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Old 23 Apr 2012, 20:11 (Ref:3064474)   #376
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Racing craft for idiots.
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Old 23 Apr 2012, 21:32 (Ref:3064522)   #377
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What's the good of a one move rule when drivers take it to include one reckless move?
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Old 23 Apr 2012, 22:25 (Ref:3064552)   #378
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What about a "no move" rule ? Or that would be confusing and static ?
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Old 24 Apr 2012, 05:11 (Ref:3064634)   #379
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Should Hamilton not have been penalized for getting of the track and gaining an advantage?
I personally thought Rosberg at fault but am willing to accept that I was decieved by the camera angle and he didn't actually crowd Lewis off track, in that case Lewis clearly deserved to be penalised as he couldn't have completed his move without the four wheels off. After watching silly racing incidents attract pointless counterproductive penalties race after race over the last couple of years we now see a blatant infraction (by someone) go unpunished. I'm confused.
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Old 24 Apr 2012, 09:41 (Ref:3064747)   #380
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Hamilton making a pass while completely off the track turns F1 into a complete farce. He should have been asked to concede position or receive a drive through.

Cars which are off the track should always concede right of way to those who are on the track. Also, someone should tell Hamilton that F1 cars have very effective breaks which can slow a car very quickly - when, after partially pulling alongside, it became clear he could not make the move, he should have stabbed the breaks and fallen in behind.

Blatant example of the pro-British bias in F1. You could guarantee that if a Ferrari driver did that, he'd be penalised.
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Old 24 Apr 2012, 09:45 (Ref:3064749)   #381
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What about a "no move" rule ? Or that would be confusing and static ?
Did you watch 2004-2010?

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Old 24 Apr 2012, 09:46 (Ref:3064751)   #382
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Blatant example of the pro-British bias in F1. You could guarantee that if a Ferrari driver did that, he'd be penalised.
Nope - See Spa 2008.

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Old 24 Apr 2012, 10:13 (Ref:3064766)   #383
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Hamilton making a pass while completely off the track turns F1 into a complete farce. He should have been asked to concede position or receive a drive through.

Cars which are off the track should always concede right of way to those who are on the track. Also, someone should tell Hamilton that F1 cars have very effective breaks which can slow a car very quickly - when, after partially pulling alongside, it became clear he could not make the move, he should have stabbed the breaks and fallen in behind.

Blatant example of the pro-British bias in F1. You could guarantee that if a Ferrari driver did that, he'd be penalised.
Were you drunk when you posted this?
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Old 24 Apr 2012, 11:03 (Ref:3064794)   #384
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Hamilton making a pass while completely off the track
He didn't.

As I posted elsewhere, he took evasive action and yes, ended up all four wheels off the circuit *but* didn't pass until they'd come back on to the circuit. You could argue that he "gained an advantage" by going FWO and not smashing into the rear end of Rosberg's car, but the stewards weren't asked to consider that, only the fact that Rosberg apparently pushed Hamilton off the track.
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Old 24 Apr 2012, 11:12 (Ref:3064801)   #385
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When I first saw it on Abu Dhabi TV and listening to Five Live, the Hamilton moment made me yell out loud. But when I saw the same thing on the BBC highlights later, DC was a bit more circumspect. Was it because when they put the highlights commentary on they'd viewed it a few times?

It was the same thing with the Alonso phantom pit stop. When I first saw it I didn't realise he was using Kobayashi to open his DRS. Yet DC said it straight away.
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Old 24 Apr 2012, 11:47 (Ref:3064816)   #386
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What about a "no move" rule ? Or that would be confusing and static ?
This was the rule in 2000s ChampCar/IRL/IndyCar. It was quite incident prone, as the drivers had the habit of trying hopeless outbraking manoevers, and the driver trying to make the pass often ended up T-Boning the car in front.

This rule was quite unpopular, so this year IndyCar adopted similar regulations to 2012 F1. Ironically IndyCar has had more overtaking than before during the 3 first races of 2012, which shows that the "no move" might have not even improved overtaking.

Was the "no move" rule safer though? Perhaps. After all 2 cars colliding at 100kph at a corner apex is less dangerous than 1 car going airbone at 200kph. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KWCRCP6GO44

But on the hand, didn't it also make the racing "gimmicky", and less "pure"? Probably.
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Old 24 Apr 2012, 11:59 (Ref:3064827)   #387
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He didn't.

As I posted elsewhere, he took evasive action and yes, ended up all four wheels off the circuit *but* didn't pass until they'd come back on to the circuit. You could argue that he "gained an advantage" by going FWO and not smashing into the rear end of Rosberg's car, but the stewards weren't asked to consider that, only the fact that Rosberg apparently pushed Hamilton off the track.
If we are going to be that precise: when a driver leaves the track, he should enter it again at the same position, wich was obviously far away from where he did rejoin the track. He should have put the car in reverse, try to guess where he was when he left the track and rejoin over there.
Offcourse that would be rediculous and dangerous, so just giving the place back to Rosberg would be a nice compromise.
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Old 24 Apr 2012, 12:04 (Ref:3064830)   #388
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What about Vettel in Monza? He also gained a position on Alonso off the track.
No, he did not. Vettel had only his left wheels of the track, and when you have at least 1 wheel on the white line marking the edge of the track, you are officially on the track.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-ombMoblIKg
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Old 24 Apr 2012, 12:04 (Ref:3064831)   #389
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nah, the beeb guys commentate live, it's who we get in Canada.
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Old 24 Apr 2012, 12:18 (Ref:3064837)   #390
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Fair enough and thanks, it wasn't a critiscism.
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Old 24 Apr 2012, 12:43 (Ref:3064851)   #391
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Blatant example of the pro-British bias in F1. You could guarantee that if a Ferrari driver did that, he'd be penalised.
Just wow.
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Old 24 Apr 2012, 13:09 (Ref:3064871)   #392
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Fair enough and thanks, it wasn't a critiscism.
never thought it was
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Old 24 Apr 2012, 13:12 (Ref:3064874)   #393
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If we are going to be that precise: when a driver leaves the track, he should enter it again at the same position, wich was obviously far away from where he did rejoin the track. He should have put the car in reverse, try to guess where he was when he left the track and rejoin over there.
Offcourse that would be rediculous and dangerous, so just giving the place back to Rosberg would be a nice compromise.
Indeed it would be ridiculous and dangerous - and in fact a breach of the rules which (paraphrased) state that a driver should rejoin safely in a manner which does not impede other competitors, and also that driving against the normal circuit direction isn't permitted. But hey, that's just hair splitting

However, regarding precision: if you read the steward's decision on both of Rosberg's moves, they were *incredibly* precise in their wording. Which, as they were dealing with fact and not supposition, is exactly as it should be.

The stewards weren't asked to investigate an off-track overtake, because on review of the incident - there wasn't one.

If Hamilton had deliberately moved off the circuit, unprovoked, and overtaken Rosberg then I could understand everyone calling for his head on a platter... but he didn't, so I don't!
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Old 24 Apr 2012, 13:26 (Ref:3064882)   #394
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....... if you read the steward's decision on both of Rosberg's moves, .........
what!
ruin a good rant by the regulars?
heaven forfend!

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Old 24 Apr 2012, 13:33 (Ref:3064885)   #395
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Blatant example of the pro-British bias in F1. You could guarantee that if a Ferrari driver did that, he'd be penalised.
Uhn... utterly nonsense.
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Old 24 Apr 2012, 13:52 (Ref:3064897)   #396
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I thought this guy usually posted sense?

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Old 25 Apr 2012, 04:16 (Ref:3065237)   #397
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Take a look at these and then tell me why you think that Rosberg forced Hamilton or Alonso off the track?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_iQurrE15bA

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9OPOn...feature=relmfu

In both cases, Rosberg made one move, and in both cases the following car was either fully behind Rosberg (in the case of Hamilton) or not fully alongside (in the case of Alonso).
How the hell does F1 management think it benefits their cause to pull down video clips like these. They provide them with free publicity, and greatly enrich their sport.

Greed before all else!
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Old 25 Apr 2012, 10:42 (Ref:3065298)   #398
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How the hell does F1 management think it benefits their cause to pull down video clips like these. They provide them with free publicity, and greatly enrich their sport.

Greed before all else!
Well, they did show that Rosberg did not force Alonso or Hamilton off the track. But now, you'll just have to take mine and the stewards word for that.
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Old 25 Apr 2012, 14:07 (Ref:3065410)   #399
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How the hell does F1 management think it benefits their cause to pull down video clips like these. They provide them with free publicity, and greatly enrich their sport.

Greed before all else!
It's because FOM doesn't understand new media, never have.

Other series not only allow fans to post copyrighted material online but post their own videos regularly. They will say it's about "protecting their intellectual property" but it's actually just petty and as you say, does very little to help the sport grow.
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Old 25 Apr 2012, 14:23 (Ref:3065420)   #400
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It's because FOM doesn't understand new media, never have.

Other series not only allow fans to post copyrighted material online but post their own videos regularly. They will say it's about "protecting their intellectual property" but it's actually just petty and as you say, does very little to help the sport grow.
This is not limited in anyway to F1. There are thousands of examples of this. Lets not open that can of worms thought
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