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Old 31 Oct 2016, 08:45 (Ref:3684214)   #176
ArnageWRC
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ArnageWRC should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
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.......unless it moves locations on a rota
Which is what any forward thinking governing body/ promoter would do. Say, 3 years for each interested region....takes the event/ sport to the people. As it is, they just go for the Welsh money - and damn the rest of the country. Well, you end up with what we have now.

Some sports recognise the need to visit as many areas as possible - and generate huge interest; which brings in national media, sponsors, etc
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Old 31 Oct 2016, 12:09 (Ref:3684259)   #177
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chunder should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridchunder should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridchunder should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
Would anyone here seriously have a problem with the GB WRC round being Ireland?

I know I wouldn't and I would certainly be more interested in going to watch it there than damn Wales.

Their rally scene is thriving and has done for years, they wont have massive spectator pens coz their c=governing body realises that because an accident happened and people got killed we have to treat every spectator like a circuit race fan.

Plus two top drivers and the UK's only likely world champion is from Ireland, but hey that would be cmmon sense and something new, interesting and vibrant wouldn't it.

Do we all really enjoy standing round the middle of a bog every October? No. Ireland might not be any better weather wise though!
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Old 31 Oct 2016, 12:21 (Ref:3684261)   #178
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The Fat Clerk should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridThe Fat Clerk should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
We'd definitely go, what a cracking idea,
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Old 31 Oct 2016, 16:25 (Ref:3684314)   #179
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I think Ireland deserves a round, if it's at the expense of RallyofGB, then so be it. On the two occasions Ireland had a round, they were quite good; but the weather wasn't exactly helpful. A late spring or early autumn event would be preferable I would think. And Irish Tarmac is unlike any other Tarmac in the world......

What is the name of the 'classic' stage from the CoI that made Craig Breen like a kid at Christmas; he described it like Ouninpohja, but on Tarmac.
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Old 31 Oct 2016, 18:09 (Ref:3684346)   #180
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At least Channel 5 showed the powerstage live, they did a good job from the presenting side, Nicky Grist did well in the punditry
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Old 31 Oct 2016, 19:24 (Ref:3684364)   #181
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Starfish Primer should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridStarfish Primer should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridStarfish Primer should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
I went to Gartheiniog on Saturday and I enjoyed it a lot. Weather was reasonable, nobody comes to Wales to enjoy the sun, and the cars made a good show.

The Polos and the Fabias are on a different league, Meeke was a bit disappointing and Tanak made a fantastic job.

I think the rally cannot cope with more spectators without creating a massive traffic jam and parking problems. Not counting the disgusting amount of litter the forests show when people leaves. This year signing the contract with the Forest Agency was complicated, I won't be surprised if the forest agency says no in the future for environmental reasons ( aka, take your litter home ).

Also, there are rumours of VW pulling the plug to the WRC but they have been denied. http://www.diariomotor.com/competici...uro-en-el-wrc/
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Old 5 Nov 2016, 18:28 (Ref:3685575)   #182
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Tremendous drive from Tanak/Molder again, I've said it before but Ott seems a very brave driver, perhaps even fearless. Congrats to DMACK too, no mean feat taking on Michelin. Meeke was somewhat subdued I thought, I was expecting more.

I was going to ask how Ott would fare in a Polo head to head with Ogier then I saw the other news!
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Old 7 Nov 2016, 08:45 (Ref:3686161)   #183
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I think the rally cannot cope with more spectators without creating a massive traffic jam and parking problems. Not counting the disgusting amount of litter the forests show when people leaves. This year signing the contract with the Forest Agency was complicated, I won't be surprised if the forest agency says no in the future for environmental reasons ( aka, take your litter home ).
Traffic problems & congestion are what happens when you have 'compact' routes.....there is a solution - have a greater geographical spread..
As for the litter - well where do you start? It just gets worse and worse.

The agreement with the NRW (formerly Forestry Commission Wales) was complicated, and thanks to the #Rally4Wales campaign, a solution was found; interestingly, the agreement between MSA/ NRW for RallyGB was sorted before the agreement for the other club/ national events - tells you were the MSA's priorities are. They can't be losing their cash cow, now can they?
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Old 7 Nov 2016, 09:43 (Ref:3686182)   #184
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chunder should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridchunder should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridchunder should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
There is no excuse for litter, that's atrocious. I would be looking at drones or something to try and find culprits and fine them.

Problem is, if you go to an NT site or FC land, they don't even provide bins anymore anywhere, they just expect you to get rid of it yourself, which I find utterly stupid. I get it and the point they are making, but surely they are shooting themselves in the foot just to save a few quid on a Biffa truck coming round once a week!

Single venues now are a no go for rally fans, unless you break the rules. I have been to a few, some at race tracks where the stages are fairly boring and some at proper venues where you are penned in and can only see the same stuff all day.

Unless you break ranks and go somewhere where there are no marshals. Which has obvious consequences.

Trouble is, this has two effects. If there is a crash, most fans will initially check to see if the crew are OK, they usually are so then you try and get the car going again, that is now impossible, you can't do it. Or, if the crash is more serious you can run down to a post or a suitable area to slow other crews down and/or inform the teams that something has happened. None of this is possible now.

It might be a tiny bit safer, but I would suspect a lot of crews are being left in stages and their cars and there might be nasty consequences at some times when a marshal team are nowhere near an accident, where a couple of fans might have been able to help or at least run somewhere to find it.

Panic nonsense from our resident group of moronic MSA dunces I am afraid. Cacking themselves over lawsuits instead of being proactive in the first place.
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Old 7 Nov 2016, 11:54 (Ref:3686212)   #185
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Single venues now are a no go for rally fans,
Agreed - but that is the very nature of the dwindling number of venues available for rallying. No spectators and often no cameras in car either. Service crew can generally see some of the stage but again are very restricted in where they can go.

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unless you break the rules.
...
Unless you break ranks and go somewhere where there are no marshals. Which has obvious consequences.
This really ****es me off - there is a least one venue that is no longer in use thanks to someone (one person) being somewhere they shouldn't have been - and they knew they shouldn't have been there. There aren't that many venues left so people 'breaking the rules' and just doing their own thing are a serious risk to the sport I'm afraid.

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I have been to a few, some at race tracks where the stages are fairly boring and some at proper venues where you are penned in and can only see the same stuff all day.
Single venues events are by their nature somewhat restricted in the stage layouts they can run so there is a lot of re-use. Also a lot of the venues are 'of a sensitive nature' so viewing can be restricted to smaller areas with controlled lines of sight.


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Trouble is, this has two effects. If there is a crash, most fans will initially check to see if the crew are OK, they usually are so then you try and get the car going again, that is now impossible, you can't do it. Or, if the crash is more serious you can run down to a post or a suitable area to slow other crews down and/or inform the teams that something has happened. None of this is possible now.

It might be a tiny bit safer, but I would suspect a lot of crews are being left in stages and their cars and there might be nasty consequences at some times when a marshal team are nowhere near an accident, where a couple of fans might have been able to help or at least run somewhere to find it.
This is very different between single venue and multi venue events. For multi venue events I agree, the marshals are that much more spread out so it's highly likely that an off will happen out of sight of any marshal. Having spectators to help crews has always been a big part of multi venue rallying and it's a shame to lose that interaction.

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Panic nonsense from our resident group of moronic MSA dunces I am afraid. Cacking themselves over lawsuits instead of being proactive in the first place.
Seems to be the way of things now unfortunately (not just in motorsport), people sue at the drop of a hat no matter whether it was their own stupidity that caused the issue in the first place.
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Old 7 Nov 2016, 13:44 (Ref:3686226)   #186
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chunder should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridchunder should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridchunder should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
I sadly can see the day when stage rallies are totally non spectator, hard to police, but let's face it most of them are now anyway as the clubs can't afford to say whether they can have spectators coz of all the insurance and stuff. If you want to stand in a service park and watch a car drive past fair enough, but even then you have turn up and hope for the best. How on earth does the MSA expect to get ANYONE interested in taking part without fans being allowed to experience the sport at a personal level?

For those of us that have been going for years, helping crews out, and also now and then saving a car, someones safety it is a sad time.

I just will not attend single venues anymore and that is a pathetic blight on the way rallying is run in this country compared to just about every other country in Europe, even our own damn neighbours.

If that is the case then I hope it dies quickly as it honestly deserves to the way it is run at the moment.
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Old 8 Nov 2016, 11:33 (Ref:3686484)   #187
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How on earth does the MSA expect to get ANYONE interested in taking part without fans being allowed to experience the sport at a personal level?
They obviously don't want people getting interested in rallying?? Better to get them into circuit racing.....
I mean, their 'flagship' event is still invisible to 99% of the populace. They're hardly trying to grow the sport, are they?
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Old 8 Nov 2016, 12:32 (Ref:3686492)   #188
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chunder should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridchunder should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridchunder should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
I was being provocative with that, and I do understand their utter paranoia after the Jim Clark incident a few years ago.

But doing what they have done has simply excluded so many people from being able to watch rallying.

Events like the Wyedean, Jim Clark and a few others were fraught as you had local towns nearby, folk knew what was going on and they would wander into the forests to see what was going on. They had no clue on safety, where to stand, why you should or shouldn't stand here or there etc.

The marshalling could not cope so you had the odd incident.

I get that, but to just make it almost impossible for spectators to attend seems ridiculous.

MSA wants no spectators, they are a pain to them, all they want is bloody marshals, timekeepers, clubs and ARDS tests to make them money, I didn't know you even have to do a rally ARDS test now!
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Old 8 Nov 2016, 13:10 (Ref:3686497)   #189
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MSA wants no spectators, they are a pain to them, all they want is bloody marshals, timekeepers, clubs and ARDS tests to make them money, I didn't know you even have to do a rally ARDS test now!
The 'rally ARDS' test is the 'BARS' test and that's been around for years - we started in 2004 and it was in place then (I'll agree it's largely ******** though ).
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Old 8 Nov 2016, 14:14 (Ref:3686505)   #190
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chunder should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridchunder should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridchunder should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
How much is it Bert?
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Old 8 Nov 2016, 15:47 (Ref:3686537)   #191
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How much is it Bert?
The 'go rallying' pack from the MSA was £50ish and then £200ish for the BARS test itself (including the actual driving the car bit - which you don't do in your own car). The 'go rallying' pack is largely a rip-off but contains the form you need so you have to have it (I guess it's a similar situation with the 'go racing' pack for the circuit racers). The test itself is part written, part practical - not sure how beneficial it is really? After all you can go rallycrossing on a non-race national B licence and there's no test for that.

Then of course you add the cost of everything else you have to have - overalls, helmet, hans. You need to throw away perfectly good seats and harnesses every 5 years even if they've not been used (ok so you can sell them to circuit racers or track dayers - but that just highlights what a stupid rule the lifing is in the first place).

So even without the car cost starting out in rallying is by no means cheap - that's the main barrier to entry I'd have thought. Good fun though
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