[Race] Singapore Grand Prix

[F1Guy]

Originally Posted by RWill2073

For someone supposedly clued in, you should know he spun on fluids from the damage from turn one.

Clued in? Who me?? Nope sorry. But I am flattered.

I listen and take into consideration comments from some of the more "clued in" current and former professional drivers, who have mostly said Vettel's crash was due to him just being a little too eager on the go faster pedal. And the dripping coolant (which was dripping from the very back of the car onto a WET track anyway), had no effect on him losing control. The track was already WET. And Vettel was on INTERMEDIATE tyres for the WET conditions. As I said, the coolant was dripping from the very rear of the car anyway - as you can see in the photo below.



Adding to that Vettel took the wrong line out of T3 before he spun. Any half decent racing driver knows to stay off the racing line in wet conditions as it's got no grip, specially on cold tyres. But Vettel didn't. Have a look at the video below and look at the line Hamilton took compared to Vettel out of T3.

https://youtu.be/czHPM0UjLNc?t=3m1s

Originally Posted by RWill2073

I didn't see Ricciardo being called overrated for spinning on his own after he got damage from the incident with Verstappen in (I think) Hungary.

To read a comment like that from someone "clued in" is really disappointing. Let's see, I seem to remember the weather being bone DRY in Hungary. And RIC was on slicks. The tiniest bit of coolant onto a slick tyre in the dry and any driver is likely to loose control. Have a look at the photo below. Note the very shiny left rear tyre on Ricciardo's car, just before he spun out in Hungary.



Again, just in case you missed it. The weather was DRY, and Ricciardo was on slicks. Bit of a different situation I would think to Vettel who was on a WET track and with wet weather tyres (??). But then again, I'm not as "clued in" as you so.. no point continuing really.

Have a good day.

[Mike Bell]

Originally Posted by F1Guy

. And the dripping coolant (which was dripping from the very back of the car onto a WET track anyway), had no effect on him losing control. The track was already WET. And Vettel was on INTERMEDIATE tyres for the WET conditions. As I said, the coolant was dripping from the very rear of the car anyway - as you can see in the photo below.

Not suggesting you're wrong, but according to C4 the fluid was coming from his trashed left side pod. That would allow it to get onto his left rear tyre, which is commensurate with what happened. Obviously the fluid would run along underneath the car as well? If they use some form of non water based coolant in F1, some types are as dangerous as oil if they get on the track. Banned in some racing in the USA, I believe.

[RWill2073]

Originally Posted by Mike Bell

Not suggesting you're wrong, but according to C4 the fluid was coming from his trashed left side pod. That would allow it to get onto his left rear tyre, which is commensurate with what happened. Obviously the fluid would run along underneath the car as well? If they use some form of non water based coolant in F1, some types are as dangerous as oil if they get on the track. Banned in some racing in the USA, I believe.

Shhh.... He has an agenda to push.

To recap, there's a gaping hole in front of vettels rear tire, in roughly the same place as ricciardos. There is nothing in that pic that shows fluid coming from behind the tire. There is a line of something, could be fluid, could be a street line, appearing from directly behind vettels rear tire. But Vettel sucks and ricciardo doesn't, so....

[Kempi]

There is fluid dripping from the rear of VET's car, that can be seen in the picture. But what seems to be ignored by certain posters is that the aerodynamic effects will collect fluids that did not hit the tyre and pull it towards the rear of the car.

So the very likely thing that happened is that fluid got on the tyre as well as was dripping from the rear of the car.

[RWill2073]

Originally Posted by Kempi

There is fluid dripping from the rear of VET's car, that can be seen in the picture. But what seems to be ignored by certain posters is that the aerodynamic effects will collect fluids that did not hit the tyre and pull it towards the rear of the car.

So the very likely thing that happened is that fluid got on the tyre as well as was dripping from the rear of the car.

Yep, viewed it from my phone at first, and now that I have seen it larger, I see the fluid in the back too. But that doesn't mean nothing is coming from the gaping hole in the same place as Ricciardo's, or that what you mentioned isn't also happening.

[crmalcolm]

Originally Posted by F1Guy

And the dripping coolant (which was dripping from the very back of the car onto a WET track anyway), had no effect on him losing control.

In the image here you can see the fluid coming out of the radiator, and so will be deposited in front of the rear wheel.



The same fluid will also be swept to the rear of the car which was then visible coming from further rearward also.

Was the Ferrari depositing fluid in front of the rear wheel? - Yes
Did this cause Vettel to spin? - Possibly
Did anyone else get a snap loss of rear traction? - No

So I would suggest that it is highly likely (but not certain) that the leaking fluid contributed to the spin.

[Greem]

Exclusive: I just phoned Seb. He told me that he spun because of the shock wave created by Max, Fernando and Kimi colliding. It was so powerful he just couldn't stop going backwards after the impact.

So there we are, the spin had nothing to with the shredded sidepod, broken suspension, fluids from any exposed orifice or a heavy right foot.

...

Back in reality, does it really matter why Vettel spun? He'd had a clout off his teammate in the T1 chaos, his car was dramatically broken, and he crashed as a result. Or maybe not

[Aysedasi]

Originally Posted by bjohnsonsmith

There are 6 GPs left, so I think another DNF from Hamilton plus another win for Vettel, would give Vettel a fairly comfortable points lead. I don't see that happening but you never know.

I confess I'm struggling to work out why I would want to see that happen, to be honest.......

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by Aysedasi

I confess I'm struggling to work out why I would want to see that happen, to be honest.......

I also said: Vettel has chastised himself. Hamilton has now got a 28 point lead. Even if he were to have a DNF in Malaysia and Vettel were to win, Hamilton would still be leading, all by 3 points.

If you are not a Vettel fan, then you wouldn't want to see it happen.

[Aysedasi]

Ah, that explains it........


I'd rather just see it go down to the wire at the last GP....

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by Aysedasi

Ah, that explains it........


I'd rather just see it go down to the wire at the last GP....

Me too, but I don't think that will happen. Vettel has a lot of ground to make up and needs a lot of luck.

[marcel82]

I have just one question about the incidents. there's people enough round the internet to point fingers in all directions.

what I've been wondering, since sunday, is why the drivers were happy to just let the cars roll on after the contact.

Sure, you could argue that the first incident, Max en Seb didn't have sufficient damage to want to stop, and Kimi had to much to do so, but still, it was weird.

The second spin on his own though, Seb seemed more concentrated on talking to his pits, than on having the car stop. It basically rolled backwards into traffic and across the track. Lucky it's mostly slow corners, and the drivers have plenty good reflexes, this could have created another incident. You'd think he'd stomp the brakes?

It seemed so silly to me, I started to actually think it might have been something wrong with the car that caused it to properly stop?

[crmalcolm]

Originally Posted by marcel82

I have just one question about the incidents. there's people enough round the internet to point fingers in all directions.

what I've been wondering, since sunday, is why the drivers were happy to just let the cars roll on after the contact.

Sure, you could argue that the first incident, Max en Seb didn't have sufficient damage to want to stop, and Kimi had to much to do so, but still, it was weird.

The second spin on his own though, Seb seemed more concentrated on talking to his pits, than on having the car stop. It basically rolled backwards into traffic and across the track. Lucky it's mostly slow corners, and the drivers have plenty good reflexes, this could have created another incident. You'd think he'd stomp the brakes?

It seemed so silly to me, I started to actually think it might have been something wrong with the car that caused it to properly stop?

In Vettel's case, it seemed to me that he was backing up far enough to see enough track to know it was safe to turn back onto the track?

[Kempi]

That is what I thought as well. Besides, that way he could get out of the way and protect (what was left of) the car.

Remember he saved his championship 2012 by going backwards and not stopping and spinning around immediately when he spun at the start in Brazil. So it is not something he has not done before.

[S griffin]

Does anyone remember the crash at the start of the 2003 German GP? Ralf just like Seb moved into a space that was occupied by two. In both cases, it was Kimi who was the most squeezed out

[chunterer]

Originally Posted by crmalcolm

In Vettel's case, it seemed to me that he was backing up far enough to see enough track to know it was safe to turn back onto the track?

I thought it might have been to try and get tbe race red flagged!

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by chunterer

I thought it might have been to try and get tbe race red flagged!

At the time, I thought that too.

[ScotsBrutesFan]

I have to say that my thought was that he was allowing it to roll backwards as it was rolling away from the exit of the corner, allowing the other drivers more time to see and avoid him.

In terms of the spin that put him in that position, I've not seen anything to confirm it, but my thoughts at the time were that in addition to the leaking fluid onto the rear left tyre, was their damage to the wheel/drive shaft as well, that maybe broke under acceleration leaving all the power going to the right wheel, which may have helped the spin the car quicker.

[old man]

Nigel Roebuck (Autosport) has an opinion, now there's a guy that has seen it all before

[ASCII Man]

It's only too bad he plies his trade for a shite magazine.

[F1Guy]

Anyone read the reports in the Italian press in the last few days? Almost all of the blame going towards Vettel and Ferrari for the "racing incident". Yes that's right, the Italian press is blaming the Italian team and it's Italian driver. Sacrilegious, but true.

La Gazzetta dello Sport, Italy's leading sport news, had this to say on Vettel (translated):

Within hours of the race, the criticism against him was unanimous: If you're playing the World Cup, if you start skating (and so you know that from behind, right or left, arrive much faster than you) you should immediately think of a plan B : what is go unscathed in the first corner and especially do this in front of Lewis Hamilton. Everything else, immediately, should not count more. Should no longer count Verstappen, should no longer count where he chose to leave, it must only count where is Lewis Hamilton. Instead Seb, legitimately, but today we can say, even recklessly when you have less speed, went left to look for trouble, only thinking to cover Verstappen, only thinking to be first to the first corner. Pity that there there was even Kimi. And then, after Saturday's masterpiece, why didn't he make like Raikkonen? If he succeeded, and a 4 time world champion can expect this, today would be just sweet talk. Instead, even thinking about the stunt, dish today Baku, reasonable, 38 points. From here in Abu Dhabi, Vettel will be only that of Saturday. It can't be that on Sunday the finalizer that Ferrari wants between now and 2020.

http://www.gazzetta.it/Formula-1/18-...67155275.shtml

Corriere dello Sport and Tuttosport, two of Italy's other leading news media, have also pointed the blame at Vettel and Ferrari as a team. Even asking how come Vettel was not at least reprimanded for his actions. Which is a good question.

And yet, we have Ferrari's response on twitter below.



What a load of prancing horse ****!


To which, the F1 world responded angrily. A couple of guys in the paddock had this to say:

http://news.sky.com/story/singapore-...storm-11041663

Still don't understand how and why Vettel escaped with not even a reprimand for his actions! I can imagine anyone else in his place would not have escaped with no penalty whatsoever. First Baku, and now this.

[VIVA GT]

Originally Posted by F1Guy

Anyone read the reports in the Italian press in the last few days? Almost all of the blame going towards Vettel and Ferrari for the "racing incident". Yes that's right, the Italian press is blaming the Italian team and it's Italian driver. Sacrilegious, but true.

La Gazzetta dello Sport, Italy's leading sport news, had this to say on Vettel (translated):


http://www.gazzetta.it/Formula-1/18-...67155275.shtml

Corriere dello Sport and Tuttosport, two of Italy's other leading news media, have also pointed the blame at Vettel and Ferrari as a team. Even asking how come Vettel was not at least reprimanded for his actions. Which is a good question.

And yet, we have Ferrari's response on twitter below.



What a load of prancing horse ****!


To which, the F1 world responded angrily. A couple of guys in the paddock had this to say:

http://news.sky.com/story/singapore-...storm-11041663

Still don't understand how and why Vettel escaped with not even a reprimand for his actions! I can imagine anyone else in his place would not have escaped with no penalty whatsoever. First Baku, and now this.

I know Seb's pretty good with the language now, but when did he change nationality?

[RWill2073]

Originally Posted by F1Guy

Anyone read the reports in the Italian press in the last few days? Almost all of the blame going towards Vettel and Ferrari for the "racing incident". Yes that's right, the Italian press is blaming the Italian team and it's Italian driver. Sacrilegious, but true.

La Gazzetta dello Sport, Italy's leading sport news, had this to say on Vettel (translated):


http://www.gazzetta.it/Formula-1/18-...67155275.shtml

Corriere dello Sport and Tuttosport, two of Italy's other leading news media, have also pointed the blame at Vettel and Ferrari as a team. Even asking how come Vettel was not at least reprimanded for his actions. Which is a good question.

And yet, we have Ferrari's response on twitter below.



What a load of prancing horse ****!


To which, the F1 world responded angrily. A couple of guys in the paddock had this to say:

http://news.sky.com/story/singapore-...storm-11041663

Still don't understand how and why Vettel escaped with not even a reprimand for his actions! I can imagine anyone else in his place would not have escaped with no penalty whatsoever. First Baku, and now this.

[loon]

how boring is all of this, it was just a crash!!!

[crmalcolm]

Originally Posted by F1Guy

Still don't understand how and why Vettel escaped with not even a reprimand for his actions!

Because the stewards* decided no further action was required; the majority of the rest of the world accepted that and moved on.



*who under the monitoring and control of the officials ensure the event is run in accordance with FIA regulations