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Old 27 Mar 2018, 23:37 (Ref:3811376)   #31
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So why run any other type of engines at all? Why not stick the current configuration that gives a decent level of parity? Only Supercars would see the whole world shifting to electric cars and think moving to V6's makes them relevant.
Ha ha , the whole world is switching to EV, funny! China is switching to EV (becuase of massive government subsidies due to reduce in 2018), china sales are bigger than the rest of the world put together.

Manufacturers are moving to smaller motors often with turbos which is why Supercars are experimenting in it

Mean while todays report suggest an EV car with fast charge will use as much electricity as 20 house at the same time, Something our grid will not deal with and even more so under renewable (No sir you cant go down the shops because the wind isn't blowing and its night time

Last edited by peckstar; 27 Mar 2018 at 23:42.
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Old 28 Mar 2018, 05:48 (Ref:3811410)   #32
twinwebbers
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twinwebbers should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
I know many will howl me down, but you got to admit a manufacturer line up like this:

FACTORY: Subaru, BMW, Honda and Vauxhall
INDEPENDENT: Ford, Alfa, Mercedes, MG, Volkswagen, Audi and Toyota

...from the outside at least looks like a healthy championship.

Sure the racing we have is in rude health but I want variety not just 'Commodore Cup'.

Last edited by twinwebbers; 28 Mar 2018 at 05:49. Reason: Spelling
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Old 28 Mar 2018, 05:59 (Ref:3811412)   #33
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Originally Posted by twinwebbers View Post
I know many will howl me down, but you got to admit a manufacturer line up like this:

FACTORY: Subaru, BMW, Honda and Vauxhall
INDEPENDENT: Ford, Alfa, Mercedes, MG, Volkswagen, Audi and Toyota

...from the outside at least looks like a healthy championship.

Sure the racing we have is in rude health but I want variety not just 'Commodore Cup'.
Its look good on paper, but is it good in practise,

short little races, no one talked them up on the weekend in supercars
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Old 28 Mar 2018, 08:07 (Ref:3811428)   #34
Matt K
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The case with factory teams in BTCC is not that simple. These teams are not full factory teams as 888 is in Supercars. Probably they have little backing from manufacturers.
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Old 28 Mar 2018, 11:23 (Ref:3811467)   #35
V8 Fireworks
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V8 Fireworks should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
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Probably they have little backing from manufacturers.
They are shiny and resemble the road cars, so does it matter?





Looking good!
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Old 28 Mar 2018, 11:38 (Ref:3811474)   #36
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Tourer should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridTourer should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridTourer should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridTourer should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
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They are shiny and resemble the road cars, so does it matter?

Looking good!
Horrible ****ant little buzz boxes but they're used to that over there. Ultimately, it may be that we end up with something like that here but it'll be a big step back from where we are now.
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Old 28 Mar 2018, 12:14 (Ref:3811487)   #37
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Horrible ****ant little buzz boxes but they're used to that over there.
That you could be so out of touch is almost comical. True car people like all kinds of cars.

Yeah that Subaru Impreza (now Levorg), what a ()*&(&* four-cylinder buzzbox... NOT! Bloody lovely, thank you very much. "The most exciting day I've ever had (driving cars)."

The circuit 2WD versions aren't half bad either. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sYmICCsPRMk Lovely stuff!

Remember how the true racers like Gentleman Jim and Brock would gladly race anything from a big banger Commodore or 635i coupe, to a "little 325i (or M3) ***ant buzzbox" to even a Volvo 850 or S40 "****ant little buzz box"...

Heck even current Supercars star Mr. Mostert is lowering himself to racing a Ford Focus "****ant little buzz box" this weekend!

Last edited by V8 Fireworks; 28 Mar 2018 at 12:33.
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Old 28 Mar 2018, 12:29 (Ref:3811492)   #38
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They are shiny and resemble the road cars, so does it matter?





Looking good!
And because these cars can be built from production shells, they don't need "manufacturer approval" to race one, hence the huge array of different brands in the series, officially backed or not

Our Sports Sedans though....
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Old 28 Mar 2018, 12:29 (Ref:3811494)   #39
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Tourer should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridTourer should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridTourer should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridTourer should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
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That you could be so out of touch is almost comical. True car people like all kinds of cars.

Yeah that Subaru Impreza (now Levorg), what a ()*&(&* four-cylinder buzzbox... NOT! Bloody lovely, thank you very much.
I'm quite familiar with Subies thanks pal, they're not a bad thing but not at the level we've been used to.

I like a wide range of car types thank you but the point I'm making is that in comparison to what we've been used to as our premier sedan racing class, those BTCC things are a big step down - massive.

Yeah, Falcadores clearly have a limited shelf life as race machines but I'm not convinced that the little buzz boxes are the way to go. If we go there, we go there but we'll lose a fair chunk of the spectacle we've enjoyed for so long.

Large(ish) engined, RWD cars have been the exciting end of sedan racing here going back to the mid/late 60s really. FWD cars with a little less weight, half the power won't produce the same result (although they may crash and bash more - something I'm personally not interested in).
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Old 28 Mar 2018, 12:32 (Ref:3811495)   #40
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I'm just imagining the outrage on here if Aussies raced the way BTCC hooligans do. One minor touch in V8s gets pages of spleen venting. Regardless of cars, BTCC is more like dodgems most of the time. The internet would break.
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Old 28 Mar 2018, 12:35 (Ref:3811496)   #41
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Large(ish) engined, RWD cars have been the exciting end of sedan racing here going back to the mid/late 60s really.
[I hope you recognised the Subaru and BMW BTCC cars are RWD. ]

Yes, and I'm saying race largish powerful rear wheel drive sedans that actually exist:

Merdeces C63 AMG
BMW M3
Alfa Romeo Giulia Quadrifologio
Kia Stinger GT
Lexus GS F
etc

Why race Holden Vectra, Nissan Maxima and Ford Mondeo sports sedans... it's an irrelevance!?

It doesn't have to be limited to 4-cylinders like the BTCC is: Go ahead and make having at least 6 cylinders mandatory (up the power from the BTCC's 350hp* to say 600hp) and remove the front wheel drive option (that the BTCC has)... The BTCC is just an example of how you can get so many manufacturers involved.

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Originally Posted by one five five View Post
And because these cars can be built from production shells, they don't need "manufacturer approval" to race one, hence the huge array of different brands in the series, officially backed or not
Yes, that's the key!

Parity is still obtained via the control front and rear subframes, and the aero is equalised too.

* PS. they might be buzz boxes but they are only 50hp less than the 400hp that the V8s were making in Group A in the 1980's. They are really not that slow IMO, but by all means make the ATCC version more powerful.

Last edited by V8 Fireworks; 28 Mar 2018 at 12:42.
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Old 28 Mar 2018, 12:56 (Ref:3811501)   #42
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Umai Naa should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridUmai Naa should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
In the BTCC, they do need the OK from the manufacturer to run a model.
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Old 28 Mar 2018, 21:28 (Ref:3811623)   #43
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Originally Posted by V8 Fireworks View Post
Parity is still obtained via the control front and rear subframes, and the aero is equalised too.

* PS. they might be buzz boxes but they are only 50hp less than the 400hp that the V8s were making in Group A in the 1980's. They are really not that slow IMO, but by all means make the ATCC version more powerful.

Parity is also obtained by a ballast success penalty at each event. Is that what we want?

1988 Group A commodore top ten shoot out time 2.22.47

2017 Bathurst 6 hour pole 2.25.48

I keep telling you, what you want is on this coming weekend. Time to accept that what you want is already out there and support it
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Old 28 Mar 2018, 22:06 (Ref:3811631)   #44
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Originally Posted by Woolley View Post
I'm just imagining the outrage on here if Aussies raced the way BTCC hooligans do. One minor touch in V8s gets pages of spleen venting. Regardless of cars, BTCC is more like dodgems most of the time. The internet would break.
Strange argument in a technical discussion.
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Old 28 Mar 2018, 23:55 (Ref:3811645)   #45
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twinwebbers should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
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Parity is also obtained by a ballast success penalty at each event. Is that what we want?
The misguided arguments on this forum astounds me.

Did anyone say anything about lets have the BTTC rules? Nope.

What we have said is: Wouldn't it be great if we had a lot of manufacturers involved with a variety of platforms?

...and cause I know you'll ask. Why, yes I will be watching the 6 hour this weekend and loving it, just as much as I love V8s and F1 and Sports Sedans and Carrera Cup and Aussie Racers and F4 and TCM and Excels and Hillclimbs and Historics.

Call me odd but I just like to watch motor cars racing. Not really sure why I'm on this forum...
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