the end for the 911?

tblincoe · 26 Nov 2004, 17:22 (Ref:1165013)

with the introduction of a two-car factory effort of the Esperante eGT-LM in the ALMS, a two-car Esperante effort from Larbre as well as a two-car 360 GTC effort from Cirtek in the LMES, and GPC expanding to a two-car 360 GTC effort in the FIA GT, was 2004 the last year of Porsche domination in the GT ranks, esp. with the new V8 M4 and Ferrari F430 hitting the streets?

class4v · 26 Nov 2004, 17:27 (Ref:1165021)

tblincoe, do you think that an Esperante will meet the FIA NGT ruling?
Don't worry, the 997 GT3 RSR will be a winner

**Aysedasi** · 27 Nov 2004, 07:59 (Ref:1165449)

In answer to the opening question, I doubt it very much. It would be great to see more variety and a lot less 911 derivatives, but the end? No, I don't think so.......

Fab · 27 Nov 2004, 09:28 (Ref:1165496)

I posted in the FIA-GT thread about a possible AM GT2 (Vantage V8) too...

**Dani Filth** · 27 Nov 2004, 09:37 (Ref:1165498)

there will not be a M4 . and even more . it will probably be a inline 6 again . AFAIK

BSchneiderFan · 27 Nov 2004, 11:54 (Ref:1165584)

That flies in the face of all the rumours we've been hearing, which suggest that coupes will be even-numbered (thus M4) and that the straight-six is pretty much at the end of its development life and a V8 will be used for the performance version of the new 3 series.

gwyllion · 27 Nov 2004, 14:34 (Ref:1165655)

Quote:

Originally posted by BSchneiderFan
That flies in the face of all the rumours we've been hearing, which suggest that coupes will be even-numbered (thus M4) and that the straight-six is pretty much at the end of its development life and a V8 will be used for the performance version of the new 3 series.

Yes, the M3/4 is rumored to have a 400 hp 4 liter V8 derived from the 5 liter V10 in the M5/6. We will have to wait a bit for this car as the new 3 series is scheduled for (early) mid 2005.

Chevyguy · 27 Nov 2004, 21:52 (Ref:1165841)

Back to the original question, I don't think that the 911 is going anywhere. I don't know about FIA, but the 360 has only pulled off one victory in ALMS, and the Esperante has yet to put a solid race together. History has shown that BMW is the only company that really take it to Porsche in GT.

panoz.lmp1 · 28 Nov 2004, 10:02 (Ref:1166086)

Quote:

Originally posted by class4v
tblincoe, do you think that an Esperante will meet the FIA NGT ruling?
Don't worry, the 997 GT3 RSR will be a winner

Im sure that the 996GT3-RSR is a winner in 2005. The 997GT3-RSR is possible for 2006

**Dani Filth** · 28 Nov 2004, 10:59 (Ref:1166111)

we don't know if it's gonna be a F430 GTC . besides a BMW(IF) works effort the 430 could be the porsche main rival

**FIRE** · 28 Nov 2004, 13:22 (Ref:1166182)

Quote:

Originally posted by tblincoe
with the introduction of a two-car factory effort of the Esperante eGT-LM in the ALMS, a two-car Esperante effort from Larbre as well as a two-car 360 GTC effort from Cirtek in the LMES, and GPC expanding to a two-car 360 GTC effort in the FIA GT, was 2004 the last year of Porsche domination in the GT ranks, esp. with the new V8 M4 and Ferrari F430 hitting the streets?

I hope the non-Porsches can win some races, but I think at the end the 911 will be champion.

Karl Kling · 28 Nov 2004, 18:43 (Ref:1166365)

Quote:

Originally posted by Dani Filth
we don't know if it's gonna be a F430 GTC . besides a BMW(IF) works effort the 430 could be the porsche main rival

In an interview with Stephane Ratel over at DSC he said he is expecting a racing version of the F430 to enter the scene in 2006. Still nothing certain of course but he may know something we don't...

He also mentioned that Nissan has confirmed that they will race the 350Z in FIA GT, 2005 will be a development year with a full blast in 2006!

I still think that Porsche will be hard to beat, at least in 2005. 2006 will be different though but it all depends on how the development of the Nissan and Ferrari works out.

**PascaLM** · 28 Nov 2004, 22:26 (Ref:1166599)

Porsche are still the cheapest car of GT category and the most reliable. The 911 will have more rivals next years but will be constantly improved.

Fogelhund · 28 Nov 2004, 23:01 (Ref:1166614)

The Nissan is RJN racing, and they raced in 04' already. Hopefully the car becomes more competitive with development.

Let's hope that someone can challenge the 911's on a consistant basis.

alfasud · 29 Nov 2004, 04:57 (Ref:1166734)

Quote:

Originally posted by gwyllion
Yes, the M3/4 is rumored to have a 400 hp 4 liter V8 derived from the 5 liter V10 in the M5/6. We will have to wait a bit for this car as the new 3 series is scheduled for (early) mid 2005.

I read from another source that someone in BMW said there would be no V8 M3, but others reports of the same statements could have been taken a different way. From www.goauto.com.au on 20 October 2004:

"M5 project manager Siegfried Friedman, when asked if the V10 was a modular design that could also be produced as a V8, said: "It depends on what you call modular. We can certainly apply the same design principles to a V8, such as the bedplate crankcase design. We could apply it a V12, for that matter.

"The competition would have a hard time keeping up with a V8 M3."

M5 chief engineer Helmut Himmel confirmed a V8 version of the M5 V10 would be lighter than M3’s current six-pack at the global M5 launch, but wasn’t giving away any secrets about the next M3.

"BMW is stuck with the inline six, it has a great history with the inline engines. We’ll have to wait and see. You will have to draw your own conclusions," he said."

What is certain is that the 2005 M3 will be based on the current E46 shell and will be an inline six:

http://www2.autospies.com/article/in...articleId=3641

So maybe.... just maybe, we could see a roadgoing M3 V8 in 2006 and racing - maybe 2007 or 2008 - who knows?

So with no Ferrari 430 racer or M3 V8 until 2006 at the earliest, it would seem that reports of the 911's demise have been greatly exaggerated.

mikmx · 29 Nov 2004, 09:53 (Ref:1166872)

I don't expect to see an M3 BMW in GT2 will concentrate on the M6 project. Besides according to some the M3 its not a real gt. 430GTC would be very nice!

paul-collins · 29 Nov 2004, 13:51 (Ref:1167036)

M4, folks. The 3 will remain 4-door.

**Aysedasi** · 29 Nov 2004, 14:02 (Ref:1167046)

Quote:

Originally posted by mikmx
Besides according to some the M3 its not a real gt.

Wot!??

This really cannot be true, surely?

**FIRE** · 29 Nov 2004, 17:51 (Ref:1167233)

Quote:

Originally posted by Aysedasi
Wot!??

This really cannot be true, surely?

Don't start....

Bramzel · 29 Nov 2004, 17:57 (Ref:1167245)

Quote:

Originally posted by paul-collins
M4, folks. The 3 will remain 4-door.

afaik the even/uneven/saloon/coupe thing was cancelled by the BMW bosses. So it'll just be a M3 2-door and 4-door, etc.