What is holding Williams back ?

[Jimmy Magnusson]

Equality will never come from promoting someone who is (in F1 terms) useless to drive a car very slowly. Stoddart has at least been mediocre to passable in DTM, but how good PR is it to have the Audi girl and the Mercedes girl qualifying at the back of the grid most of the time? Motor racing is one of very few sports where men and women can compete together, and by far the main reason we haven't seen more successful women racers is because you're selecting from a very small pool of drivers. I welcome the day a truly world championship material woman arrives, because that is what will really get young girls interested in racing. Long time since I heard anyone but the Spanish comment on Hamilton's skin colour. Up until now most Russians have been pretty useless so it's great to see that Sirotkin actually seems to have plenty of talent.

[Flavio Galtieri]

Originally Posted by bella

i wonder if we'd be having the same discussion if a female press officers boyfriend or husband had used his connections to get a test drive with the team she worked for? .

I can't speak for anyone else here Bella but I specifically did not refer to the driver's gender.

And yes, personally I would be having this conversation had a male no-hoper joined an F1 team where his wife had bought a large shareholding.

[barnettracing]

Originally Posted by bella

i wonder if we'd be having the same discussion if a female press officers boyfriend or husband had used his connections to get a test drive with the team she worked for?

i think visibility is important. to us f1 enthusiasts, it's another woman f1 tester who has got there by connections and wealth rather than merit. to everyone else it's just a sign that women can and do get to drive f1 cars, and it's not unachievable for young girls who want to take their karting seriously to aspire to it. the more normal it becomes for women to be there in team shirts in every position within a team, the less likely f1 is to miss out on that incredibly talented girl.

I think you're quite right. But, hypothetically, how does it look to the general public if Susie is 5, 6, 7 seconds slower than the next slowest car at the test she does? It doesn't look very good for women then, does it? I mean, it would show that women can and do drive F1 cars, but that they drive them a lot slower than men.

I suppose in her defence of the above situation, she would be an F1 rookie and it would be useful to see a male F1 rookie on the same day to at least give some sort of lap time comparison.

Whether male or female, merit would always be preferable to money. I mean, when Max Chilton got the Force India test, there were similar sort of opinions being voiced about a male racing driver.

[Flyin Ryan]

Originally Posted by wnut

Williams' biggest problem would appear to be the shear bloody mindedness that they have adopted toward their employees.
They have a staff turnover which other than the 2 owners would limit their total corporate knowledge to about 18 months.

They appear IMO to have very little faith in the saying "your employees are your business".

I imagine they all know it's a sinking ship and are getting off while they still can. You look at the story today of "Williams' stakeholder's child is now test driver" and it speaks for itself.

[davyboy]

A blind man [or woman ] at night could see why she got the drive. There's nothing particularly wrong with that, hell there are plenty of people who've bought their way onto the grid this season... both the Williams race drivers for instance. It's the garbage that Frank Williams has come out with that galls me more than anything really. He's actually edging towards saying she's gotten there on merit !

[barnettracing]

Wow, at exactly the same time, me and Flavio have posted nearly identical views. Great minds, eh!?

[Flavio Galtieri]

Originally Posted by barnettracing

Wow, at exactly the same time, me and Flavio have posted nearly identical views. Great minds, eh!?

Or disturbed minds. We'll let others choose...

[Paradise City]

Whenever I watched the DTM she was wandering around the back. Of course Ralf Schumacher, F1 race-winner, often kept her company there. I don't think she's without talent. She's a Vanina Ickx type AFAIK.

Is there any driver higher than her in the test driver pecking order? Is Bottas still there? If so she's there as a paying decoration, which is becoming a very common practice, Lotus F1 Team blazing the trail with this profitable trade of having countless, well paying so called 'development-drivers' in a sport that allows little testing.

[wnut]

Originally Posted by barnettracing

I think you're quite right. But, hypothetically, how does it look to the general public if Susie is 5, 6, 7 seconds slower than the next slowest car at the test she does? It doesn't look very good for women then, does it? I mean, it would show that women can and do drive F1 cars, but that they drive them a lot slower than men.

I suppose in her defence of the above situation, she would be an F1 rookie and it would be useful to see a male F1 rookie on the same day to at least give some sort of lap time comparison.

Whether male or female, merit would always be preferable to money. I mean, when Max Chilton got the Force India test, there were similar sort of opinions being voiced about a male racing driver.

There have been some very skilled woman over the years.
Desire Wilson would not have to apologize to anyone, it is a huge pity she was never given a proper chance in F1!
Shirley Muldowney was as good as anyone in top fuel dragsters, and Danica Patrick despite taking a lot of criticism is a pretty good driver.

[Jimmy Magnusson]

Originally Posted by wnut

There have been some very skilled woman over the years.
Desire Wilson would not have to apologize to anyone, it is a huge pity she was never given a proper chance in F1!
Shirley Muldowney was as good as anyone in top fuel dragsters, and Danica Patrick despite taking a lot of criticism is a pretty good driver.

I think the point was that Susie, with her experience and accomplishments, is probably going to be pretty slow and thus a poor advertisment for women in F1. A good advertisment would be quick. Simona de Silvestro could probably put in laptimes that were competitive enough. Also, Bernie's comment that

Originally Posted by Bernie

If Susie is as quick in a car as she looks good out of a car, then she will be a massive asset to any team

Is pretty sleazy if you ask me. Yeah, great way to welcome diversity into the sport there BCE.

[wnut]

Originally Posted by Jimmy Magnusson

I think the point was that Susie, with her experience and accomplishments, is probably going to be pretty slow and thus a poor advertisment for women in F1. A good advertisment would be quick. Simona de Silvestro could probably put in laptimes that were competitive enough. Also, Bernie's comment that



Is pretty sleazy if you ask me. Yeah, great way to welcome diversity into the sport there BCE.

Fair enough.
I would like to see a top class woman do really well in F1. (Desire Wilson would have, she was that good!)

BCE being a TROLL again. Hope one of his daughters kicks him in the nuts.

[davyboy]

Originally Posted by wnut

BCE being a TROLL again. Hope one of his daughters kicks him in the nuts.

They'd be kicking fresh air if they did.

[Bononi]

Originally Posted by davyboy

They'd be kicking fresh air if they did.

[Richard B]

I'm sure Susie used to share a house with Adam Carol, they'd have been better off putting him in the Williams

[ralf fan]

Williams are back!!!

My favorite team. Won a race on pure pace.

[bjohnsonsmith]

Doesn't look like anything's holding them back now; keep it up.

[wnut]

Originally Posted by ralf fan

Williams are back!!!

My favorite team. Won a race on pure pace.

Great job!

[Bononi]

Go for it Williams !

[nobster]

What was holding Williams back..... Maybe it was Sam Michael, he went to Mc Laren and look what went wrong there the last few races....

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by nobster

What was holding Williams back..... Maybe it was Sam Michael, he went to Mc Laren and look what went wrong there the last few races....

Possibly; Sam Michael joined Williams in 2001 but they'd previously gone through that rather bad patch from 1998 - 2000.

[stripedcat]

Whenever they have the Renault engine, they seem to make magic! I think it helps, but aero is probably still the most defining factor in F1.

I just hope that Williams don't have a falling out with Pastor and he leaves them.

[phoenix]

My guess at what was holding Williams back is three-fold and the following are the changes that have changed their fortunes:

One is the change in senior management - and not just those who have arrived relatively recently but also those who have left senior posts. The second is the banning of blown diffusers, which so few teams seemed to get to grips with (for whatever reason) leaving Williams free to explore and develop more understood design options. The third is the change of engine. The recent performance may be helped by an advantage in power from the Renault engine over the Cosworth, but this is unlikely in my view. More likely is that the Renault engine and mapping gives a "better", more useable power delivery than Cosworth have managed to achieve - so far. The Renault engine is also renowned to be fuel efficient - perhaps leading to lighter cars being on the grid at the start of the race.

With Aero being so, so important, Jason Somerville as Head of Aero, with a recent past involving senior aero responsibility and experience working at Toyota followed by Lotus/Renault is obviously a contributing factor towards 2012 performance. And with Mark Gillan as Chief Operations Engineer, who himself has a great depth of recent and relevant experience in aero, but also with in-depth experience and understanding of overall car dynamics, would, I suggest, lead to an engineering team at Williams where chassis dynamics and the requirements of aero are brought together at the design stage - and in on-going development too - with a great understanding of the importance of each and little conflict between the two which can exist in teams. These two have also worked together previously (at Toyota) so presumably get on well together. It is, afterall, overall chassis dynamics that largely determines how a car uses it's tyres - so important this season - the other contributing factors being the drivers, the circuits and temperatures.

I hope that Williams are out of the doldrums now and will continue to enjoy success. The more front-running teams the better, as far as I am concerned.

[stripedcat]

Yeah, I would go along with all you have said.

The Renault engine probably has a bit more power than the old Cosworth(although probably not that much, what with the ban on engine development). I agree, it is probably a lot more driveable than the Cosworth one.

I think I heard that the Williams' car has a smaller gearbox than the other cars. That helps with weight and balance.

The ban of blown-diffusers helps. Although we have seen Mercedes have gone for a clever option(sort of) with their DRS F-duct thingy(helps with aero). I suspect it won't be long before Mr. Newey works his magic on the Red Bull.

[OZ_HCR32]

So, seven races in I am going to call it. I have again flip flopped with regards to my view of Senna. His performances at Renault-Lotus last year made me sit up and ready my apologies to the guy. I rate him as an individual...but Frank must be starting to worry about his decision.

I cant help but think that Rubens with all his enthusiasm and drive would be far better for Williams this year.

You would persevere with Senna if the other car was performing, and amazing at Maldanado's win was, he as dropped cars in points scoring positions, crashed into others attracting penatlies and with WCC points attracting millions of dollars, Williams have finally got a good car again, similar to start of 2009 and yet dont have pilots that can deliver.

Anyone know how long the contracts are for the current pilots?

[Bononi]

Originally Posted by OZ_HCR32

I cant help but think that Rubens with all his enthusiasm and drive would be far better for Williams this year.

Yeah, I guess he would do better than Senna.