Button outqualifies Ralf (again)

[White Van Man]

oooh...

[Valve Bounce]

aaah!!

[Ralf's Girl]

I'm surprised at the little faith people seem to have in Button's abilities. If he's as good as they say, he should have no problem outqualifying Ralf every now and then.

I think Ralf has proved in the past three races that he is much better over a race distance.

And to put things into perspective, I say only this:

Ralf - 10
Button - 6

[RIKB]

Better than Ralf 17 Zanardi 0

I enjoyed Jensons' comment about how he will have no trouble with Trulli this time as the Italian is 15th on the Grid.

[Dhru]

So what? If you look at the stats, Heidfeild has outqualified Jean Alesi, and Alesi's more experienced than Ralf, adn Heidfeild's as much a rookie as Button. In fact, noone has outqualified his team mate at every race this year. David's outqualified Mika, Rubens has outqualified Michael. The best way to judge the better driver is during the race. Notice how Murray and Martin never compare Ralf and Button on Sundays?
Dhru.

[Ralf's Girl]

I think you'll find that the Ralf-Zanardi qualifying comparison was 11-5 in favour of Ralf. So Button should do better because Zanardi was terminally rubbish.

And this is a copy of the email I sent to the Motoring News after some rather unfiar comments they made about Ralf after the Belgian Grand Prix:

Surely Ralf Schumacher is not so petulant? I for one did not notice anything remotely 'stroppy' about Ralf over the Belgian Grand Prix weekend. The fact that Ralf Schumacher was outqualified by his team-mate means very little. Even Alex Zanardi managed it, and I, as do many others, find it extremely insulting to see him referred to as 'the less talented of the Schueys'.
You may find, on inspection of MN back issues, that MN are being a tad hypocritical. After running an article entitled 'Schu Junior: The Key to success' a few months ago, all I have seen in recent issues is various examples of backstabbing. Jenson Button can do no wrong in the eyes of the British, despite the fact that he rammed another driver off the track!
Motoring News, I am sure that Ralf knows F1 well enough to know that getting outqualified by your team-mate is all part of the game. And one more thing: four tenths of a second is not a 'comprehensive blitzing'.


That letter (Dhru, you have probably read it on RSW) was printed in the Motoring News - and I think I got my points exactly right.

[ozywoodwards]

Prehaps they should have compared the two this Sunday, as even though Button got a poor start he was quicker and Ralf spun off. Go Button Go.

[LYM]

It's psychological. Notice for a few times that RS became all tensed all and irrational when he's falling behind Button. He overstretched the car and spinned off frequently under those circumstances.

Maybe brother Schumacher should inject some confidence in Ralf.

[Gerard]

Qualifying is only there to decide the starting order of a race.
It has nothing to do with the race itself or the outcome of it, although starting at the back won't do most drivers any good.
Just look at Arrows, de La Rosa has outqualified Verstappen 11-5 but Jos has 5 points against Pedro's 2.
And in the end it's the points that count.

[Dhru]

I think one mistake a season is allowed!!!!! His other retirements have been mechanical problems or he's been booted off by other eager drivers. And also in a season where the all wins have been McLaren/Ferrari, and almost all second places too (the only one which didn't was Brasil, where DC's car didn't comply and Fisi was gifted it), he's taken three third places Which is more than any of the non-big-two drivers.
Dhru.

[Ralf's Girl]

Ralf did have a couple of other incidents during the race (typically we didn't get to see them) but the spin that took him out was down to Gene braking on the exit of a corner to let Ralf through, Ralf had to brake hard and he was on the white line. Ralf accepted partial blame for it, but he also said he appreciated the fact that Gene came to apologise to him later for causing him to go out.

[Peter Mallett]

Originally posted by Ralf's Girl
Ralf did have a couple of other incidents during the race (typically we didn't get to see them) but the spin that took him out was down to Gene braking on the exit of a corner to let Ralf through, Ralf had to brake hard and he was on the white line. Ralf accepted partial blame for it, but he also said he appreciated the fact that Gene came to apologise to him later for causing him to go out.

Yes but those things have happened to Button too. Frankly there's little between the two and this race showed that to excellent effect.

[Ralf's Girl]

Look, the only reason the Media Idol overtook Ralf on Sunday was because Ralf ran wide, and Media Idol admitted as much himself.

And I think your evidence to say that there is little between the two of them is extremely inconclusive. I want an example of Button beating Ralf in race conditions when each has been driving at his optimum. Try that.

[Peter Mallett]

Originally posted by Ralf's Girl
Look, the only reason the Media Idol overtook Ralf on Sunday was because Ralf ran wide, and Media Idol admitted as much himself.

And I think your evidence to say that there is little between the two of them is extremely inconclusive. I want an example of Button beating Ralf in race conditions when each has been driving at his optimum. Try that.

Oh dear. My "evidence" is based on my long time experience I really don't care if you think I'm wrong its my opinion. However you would have to define OPTIMUM before I give you an answer. And then I would have to wait until Christmas to read Autocourse fro a definitive report on each race.

Your reference to "the media idol" suggests an element of prejudice therefore nothing would really convince you to change your own opinion so I won't.

I will just refer you to the FACT that they've both made simple mistakes this season and the fact that to overtake in this sport you need the driver in front to make an error. That is what racing is about.

So. In my opinion they are pretty equal this year and in view of the relative experience between them, that makes Button a little more impressive than Ralfie.

[Valve Bounce]

I am not going to get into an argy bargy with Ralf's girl as her very name suggests that Ralf is her idol, fair enough.
Getting back to Bunsen, he came fifth at a very difficult circuit last weekend, under most difficult conditions, and was only beaten by the two Ferraris and the two McLarens. That speaks volumes for Bunsen - he is the hot tip of the future. He even beat my favourite Jacques on even terms- what more can I say?
By the way, I think the BMW will be a revelation next year. I think Ralf will be sensational also. What do you guys think about the Renault?

[White Van Man]

I heard that there was once someone called Schikane5 on this forum who wouldn't hear a word said about her darling Michael - was that you, Ralf's Girl ? Did you decide to support the brother instead ?

[tazzoid]

OUCH!!!

[Ralf's Girl]

Originally posted by White Van Man
I heard that there was once someone called Schikane5 on this forum who wouldn't hear a word said about her darling Michael - was that you, Ralf's Girl ? Did you decide to support the brother instead ?

Oh, that is funny! Me supporting TGF!!! Words cannot describe how funny that is...

[Peter Mallett]

Nah, can't be Schick 5. RG doesn't shout.

[ally]

If you check Atlas F1 qualifying differentials through the year Ralf has outdriven Jensen by a large margin in every race! On the occasions that Jensen has outqualified Ralf the margin is generally one of the smallest amongst team mates. That is what Williams and Head are looking at. That is why they are holding on to Ralf not Jensen - another view is to commpare Jensens first session with Michael's. Michael had three podiums whithin his first fifteen races. Jensen is a natural but it is too early to tell his talent.

[Peter Mallett]

It is very clear from these postings and those in the other "Bunsen" topic that there is a certain reluctance to accept the boy's obvious talents. I sometimes despair because if he was a German, Italian or a Frenchman or (Heaven help us) a South American, he would be hailed as the next best thing since the proverbial sliced bread, before he'd even turned a F1 wheel in anger. However he is British and worse still English, and because of that, he's to be denigrated and generally put down as a no-hoper.

Yes he does need some more experience. Yes Ralf has beaten him on occasion. But he's beaten Ralf on occaison too.

However, when was the last time that a new driver prompted so much discussion? Certainly when Ralfie debuted he was er "wild"? For two seasons we weren't sure whether he'd run a complete race or take his team mate out!

It must be said that the media hype hasn't helped Button and his willingness to openly profit from his celebrity is perhaps a little distasteful to some. But, he doesn't have a rich father or massive sponsors to pay him. He has achieved on raw talent and hard work very similar to Mickey-the-Shoe. Good luck to him if he's using his current celebrity to enhance his earnings.

Maybe that's why we can't compare him to Senna, who used his father's connections to get to the UK initially.

[Ralf's Girl]

Button doesn't have a rich father, but he has an extremely annoying father...

I have no unwillingness to accept the fact that the boy is talented. I'd be an idiot if I said otherwise. But it is when people suggest that he has more talent than Ralf that I...get my claws out...

But the qualifying margin, though decreasing, between Ralf and Button-Boy is not the smallest in the field. At one point it was second largest - behind the Irvine-Herbert qualifying gap.

[Carla O]

Originally posted by Peter Mallett
It is very clear from these postings and those in the other "Bunsen" topic that there is a certain reluctance to accept the boy's obvious talents. I sometimes despair because if he was a German, Italian or a Frenchman or (Heaven help us) a South American, he would be hailed as the next best thing since the proverbial sliced bread, before he'd even turned a F1 wheel in anger. However he is British and worse still English, and because of that, he's to be denigrated and generally put down as a no-hoper.

i read in some paper today Audi has hires a 13 year old English boy for when it goes to F1 in a few years! God! This makes me feel old!

But see... there are still people willing to support english drivers. i can't say the same for portuguese, and we also have some with real talent! but no money or good sponsors or rich daddys...