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Old 5 Jan 2007, 18:19 (Ref:1807688)   #26
duke_toaster
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duke_toaster should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridduke_toaster should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
2 hours isn't a problem for me (but I do prefer 3 hours) ... but the brakes limit is plain dangerous IMO.
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Old 5 Jan 2007, 18:38 (Ref:1807701)   #27
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canam should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridcanam should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Two sets of carbon discs should be enough--but only just. Keep in mind that teams were doing Spa 24 on one set of steel rotors (with a change of pads). Yes, at the end of the race they were scrap, but carbon will last much longer.
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Old 5 Jan 2007, 18:54 (Ref:1807705)   #28
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HORNDAWG should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridHORNDAWG should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridHORNDAWG should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
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Originally Posted by Go_For_Pole
DTM also has restrictions like this especially as to engines and the racing doesn't suffer at all.

I am asking for the teams opinion because from what I have been reading a few weeks back in Autosport the teams were in favour of cost cutting changes and also demanded no flyaway races at all. Apparently Zhuhai had to be kept on the schedule due to their firm contract with SRO. Logic suggests that the cost cutting changes would have been decided between Ratel and the teams before being submited to the FIA for approval.
As I am not up on DTM technical rules maybe you could further my knowledge. From all I can ascertain the limiting factors in DTM are 1) 3 sealed engines per season @470hp 2) 18 tires per event per car 3) gear box(2 suppliers), brakes(rotor,pads,caliper) and electronics are supplied by specific suppliers, with no limit to how many, that I found.

Now if that is the case. One could easily build an engine(x3) that would be reliable throughout the season! But this in no way is the same as the rule changes that FIA has. To use the DTM as an example is not a true comparison for the rules that FIA is enacting!!

L.P.
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Old 5 Jan 2007, 19:58 (Ref:1807722)   #29
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AU N EGL should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridAU N EGL should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
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Originally Posted by duke_toaster
2 hours isn't a problem for me (but I do prefer 3 hours) ... but the brakes limit is plain dangerous IMO.
I agree
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Old 5 Jan 2007, 22:03 (Ref:1807792)   #30
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Originally Posted by HORNDAWG
One could easily build an engine(x3) that would be reliable throughout the season! But this in no way is the same as the rule changes that FIA has. To use the DTM as an example is not a true comparison for the rules that FIA is enacting!
Help with this because I am lost. Engine rules are similar between the two, gearbox & ratios not a problem according to the first post, so the only gripe is brakes, right?
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Old 5 Jan 2007, 22:40 (Ref:1807822)   #31
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HORNDAWG should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridHORNDAWG should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridHORNDAWG should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
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Originally Posted by Go_For_Pole
Help with this because I am lost. Engine rules are similar between the two, gearbox & ratios not a problem according to the first post, so the only gripe is brakes, right?
And brakes are not an issue?? Brakes do not dictate how fast you can run, or if you run at all? Yes to compare going fast and having all the brake you want. To going fast and having less braking ability, is not a fair example of comparative performance.

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Old 6 Jan 2007, 01:34 (Ref:1807901)   #32
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The359 should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Are there going to be special rules for Spa then?
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Old 6 Jan 2007, 08:58 (Ref:1807994)   #33
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The only difference for the technical rules for Spa relate to tyres - nothing on engines or brakes
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Old 6 Jan 2007, 09:06 (Ref:1807999)   #34
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The359 should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
So not only do you have to build an engine to last 3 races, but you also have to build an engine that can survive 24 Hours of Spa plus two other races?
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Old 6 Jan 2007, 13:34 (Ref:1808174)   #35
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AU N EGL should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridAU N EGL should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
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Originally Posted by The359
So not only do you have to build an engine to last 3 races, but you also have to build an engine that can survive 24 Hours of Spa plus two other races?
That is basicly it. The engines are sealed by the FIA technical ppl

If you use a 4th engine the team gets a 2 min stop and go penelty each race
a 5th engine, team gets a 3 min stop and go penelty each race
a 6th engine, 4 min stop and go each race
7th engine, DQ for the remander of the season.
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Old 7 Jan 2007, 02:23 (Ref:1808631)   #36
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HORNDAWG should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridHORNDAWG should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridHORNDAWG should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
I wonder if the rules change was a contributing factor for Racing Box getting into the Oreca / Saleen S7R and LMS this year?
http://www.racingbox.it/en/contenuto...hp?id_news=129

L.P.
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Old 7 Jan 2007, 02:36 (Ref:1808634)   #37
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Satorian has a lot of promise if they can keep it on the circuit!
Is anyone here solidly informed enough to make a list of teams moving from FIA GT to LMS? I am under the impression that there had been at least two more teams, but I'm not that well informed and forget many details.

So, pitch in, guys.
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Old 7 Jan 2007, 06:45 (Ref:1808665)   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HORNDAWG
I wonder if the rules change was a contributing factor for Racing Box getting into the Oreca / Saleen S7R and LMS this year?
http://www.racingbox.it/en/contenuto...hp?id_news=129

L.P.
The GT1 class has now been dropped from the Italian GT championship which limits where they can race with an MC12.
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Old 7 Jan 2007, 06:52 (Ref:1808666)   #39
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Satorian has a lot of promise if they can keep it on the circuit!
HORNDAWG's point might have been that it might have been easier to take the MC12 into the FIA GT then, yet they didn't.
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Old 7 Jan 2007, 12:10 (Ref:1808761)   #40
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Bramzel should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridBramzel should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridBramzel should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
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Originally Posted by Satorian
Success is a matter of definition and benchmark. We could be worlds apart on what we consider successful.
Although that is true, it must be said that the Int. Open GT and GT3 are apparently doing something right, that the other champs aren't. GT3 has had over 40 entries each race, and Int. Open GT's have seen huge startfields as well, up to around 60 cars for the last race. In my opinion that classifies as success. LMS doesn't even have close to 60 cars, and that's spread over 4 classes.
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Old 7 Jan 2007, 19:08 (Ref:1808982)   #41
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Satorian has a lot of promise if they can keep it on the circuit!
I think success is when you achieve what you set out to do. If that is the case for Open GT and GT3, and it seems that way, then everything's great for them.

But if the FIA GT set out to be an quasi-endurance racing series and then has to compromise along the way to a shorter format, then it is not a success anymore. The new format might be more successful in terms of retaining teams and a following and perhaps securing better TV deals than without a change, but at the same time it is not the FIA GT anymore. The question is how much something can be compromised before it loses it initial and intended identity.
I'm less inclined to attend and follow the new FIA GT (except a visit to Spa), while I'm planning to attend the LMS events at Spa and Nürburgring

On a side note, I wish GT3 had proper TV coverage. I'd love to see the races in full with pit coverage and pre-race shows. In my opinion GT3 is one of the most exciting things to happen in a while (even if it's currently at risk to become somewhat of a corporate victim), as I immediately stated on RSC on several occasions as soon as the series was announced, and find the lack of pan-european coverage rather disappointing.
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Old 8 Jan 2007, 10:19 (Ref:1809409)   #42
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old man should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridold man should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridold man should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
If you make GT1 a poor class then you can drop it for lack of support, promote GT2 to the front and add GT3 to make up the field, this is where I came in I think!
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Old 8 Jan 2007, 10:21 (Ref:1809411)   #43
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If you make GT1 a poor class then you can drop it for lack of support, promote GT2 to the front and add GT3 to make up the field, this is where I came in I think!
......and I'd agree with you.
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Old 9 Jan 2007, 17:45 (Ref:1810575)   #44
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Originally Posted by Bramzel
LMS doesn't even have close to 60 cars, and that's spread over 4 classes.
A LMS series with 60 entrants would have nowhere to race as no circuit simply has enough garages to cope, not even Le Mans!
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Old 9 Jan 2007, 18:33 (Ref:1810609)   #45
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AU N EGL should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridAU N EGL should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
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If you make GT1 a poor class then you can drop it for lack of support, promote GT2 to the front and add GT3 to make up the field, this is where I came in I think!
Nawww. Take the restictors off the GT2 cars so they can race with the GT1 cars.
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Old 9 Jan 2007, 19:31 (Ref:1810643)   #46
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Sounds good to me. GT1 cars are fantastic, but unnecessarilly complex. I've got a bit sick of reading how unlike their road counterparts they are. Seems a bit pointless really. GT2s with more power (and maybe two classes based on engine size - 4 litres/8 litres?) would be much better IMO. After all, most people couldn't really tell a GT1 and a GT2 apart unless they knew what they were looking at.
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Old 9 Jan 2007, 20:14 (Ref:1810675)   #47
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Originally Posted by Flat12-Aircool
A LMS series with 60 entrants would have nowhere to race as no circuit simply has enough garages to cope, not even Le Mans!
Weren't some cars refused because of maximum amount of cars at 1 or 2 LMS events this year?
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Old 9 Jan 2007, 20:31 (Ref:1810695)   #48
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SALEEN S7R should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridSALEEN S7R should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridSALEEN S7R should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
Ditching GT1 would be a big mistake IMO. As things are there are more than enough cars racing in the class to justify keeping it. GT2 is a great class but the cars just dont have that wow factor that the GT1's have, given the choice of seeing a MC12 or Saleen S7R race for the lead of a race or a Ferrari 430 or Porsche 997 GT3 RSR I would choose the MC12 and S7R every time.
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Old 9 Jan 2007, 20:35 (Ref:1810698)   #49
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Sounds good to me. GT1 cars are fantastic, but unnecessarilly complex. I've got a bit sick of reading how unlike their road counterparts they are. Seems a bit pointless really. GT2s with more power (and maybe two classes based on engine size - 4 litres/8 litres?) would be much better IMO. After all, most people couldn't really tell a GT1 and a GT2 apart unless they knew what they were looking at.
YES, I fully agree with the asinine way the ACO defines a prod. based GT1 car.

Two classes, 306 cubes, and unlimited cubes sizes, with minimum weights of 2,600 and 2,800 lbs. dry, would be very interesting.

They could eliminate the diffuser and wings, if they were too fast.
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