please think different this time around.

Birddog07 · 27 May 2010, 08:42 (Ref:2699077)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tall Chris

Whilst we all bemoan another Tilke track, the vast majority of the time and expense of a new track is ironically not the track itself. From access roads to grandstands to hospitality suites via car park space sizes to the number of permanent food vendors there's a hell of a lot to do apart from the design of the track itself.
We all think we could do better than the Tilke Group circuit wise, but we just might not know how many toilets etc, a crowd of 100,000 people need

Why Tilke may be the best and most qualified architect for the job, he sure as hell doesn't know how to design a good circuit. The thing that matters most.

Then again, some of his most recent works I've liked and they have provided good racing, Abu Dhabi and Silverstone arena.

I don't think he can design a track that meets F1 standards and is 'Classic American Road Course' enough. Barber is a T1 circuit, which means F1 cars can test their, and with a few track mods (extension) and facilitys, they could very well race there. Barber is very much a 'Classic American Circuit' even in it's modern age. Now the track might not nessecary suck, Abu Dhabi and the new Silverstone arena have had pretty good GT races, but I just don't think he can capture the American feel. I don't know the relitave topography of Auston, but the track is being built on farmland which is usually flatish. If the guy has any sense, he will do nothing to the terrain.

ECW Dan Selby · 27 May 2010, 09:13 (Ref:2699089)

Tilke had nothing to do with the new Silverstone arena section.

I think it'd be really cool if he took some of the best corners from some of the classic US tracks and integrated them in to this, with a few of his own turns. Would never happen, but still

I made a suggestion on F1 Fanatic:

Why not have Tilke design 2/3 different options for the track, and let people vote for their favourite on the Formula 1 website?

Better still, 3 different designer's designs..

Selby

Sodemo · 27 May 2010, 11:48 (Ref:2699165)

The natural terrain around the Istanbul Park was green fields and forrests, but that was all levelled and we now have massive tarmac and loads of sandy looking spectator bankings.

I wonder if Simon Gillett is involved in this track venture?

AndyS · 27 May 2010, 12:04 (Ref:2699178)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Birddog07

I just don't think he can capture the American feel.

He can't capture the feel of a European style track let alone an American style venue. When is he going to realise that his circuits do not improve the racing, as they are always touted and they lack any kind of character and atmosphere and quite frankly leave you cold or asleep! Harsh I know but I think fair. As has been pointed out he wasn't involved in Silverstone. Just one glimmer of hope, I caught some racing from the Aragon Raceway Spain a few weeks ago, I think it was Formula Renault but not sure. I believe this is a Tilke Track and (I can't quite believe I'm going to say this) I thought the track seemed reasonable, bit too many slow corners but otherwise not too bad. A lot of the infrasturcture wasn't yet in, so there's still time to make it characterless but maybe he has learnt something and been listening, here's hoping because I think he's going to be around for a while yet.

**bjohnsonsmith** · 27 May 2010, 12:19 (Ref:2699185)

Quote:

Originally Posted by wnut

does Tilke write the sporting and technical regulations as well, because they are about as good as his tracks?
Bet you Laguna is a better track than this next plastic mess bad luck Austin!

Porta loos are cheap and plentiful and for 1 day well ....

Laguna Seca is fantastic. I don't want to see Bernie or Tilke anywhere near it.

If Tilke must build the track I'd like to see him build an oval for F1.

ECW Dan Selby · 27 May 2010, 12:22 (Ref:2699190)

Quote:

Originally Posted by bjohnsonsmith

Laguna Seca is fantastic. I don't want to see Bernie or Tilke anywhere near it.

If Tilke must build the track I'd like to see him build an oval for F1.

If he were to do that, i'd like a small kink in it. There was an old oval that used to have a kidney shape to it. It was mentioned in the classic Indy game they've recently released, but I can't remember for the life of me the name of the track.

I just think a pure oval is a Indy/Nascar thing, it'd be nice to just chuck a corner on to one of the straights.

Selby

Andy77 · 27 May 2010, 12:32 (Ref:2699197)

Quote:

Originally Posted by ECW Dan Selby

If he were to do that, i'd like a small kink in it. There was an old oval that used to have a kidney shape to it. It was mentioned in the classic Indy game they've recently released, but I can't remember for the life of me the name of the track.

I just think a pure oval is a Indy/Nascar thing, it'd be nice to just chuck a corner on to one of the straights.

Selby

I seem to remember the kidney shaped one from GPL. Either argentinian or canadian I think. Other than that Sitges-Terramar had a very slight kidney shape

**bjohnsonsmith** · 27 May 2010, 12:33 (Ref:2699198)

Quote:

Originally Posted by ECW Dan Selby

If he were to do that, i'd like a small kink in it. There was an old oval that used to have a kidney shape to it. It was mentioned in the classic Indy game they've recently released, but I can't remember for the life of me the name of the track.

I just think a pure oval is a Indy/Nascar thing, it'd be nice to just chuck a corner on to one of the straights.

Selby

Brooklands had a similar shape. Which game is that?

I know what you mean about ovals being a Indy/Nascar thing but I would just like to see a GP on an oval.

wnut · 27 May 2010, 12:36 (Ref:2699199)

Quote:

Originally Posted by bjohnsonsmith

Laguna Seca is fantastic. I don't want to see Bernie or Tilke anywhere near it.

If Tilke must build the track I'd like to see him build an oval for F1.

I agree Laguna is fanastic!
US should only agree to a GP if Tilke is not allowed on the continent>

Like the Oval idea.

JeremySmith · 27 May 2010, 12:40 (Ref:2699203)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dutton

What is the Austin area topography? Is there any hope of having a layout, at least to some extent, dictated by the landscape? If it is all flat, then I can only assume we are going to get a tremendously uninspiring tarmac-fest.

Very hilly Dutton...

**bjohnsonsmith** · 27 May 2010, 12:41 (Ref:2699204)

Quote:

Originally Posted by wnut

I agree Laguna is fanastic!
US should only agree to a GP if Tilke is not allowed on the continent>

Like the Oval idea.

I don't see what the problem is with a GP on an oval, it would add another dimension to F1 and another style of driving. The only reason I still watch Indy Cars is the variety of tracks they race on.

AUTOLEGEND · 27 May 2010, 12:43 (Ref:2699210)

The aero on F1 cars doesn't work on ovals.

Anyways, as far as I'm concerned, if Tilke designs this track then it will produce horrible racing and be more of an amusement park then a track.

JeremySmith · 27 May 2010, 12:44 (Ref:2699211)

Quote:

Originally Posted by bjohnsonsmith

I don't see what the problem is with a GP on an oval, it would add another dimension to F1 and another style of driving. The only reason I still watch Indy Cars is the variety of tracks they race on.

Then it should stay at Indianapolis Motor Speedway...

**bjohnsonsmith** · 27 May 2010, 12:49 (Ref:2699215)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Motominded

The aero on F1 cars doesn't work on ovals.

Anyways, as far as I'm concerned, if Tilke designs this track then it will produce horrible racing and be more of an amusement park then a track.

They'd have to have a different setup for ovals just like Indy Cars do.

fieldodreams79 · 27 May 2010, 12:51 (Ref:2699218)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dutton

What is the Austin area topography? Is there any hope of having a layout, at least to some extent, dictated by the landscape? If it is all flat, then I can only assume we are going to get a tremendously uninspiring tarmac-fest.

i too hope that we have no asphault wasteland and having never been to Austin, I looked for a map for possible location and topography.

Austin Topo Map 1955

it is a bit hillier that i thought it would be and since the map is from 1955, it won't show the actual current limits of development However, it does give a good idea of the lay of the land. Contour interval is 10 feet; the highest point in the area, best i can tell, is Mount Larson at 1000 ft ASL in elevation, at the most. it is located across the Colorado River/Lake Austin from downtown Austin (left side of map), this area looks like Nat'l Forrest Land (Green shading usually denotes that but there is no label for it). Most likely, this area will not be used for the location of the circuit. On the other side is an airport.

and JeremySmith may be able to add more to this, being a resident, or so he claims.

AUTOLEGEND · 27 May 2010, 12:59 (Ref:2699224)

Quote:

Originally Posted by bjohnsonsmith

They'd have to have a different setup for ovals just like Indy Cars do.

Paying the cost for a Monaco steering rack is about a 1/100 fraction of what it will cost to do F1 aero development.

Last i checked F1 needs to find ways to cut costs and aero development is now the #1 point of spending since the engines are better than they used to be.

wnut · 27 May 2010, 13:05 (Ref:2699229)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Motominded

The aero on F1 cars doesn't work on ovals.

Anyways, as far as I'm concerned, if Tilke designs this track then it will produce horrible racing and be more of an amusement park then a track.

Lets face it F1 aero doesn't work in racing if an oval will change that then we definitely want an oval!

**bjohnsonsmith** · 27 May 2010, 13:08 (Ref:2699230)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Motominded

Paying the cost for a Monaco steering rack is about a 1/100 fraction of what it will cost to do F1 aero development.

Last i checked F1 needs to find ways to cut costs and aero development is now the #1 point of spending since the engines are better than they used to be.

Indeed, however if F1 were ever to race on an oval I would hope the FIA would be aware of the need for a different aero package and adjust the team budget accordingly. In reality though, there won't be a GP on an oval.

AUTOLEGEND · 27 May 2010, 13:13 (Ref:2699233)

Quote:

Originally Posted by bjohnsonsmith

Indeed, however if F1 were ever to race on an oval I would hope the FIA would be aware of the need for a different aero package and adjust the team budget accordingly. In reality though, there won't be a GP on an oval.

The Indy 500 was an official F1 race in the 50's and counted for points. But, oval racing isn't what F1 wanted then or needs today.

More importantly, the cars are not designed for it. I can remember the havoc on tires the Indy banking did.

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