50's Ford powered Sports Racers

[simon drabble]

At Silverstone on Saturday at teh HSCC meeting I watched the BRDC 50's Sportscar race and was most impressed with the speed of the Rejo Mark IV powered by a Ford pre crossflow engine. When I think of small engined 50's sorts racers I think of Climax engines so it was an eye opener to see one with a Ford engine. What other sportscars/prototypes in period ran competitively with this engine?

[D-Type]

The 750 Motor Club ran races for two classes of sports car 750 Formula for Austin Seven specials and the 1172 Formula for Ford Ten specials. these included Lotus Mk VI, Seven and Eleven, Elva Mk 1 & 2, Ginetta, Dellow (although this was more of a trials car). I think the first Terrier was an 1172. So there were quite a few potent little Ford-engined cars about.

There was a whole mini industry serving the would-be special builders: a feature on special builder's components in a 1958 Motor Sport included fibreglass bodies from Ashley, Convair, Falcon, Kenmar, Markham Peasey, Microplas, Peel, RGS, Rochdale, and Super Acessories. 'Chassis tuning equipment' could come from Alexander Engineering, L M Ballamy for suspension including his patented IFS, Buckler chassis, Gibson anti-roll bars, Woodhead-Monroe or Koni shock absorbers, Schofield differentials, Servais silencers.

[simon drabble]

weren't they more road giong specials rather than a Rejo or Widi or similar which were really sports prototypes.. Lotus VI I guess is the obvious candidate but presumably Lotus 11 ran with Ford engines as well as Climax.

As these are basically FJ engines tecjhnology has come on leaps and bounds and I think its fair to say that they now outperform 1100 climax engines and possibly 1220 but not sure about that

[D-Type]

I'm not that good on Ford engines. By 'pre crossflow' I thought you meant the side valve Ford Ten 1172 engine - E93A or 100E, but if you are talking 'FJ technology' it looks as though you may mean the later Anglia/Classic/Cortina engine - 105E/109E/107E etc. And that's a whole new ballgame.

[simon drabble]

Originally Posted by D-Type

I'm not that good on Ford engines. By 'pre crossflow' I thought you meant the side valve Ford Ten 1172 engine - E93A or 100E, but if you are talking 'FJ technology' it looks as though you may mean the later Anglia/Classic/Cortina engine - 105E/109E/107E etc. And that's a whole new ballgame.

well to be honest I am not sure of the different variations. I do know that the Rjo that ran at Silverstone on Saturday was running a Ford engine. I presume it would be the same tyoe that ran in Formula Juniors of the time. By all accounts you can get 110 bhp out of these now and potentially be more competitive than an 1100 Climax engine. The interesting point of course is that the running costs are considerably less than a Climax where you are basically held to the mercy of 2 possibly 3 engine builders!

[GORDON STREETER]

Unless the rules are "flexible"the Kent type engine didn't come out untill 59 so I doubt if any of these type of sportscars had this engine fitted from new.
Most as pointed out were 1172 100E or the old Consul 4 cyl heavy lump.
There might have been a few works prototype's with the "new" 997 in 59.

[simon drabble]

the cut off is 1960. Just to show my ignorance is the 997 lump the one that the FJ's run and would 110 bhp be realistic from one or does that sound like the "Kent" one?

[GORDON STREETER]

Yes Simon. But in period 110bhp wasn't obtainable for a couple of years claimed by Cosworth.

[simon drabble]

I think that is the interesting thing - the Climax engine development was done in period, the Climax engines today are probably not putting out a lot more power than they were yet ford engines are today a lot more developed. Interestingly Alfa GTA engines are the same as Climax engines, its the Lotus Twin Cam that has come on so much

[zefarelly]

most Ford 50's cars rann the 1172 side valve ( often with Willment/Aquaplane OHV conversions) I think what Simons referring to is a late 50's Rejo which is running a 105e precrossflow engine, so yes these days it would be running FJ spec, as does the Diva GT and others of that ilk.

to find a genuine 50's 105e engined sports racer will be as hard as my quest to find an affordable 1500 precrossflow one, there where lots made as one offs or road car/club racers but no manufacturer ever went racing on an International level.

Tornado Talisman and Rochdale Olympics are 2 on my hit list, as well as the Diva GT ( or Heron Europa )

[zefarelly]

Cosworth where the firsdt to get decent power from the 105 precrossflow, and from memory ( read in books, not the time) Keith Duckworth really struggled with cam timing until he hit on the now famous A2 and A3 designs which was around 1962

As Gordon has pointed out to me, there are now shopping cams, things have moved on somewhat in the last 45 years . . .I run an A6 and he runs an A8

[simon drabble]

Originally Posted by zefarelly

As Gordon has pointed out to me, there are now shopping cams, things have moved on somewhat in the last 45 years . . .I run an A6 and he runs an A8

that is an engine builder's joke clearly as it was lost on me! I thought you were talking about Audi Estates!!

[zefarelly]

Originally Posted by simon drabble

I thought you were talking about Audi Estates!!

Thats a city slickers joke obviously, I thought you were talking about german farms

[GORDON STREETER]

I remember we had a Tornado Talisman for sale at a garage I worked at when I left school. It had sidedraughts and all the raz, but it only had a 1340 classic engine in it. I hope the buyer didn't rev it more than 4500.
Zef Elva used to list an oh inlet valve kit for the sidevalves and I think that's the most common one used , Mind you there's a lot of innovitve people out there as you have found out !

[GORDON STREETER]

Although the Ford 105E dirived engine was probably the first normal aspirated
engine to get 100 bhp from a true 1 litre, Mercedes Benz were getting 275 bhp from their 2.5 litre M196 in 1954 and in 1955 was upped to 290bhp . So they were the first to get the 100bhp per litre I think.

[Eric Falce]

The 105e was the first one to get 100bhp per litre,but it wasnt only Cosworth who got that power,two or three other tuners got there,or claimed.Not until the 5 main bearing engine came along did the power realy get going,that wasnt untill the 60s.

[zefarelly]

the TT was homologated at 1340cc but produced as a 1500 also, a shame they never homologatred it at 1500, although given the MArcos wasn't homologated until 1996 . . .anythings possible

100 BHP per litre was done long before Fod/Cosworth I'm sure, I think the notable difference is that they where out and out racing car engines and the 105 engine is a cooking lump thats been tuned, which is half the fun !

[terence]

Back on the subject of Side Valve Engines,I remember when I first started work,my forman had an Aquaplane OHIV+twin Solex,es fitted to his 100e Pop,it also had a three speed close ratio box fitted,it would blow off any 105e!

[GORDON STREETER]

Terence A mate of mine had a 100e van with a tweeked engine and the close ratio 3 speeder. We could never pull away on a hill without murdering the clutch as it used to do about 30 mph in 1st gear !

[terence]

It must have been the same type of box Gordon.

[Eric Falce]

My first car was a 1932 Austin 10,that came fitted with a standard sophisticated 4 speed box,top speed 44 mph in 3rd,38 in 4th,except downhill!

[GORDON STREETER]

Eric You should have kept it, it would probably handle better than the Fiasco !