IMSA Race TUSC Round 12: COTA

[joeb]

Originally Posted by TRspitfirefan

Increased weight will not help the P2 cars. If adding weight could make the car faster, then I'm sure the teams would have added weight a Loooong time ago, unless there is a "maximum weight" limit.

The restrictor increase is relatively small, so I think that this adjustment is really going to hurt P2 teams.

That's funny, I wonder if the P2 teams have tried this to try and get heat into their tires.

[joeb]

Originally Posted by Chiana

The fuel tank tweaking should have more direct effect than the weight and restrictor changes.

I'd like to know the baseline values of ACO-spec Oak coupes to see how much bopped those IMSA values are on that car. But as we've discussed recently ACO hasn't updated those sheets to us for ages

I'm guessing ACO weight would be 900 kg, with engine restrictors being the same as any other type of car with said engine. Don't know the differences (if there are any) in fuel capacities between engines or chassis in WEC.

We will see the Ligier in WEC at COTA as well but not with the HPD engine of course, but still will be interesting to see the sector times.

[Deleted]

Originally Posted by joeb

I'm guessing ACO weight would be 900 kg, with engine restrictors being the same as any other type of car with said engine. Don't know the differences (if there are any) in fuel capacities between engines or chassis in WEC.

We will see the Ligier in WEC at COTA as well but not with the HPD engine of course, but still will be interesting to see the sector times.

The comparing will be interesting, but considering that engine difference as well bigger restrictors and Conti-Hoosier tires on US Oak it will be very, very difficult.

[Christian Mogami]

Also the ARX-03b was overweight at 900kg and now will be at 940kg.

We will see if the suspension parts and transmission can handle it.

I think what IMSA is thinking is turning the P2 into a DP.

With that air restrictor size the HPD can now use all boost allowed to them.
(that was always a problem with the HR28tt...they couldn't use all boost allowed because of air restrictor size)
Will burn more fuel but IMSA fixed that with a larger fuel cell allowed.


The HR28tt should be in the 550hp range now so only down 50hp to the DP.

[Ginaro Zukovsky]

Some great info from ESM: http://www.esmracing.com/blog/qa-wit...-test-at-cota/

Q: You mentioned the tire comparison. How were the Dunlop tires?
BROWN: “The Dunlop tires were fantastic. We had the proper tire for our car. Without even pushing the car that hard, we were two seconds quicker a lap. Ryan ran a couple of laps on both the Continental and Dunlop Tires and easily posted the quicker laps on the Dunlops.”
...
BROWN: “The WEC car is slower because it is restricted more (by the series) compared to IMSA. But the car will be four seconds faster around COTA because of the tires.”

[hondafan37]

Originally Posted by Christian Mogami

Also the ARX-03b was overweight at 900kg and now will be at 940kg.

We will see if the suspension parts and transmission can handle it.

I think what IMSA is thinking is turning the P2 into a DP.

With that air restrictor size the HPD can now use all boost allowed to them.
(that was always a problem with the HR28tt...they couldn't use all boost allowed because of air restrictor size)
Will burn more fuel but IMSA fixed that with a larger fuel cell allowed.


The HR28tt should be in the 550hp range now so only down 50hp to the DP.

Is 1.2 mm larger reatrictor equivalent to 50 HP more?

[BullMan]

Originally Posted by Christian Mogami

Also the ARX-03b was overweight at 900kg and now will be at 940kg.

We will see if the suspension parts and transmission can handle it.

I think what IMSA is thinking is turning the P2 into a DP.

With that air restrictor size the HPD can now use all boost allowed to them.
(that was always a problem with the HR28tt...they couldn't use all boost allowed because of air restrictor size)
Will burn more fuel but IMSA fixed that with a larger fuel cell allowed.


The HR28tt should be in the 550hp range now so only down 50hp to the DP.

Holy crap, that's amazing. FOUR SECONDS! With less power, less weight, and actual rubber tires. Makes TUSC look a little foolish since the DPs are walking over the P2s and the only major difference is the crap Conti tire.

[Gulf]

Originally Posted by Ginaro Zukovsky

Some great info from ESM: http://www.esmracing.com/blog/qa-wit...-test-at-cota/

I really can't stop laughing... Pretty typical nascar mentality spend more money to go slower.

[David Land]

I just want the WEC to have 1 or 2 more American rounds, then I could completely ignore TUSC.

[Gulf]

Originally Posted by David Land

I just want the WEC to have 1 or 2 more American rounds, then I could completely ignore TUSC.

That would be great. I wish one could be Sebring and the other Road America or Laguna.

[MoMedic9019]

Originally Posted by Gulf

I really can't stop laughing... Pretty typical nascar mentality spend more money to go slower.

If I needed more convincing that ESM is headed for ELMS next season, this interview did it.

Thankfully, I didn't need more convincing.

[Gulf]

Originally Posted by MoMedic9019

If I needed more convincing that ESM is headed for ELMS next season, this interview did it.

Thankfully, I didn't need more convincing.

God I hope so, maybe Corvette will follow. Which Could mean no ESM, No Corvette, No Viper, No Oak and hopefully no tusc in the future.

[joeb]

That esm article mentioned the cars will have different aero, does anybody know what that is exactly?

Also the fact that the team put this out on their own website instead a release to other sites tells me it was meant as a direct strike at IMSA.

[Christian Mogami]

Doesn't IMSA P2 run the LM spec bodywork.(low-downforce).

And WEC P2 runs standard high-downforce bodywork.

[FstrthnU]

Originally Posted by Christian Mogami

Doesn't IMSA P2 run the LM spec bodywork.(low-downforce).

And WEC P2 runs standard high-downforce bodywork.

No, bodywork is not restricted anymore (not since Sebring IIRC). It's kind of up to ESM and OAK what aero package they run

[MoMedic9019]

Viper and Corvette aren't going anywhere...

Oak and ESM? Buh bye...

[Danathar]

Originally Posted by Ginaro Zukovsky

Some great info from ESM: http://www.esmracing.com/blog/qa-wit...-test-at-cota/

Sounds like he had a LOT more fun in the car with Dunlops (4 seconds faster..that's simply amazing) on. Makes me think that they will be running in the WEC or ELMS next year.

[Danathar]

Originally Posted by BullMan

Holy crap, that's amazing. FOUR SECONDS! With less power, less weight, and actual rubber tires. Makes TUSC look a little foolish since the DPs are walking over the P2s and the only major difference is the crap Conti tire.

Crap DP tire (not Conti). Conti would say they are designed perfectly for DP given the specs IMSA gave them.

I'd add if I were a Continental exe, seeing the same car go 4 seconds faster on Dunlops with a smaller engine and less weight would make me fume. I REALLY hope Continental has a word after this race to tell IMSA this is hurting their brand (and it is). This really makes their tires look bad, and it isn't Continental's fault given what IMSA has told them to make.

What would REALLY be cool would be for Continental to make a set of proper tires for ESM if they went to LeMans and watch the result.

[Deleted]

Originally Posted by MoMedic9019

If I needed more convincing that ESM is headed for ELMS next season, this interview did it.

Thankfully, I didn't need more convincing.

Nowhere in there is ELMS mentioned... why would they even want to run there? The only upside to WEC would be lower cost and being fastest class.

In WEC you have (look I'm making a positive reference to it here )
- Better visibility for Tequila Patron - at least there where alcohol advertising is allowed - and American round(s?)
- Automatic LM entries for both cars so no second guessing
- Less cars in class ie less competition, better chance of winning for 90%-there team like ESM
- A chance that all-pro lineups are allowed next year if the earlier considerations from the ACO actually materialize
- Better visibility even as secondary class, nobody cares or watches ELMS relatively speaking

[Danathar]

Originally Posted by Chiana

Nowhere in there is ELMS mentioned... why would they even want to run there? The only upside to WEC would be lower cost and being fastest class.

In WEC you have (look I'm making a positive reference to it here )
- Better visibility for Tequila Patron - at least there where alcohol advertising is allowed - and American round(s?)
- Automatic LM entries for both cars so no second guessing
- Less cars in class ie less competition, better chance of winning for 90%-there team like ESM
- A chance that all-pro lineups are allowed next year if the earlier considerations from the ACO actually materialize
- Better visibility even as secondary class, nobody cares or watches ELMS relatively speaking

Fastest class? They would be in P2.

[Deleted]

Originally Posted by Danathar

Fastest class? They would be in P2.

P2 is the fastest class of ELMS.

[Danathar]

Originally Posted by Chiana

P2 is the fastest class of ELMS.

Ahh..I was thinking WEC. thanks

[jasonjessica09]

Originally Posted by MoMedic9019

Viper and Corvette aren't going anywhere...

Oak and ESM? Buh bye...

I don't think that is a bad thing at all. LMP2 racing in WEC and ELMS seems much more of a attractive place to run those cars right now. ELMS still will enforce Pro-Am driver rules I suppose? Although I'm sure ESM will do the NAEC still.

I like the class structure for ELMS a lot actually. LMP2, GTE, and GT3. Hopefully this will be IMSA come 2017 but only GTD will have the pro-am driver rules. And I'm sure only GTLM will remain open tire.

[carbon_titanium]

Originally Posted by Christian Mogami

Also the ARX-03b was overweight at 900kg and now will be at 940kg.

We will see if the suspension parts and transmission can handle it.

I think what IMSA is thinking is turning the P2 into a DP.

With that air restrictor size the HPD can now use all boost allowed to them.
(that was always a problem with the HR28tt...they couldn't use all boost allowed because of air restrictor size)
Will burn more fuel but IMSA fixed that with a larger fuel cell allowed.


The HR28tt should be in the 550hp range now so only down 50hp to the DP.

Disagree, first of all the 600hp DP has always been an indicative value! someone very well informed told me that the GM and ford real power range is 540-560hp! the ford ecoboost revs around 6000rpm, the GM something more 7000rpm. Ford has more torque (>700Nm), GM some hp more.
The restrictors increase of the HPD lmp2 engine will give just 20-25hp more, a 50hp gain is unrealistic. Basicly won't change a thing, the power to weight ratio basicly will be the same:

900kg / 500hp = 1,8kg/h
940kg / 525hp = 1,79kg/h

anyway more power can be usefull at COTA being a short race, but at road atlanta to me is better to have a less powerfull 900kg car.

About TUSC arx-03b and WEC arx-03b performance difference I'd expect no less than 2 seconds

[Christian Mogami]

Originally Posted by carbon_titanium

Disagree, first of all the 600hp DP has always been an indicative value! someone very well informed told me that the GM and ford real power range is 540-560hp! the ford ecoboost revs around 6000rpm, the GM something more 7000rpm. Ford has more torque (>700Nm), GM some hp more.
The restrictors increase of the HPD lmp2 engine will give just 20-25hp more, a 50hp gain is unrealistic. Basicly won't change a thing, the power to weight ratio basicly will be the same:

900kg / 500hp = 1,8kg/h
940kg / 525hp = 1,79kg/h

anyway more power can be usefull at COTA being a short race, but at road atlanta to me is better to have a less powerfull 900kg car.

About TUSC arx-03b and WEC arx-03b performance difference I'd expect no less than 2 seconds

The move wasn't to make the P2 faster per lap but faster down the straights.

Don't look at the restrictor size but at the boost they can use.What people don't understand is a air restrictor doesn't work the same with NA and boosted engines.