Would a Trenton-esque tri-oval work?

[Yannick]

Hello MyTrackers,

here is another thread to inspire your creativity. Trenton Speedway, at Trenton, New Jersey, which used to be a US-open-wheel racetrack up until 1980, was one of the rare oval tracks which has got a right turn (the only other I can come up with at this point being Brooklands).

From 1968 until its demolition in 1980, it ran in this configuration:
.

Another concept of oval racing is the Tri-oval superspeedway (e.g. Daytona, Lausitzring, Talladega). Now, I wonder if a combination of both concepts would work - and if drivers might enjoy it, or if this would be deemed too dangerous.

Do you think a Trenton-esque Tri-oval would work, and how might one look like?

Enjoy the holidays later on in the month!

[SpeedingTortoise]

This reminds me of your "distorted oval" concept but there are a few concerns with it. Firstly I think this would only work if the oval was either flat (10° or less banking maybe) or have long straights and comparatively slow corners, similar to Pocono. I say this because the pit lane would have to start at Turn 4 and go on the inside of turns 5,1,2 and then exit or be on a straight long enough to have entry and exit on the same straight. A conventional tri-oval has the pit lane on the inside of the corner so there are no problems there.

I have came up with a few different examples of what could be done.

1. A standard tri-oval.
2. An "inverted" tri-oval.
3. A double tri-oval to create a right turn.
4. "The Banana". Standard tri-oval with an inverted tri-oval replacing the backstraight.

To me, 3 and 4 are borderline road courses and remind me of your "distorted oval" concept.

[SKG]

Great topic.

Of the 4 alternatives you've show, I find it hard to visualise how the racing would pan out (good or bad). I feel that option 4 could potentially work since it retains the relatively safe superspeedway-style "pit road".

Would the right turn characteristics match up with the traditional left turns, with regards to track width, corner radius, banking etc. ?

[AoB Special Stage]

Trenton's was a kink, but these seem like harder bends. I played such a course in an old game (pre 2002?) and it had high banking on the kink (higher than the normal corners).

[SpeedingTortoise]

Found an hour long video of an old CART race at the track. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qPJcbsH6ZTg

I noticed during the video that Turns 1 and 2 are flatter than 3 and 4 and the dogleg has a slight camber to it. I have also thought (this is only a theory) that when building Trenton Speedway, the owners wanted an egg shaped oval like Darlington however there was something in the way, possibly houses that can be seen in the video, and that forced the dogleg design. Thoughts??

[Vepe]

Originally Posted by SpeedingTortoise

Found an hour long video of an old CART race at the track. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qPJcbsH6ZTg

I noticed during the video that Turns 1 and 2 are flatter than 3 and 4 and the dogleg has a slight camber to it. I have also thought (this is only a theory) that when building Trenton Speedway, the owners wanted an egg shaped oval like Darlington however there was something in the way, possibly houses that can be seen in the video, and that forced the dogleg design. Thoughts??

IIRC, the original track was shorter (first turn where the dogleg is) and the dogleg came from extending the track.

[Yannick]

Thank you guys for your participation in this discussion. SpeedingTortoise, what does the banking look like for your concept #2? For it to be an oval, the kink would have to be flat because having it banked in the same direction as the corners might be too dangerous.

I would not consider Concept #3 to be an oval at all, but rather a "distorted oval" type of road course indeed, as you said.

Concept #4, the "Banana", as you call it, fits best to what I had in mind when first starting this thread. I like that concept, and with a flat kinked backstretch, it could well be as racy as Trenton itself.

However, I'm surprised nobody went for a triangular superspeedway of Lausitzring shape and put kinks in the two straights that don't have the pitlane. As a result, the first kink would be between Turns 1 and 2, and the 2nd between Turns 2 and 3. Also, since the kinks would need to be flat or very lowly banked (1°? 2°?, 2.5°?), Turn 2 would have to be flat as well, which is quite a challenge on a 2 mile long superspeedway.

Now if somebody would also like to present an assymetrical design, too, please feel free to post away! Thanks for the discussion.