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Old 24 Jun 2009, 06:06 (Ref:2489529)   #1
toby
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toby should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Sprint Tyres

Is it just me or are other people sick of the contrived racing we have in V8 supercars at the moment.

Firstly let me congratulate Michael Caruso for his win on the weekend, great effort, BUT, when a competitor (ie: Tander) is fastest in qualifying but then has no chance of a race win because he hasn't got a sprint tyre to use in the race that to me isn't racing.

Motor racing is about the best and fastest winning the race and if someone wins the majority of the time so be it, but for organisers to throw in circumstances that inhibit competitors to "spice up" the racing is that going too far.

I think it was Whincup that said recently that if race results were manufactured anymore than they are now he would look elsewhere to race.

Maybe a fairer way is to allow 2 sets of sprint tyres, one set for each race.

Interested to here other peoples opinions.?
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Old 24 Jun 2009, 06:23 (Ref:2489533)   #2
chavez
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chavez should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridchavez should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridchavez should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
1 set of sprint tyres per race is just as fair as 1 set for 2 races.
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Old 24 Jun 2009, 07:05 (Ref:2489543)   #3
Chris - Melb
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Chris - Melb should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridChris - Melb should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
As a purists, I'm totally sick of contrived racing, period. I have almost totally lost interest in V8 Supercar. It is becoming a joke; an almost total waste of time.

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Is it just me or are other people sick of the contrived racing we have in V8 supercars at the moment.
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Old 24 Jun 2009, 07:36 (Ref:2489557)   #4
peckstar
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peckstar has a lot of promise if they can keep it on the circuit!
i dont see an issue

there is nothing pure about motorsport. if you use that term to justify something you are kidding yourself



This is just another strategy move, good teams have good strategy and adapt.

winning a race is like kicking a goal in football, it really means very little, its all about the final result. the championship
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Old 24 Jun 2009, 07:57 (Ref:2489563)   #5
banksie
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Is it just me or are other people sick of the contrived racing we have in V8 supercars at the moment.
Yes.
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Old 24 Jun 2009, 08:20 (Ref:2489578)   #6
Chris - Melb
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Chris - Melb should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridChris - Melb should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
It's like having one football team wearing proper football boots, and the other team wearing ordinary street shoes.

If they did do that in football, there would be an uproar!
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Old 24 Jun 2009, 08:32 (Ref:2489587)   #7
Chappelli
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Chappelli should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridChappelli should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
I think the issue is it's currently less about strategy and more about luck...

The best case scenario for any driver is pitting for Sprint Tyres just before a safety car... it doesn't matter how good or bad your car or strategy is, if you luck that timing your probably going to end up with a result substantially better than you could of otherwise of hoped for...

Is essence does it make it any different from abandoning Qual and doing a marble draw for grid positions?

Perhaps instead of Sprint Tyres you could manipulate the compound of the tyres to create a bigger difference between a fresh tyre and an old one, while giving the teams an extra set or two of tyres a weekend... The idea being you still get the 'excitement' of car A overtaking car B because he's got fresher tyres, without the massive penalty of car B having to suffer because he happened to use his Sprint tyres in a race that had no safety cars, while car A suddenly goes from 20th to 3rd because he happened to luck into having sprint tyres available in a race full of Safety Cars....
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Old 24 Jun 2009, 08:41 (Ref:2489594)   #8
DJJ
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DJJ should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
What are you all crying about? that 2nd race was the best so far.

Maybe you boys like follow the leader, but end of the day when to use the tyre is a stratagy. If the big boys want to use it early and gap out then so be it, but wise people use it to an advantage.
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Old 24 Jun 2009, 08:46 (Ref:2489599)   #9
Chris - Melb
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Chris - Melb should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridChris - Melb should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
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...wise people use it to an advantage.
so HRT is not wise (based on race 2 at Darwin)?

888 is not wise?

FPR is not wise?

I could go on..........
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Old 24 Jun 2009, 08:55 (Ref:2489604)   #10
Kiwikid
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so HRT is not wise (based on race 2 at Darwin)?

888 is not wise?

FPR is not wise?

I could go on..........
Do you like F1 Chris?
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Old 24 Jun 2009, 09:00 (Ref:2489607)   #11
Chris - Melb
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Chris - Melb should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridChris - Melb should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Not as much as I use to, for the same sort of reasons.

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Do you like F1 Chris?
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Old 24 Jun 2009, 09:17 (Ref:2489614)   #12
dirttrack
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dirttrack should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
I am a big fan of the sprint tyre. Thanks to V8Supercars and there wisdom I can now get so much done around the house on a sunday arvo. Take Darwin for example they turned a 69 lap race into a 10 lap one. I watched the first five laps and understood where everyone was and what was going on and the same for the last 5 laps. The middle 59 being almost unwatchable. It has turned the race into more of a lottery and that is not a good thing. Lots of hard work and strategy should not be undone.
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Old 24 Jun 2009, 10:09 (Ref:2489646)   #13
v8man
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Why is it contrived, people start with a bank of tyres, the same as they did last year, just one set is a softer compound, are you trying to say that racing was better when the big teams could get the special tyres while the others had to use the off the shelf tyres and had no chance of ever winning a race.
At least now they all start with the exact same tyre bank, so everyone has the same chances and it comes down to the way the teams use them, very contrived, why should GRM and Stone Brothers keep there tyres for today and use them to good effect, you know Tander could of kept his tyres until the Sunday race as could any other team.
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Old 24 Jun 2009, 10:53 (Ref:2489665)   #14
banksie
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The thing I detest greatest currently is the mandatory pit stops.
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Old 24 Jun 2009, 11:02 (Ref:2489673)   #15
Chris - Melb
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Chris - Melb should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridChris - Melb should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
I am not a big fan of mandatory pit stops either. Let them race naturally, I reckon.
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Old 24 Jun 2009, 12:16 (Ref:2489721)   #16
anthony81901
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How many 'innovations' have been introduced over the years to 'spice' things up and how many have worked? The Peter Jackson dash, compulsory tyre changes, compulsory fuel stops, reverse grid races, Phillip Island co-drivers race, and Red vs Blue spring to mind.

The sprint tyre just turns it into a lottery. At Symmons James Courtney was involved in a early race clash with Todd Kelly damaging one sprint tyre. If we assume he was the innocent victim, he has been dudded through no fault of his own and misses out on a run on the sprint tyre.

If they want to use tyres to spice up the racing, we may as well return to allowing other manufacturers to participate, at least it was genuine competition with different compounds.

For mine, I preferred the old days of a championship of sprint races, no compulsory pit stops just a flag to flag race fastest driver wins. The enduros ideally would be stand alone events so that everyone pairs their lead drivers and goes for the win instead of conserving points positions.

Whilst it is nice to have variety in winners, what we ultimately want is he team and driver who have done the best job to prevail.
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Old 24 Jun 2009, 12:18 (Ref:2489722)   #17
mtpanorama
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mtpanorama should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Give them all the sprint tyre and make them do the whole race on them. Maybe then we might see some tactics and racecraft. Do you do the bolt at the start and hope to hang on till the end or do you hold back and save some tyre for the finish.
Get rid of the CPS.
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Old 24 Jun 2009, 12:32 (Ref:2489737)   #18
toby
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toby should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
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Why is it contrived, people start with a bank of tyres, the same as they did last year, just one set is a softer compound, are you trying to say that racing was better when the big teams could get the special tyres while the others had to use the off the shelf tyres and had no chance of ever winning a race.
At least now they all start with the exact same tyre bank, so everyone has the same chances and it comes down to the way the teams use them, very contrived, why should GRM and Stone Brothers keep there tyres for today and use them to good effect, you know Tander could of kept his tyres until the Sunday race as could any other team.

You are right Tander could have kept his sprint tyres for Sunday , but then he would have been buried down the pack in Saturdays race like Caruso was.

You say they all have the same tyre bank, thats right but where it is stupid is that half use them one race and the other half use it the next race to create false results.

Another example if Whincup had kept his soft tyres for Sunday he probably would have won that race but there is no way he would have won Saturdays race and the fans don't want to see him down the pack just because he is using a tyre that is 2 seconds a lap slower than some of the other guys, we want to see them racing.
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Old 24 Jun 2009, 22:21 (Ref:2490106)   #19
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Backagain has a lot of promise if they can keep it on the circuit!
It is becoming increasingly boring to watch, for example when there is a group of say 4-5 cars racing or dicing, team managers are desperate to get their car into the pits so that they can return to the track "in clear air". How is that improving racing, you may as well send the cars out in a line 45 seconds apart, and the car that finishes the nominated number of laps in the shortest time wins.
Get rid of CPS, get rid of compulsory fuel limits at pit stops, BRING BACK RACING.
How good was the Biante race, lots of dicing, lots of passing, lots of cars sliding and close to the limit on braking RACING.
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Old 24 Jun 2009, 22:47 (Ref:2490114)   #20
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What gets me is the tyre bank is spread across the weekend - ie what is now supposed to be 2 separate rounds. The Ch7 crew have expressed how hard they find it to track what is going on, and that goes doubly for the fan at home or on the track who (99%) do not have the timing info the commentary crew have.
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Old 24 Jun 2009, 23:11 (Ref:2490128)   #21
anthony81901
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Shows what a joke calling each race a round is, why can't we go back to round 12, race 2 etc rather than calling it race 28?
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Old 24 Jun 2009, 23:30 (Ref:2490132)   #22
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V8 Fireworks should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridV8 Fireworks should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridV8 Fireworks should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
It does improve the racing, and front-runners have the option of not using the sprint tyre in the first race and finishing P15 from a P1 qually. So clearly it is fair, and it will stay.
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Old 24 Jun 2009, 23:45 (Ref:2490142)   #23
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Trev Campbell should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridTrev Campbell should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
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Originally Posted by dirttrack View Post
I am a big fan of the sprint tyre. Thanks to V8Supercars and there wisdom I can now get so much done around the house on a sunday arvo. Take Darwin for example they turned a 69 lap race into a 10 lap one. I watched the first five laps and understood where everyone was and what was going on and the same for the last 5 laps. The middle 59 being almost unwatchable. It has turned the race into more of a lottery and that is not a good thing. Lots of hard work and strategy should not be undone.
Dirttrack you would have been even happier with Saturdays more 'traditional' race then. That turned into the typical boring procession we normally get. You only needed to watch the first lap to figure out the result of that one.
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Old 25 Jun 2009, 01:00 (Ref:2490164)   #24
toby
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Dirttrack you would have been even happier with Saturdays more 'traditional' race then. That turned into the typical boring procession we normally get. You only needed to watch the first lap to figure out the result of that one.
That's the consequence of having a parity formula, but thats the route V8 Supercars have decided to go. They spend millions getting the cars to be equal but then they give a tyre thats a couple of seconds different to the other ones.
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Old 25 Jun 2009, 01:12 (Ref:2490168)   #25
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That was my point from the outset. Why introduce a soft tyre when the racing is essentially a 'parity' formula? If the powers need to inject some interest back into the sport why not just open the racing up to the tyre manufacturers again? The respective tyre makes would show comparative advantages at different stages throughout the race. Not to mention the different setups between teams.

At the very least, it would bring more buck$ into the sport when the manufacturers are scaling back their funding?
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