[DTM] DTM 2016

[Bramzel]

I must say I actually like the sound of that...

[Matt]

I'm okay with that.

Even though I can't see Volvo or Lada staying.

[BSchneiderFan]

Zakspeed almost entered Volvos in the DTM when it was resurrected in 2000.

[FIRE]

Originally Posted by BSchneiderFan

Zakspeed almost entered Volvos in the DTM when it was resurrected in 2000.

Still a big mistake by DTM to not allow it.

[Matt]

Originally Posted by BSchneiderFan

Zakspeed almost entered Volvos in the DTM when it was resurrected in 2000.

Yes, but Volvo currently doesn't have a two door in their lineup.

[BSchneiderFan]

Originally Posted by FIRE

Still a big mistake by DTM to not allow it.

I thought it was Volvo which vetoed it?

[kurski]

http://www.motorsport.com/dtm/news/s...heider-846836/
"Selfish" manufacturers threaten DTM's future - Scheider.

[NaBUru38]

Originally Posted by Timo Scheider

There has to be one set of rules and these have to be created by DMSB.
And this is what the manufacturers should work with, whether they like it or not.

The fact that manufacturers decide the technical rules is not the problem.

The problem is the lack of competition, as each manufacturer essentially has a single team (literally in the case of Mercedes). Drivers from the same team don't actually race each other. It's very different from V8 Supercars, where for example Holden teams do race each other.

Also, the calendar is too short and the 18-car grid is too small.

[Metzo]

Originally Posted by BSchneiderFan

I thought it was Volvo which vetoed it?

iirc Volvo didn't give Zakspeed the Permission to enter the cars and one of DTM's Rules is that you need the Permission by the manufactuerer.

[BSchneiderFan]

Originally Posted by Metzo

iirc Volvo didn't give Zakspeed the Permission to enter the cars and one of DTM's Rules is that you need the Permission by the manufactuerer.

That's what I thought.

[FIRE]

Okay so it's a big mistake by DTM and Volvo.

[Starfish Primer]

Volvo now has the big discussion with the V8SC team running their cars. Volvo Sweden wants them stop racing and the team says they don´t have to.

[BSchneiderFan]

Here's a question. Say I'm the head of Callaway (I'm not, to be clear). I want to build six Camaros to race in next year's DTM. Can I? What do I need to do?

[Starfish Primer]

No, unless you are blessed by GM board and you commit to the same level of marketing and promotion of the other manufacturers.

[BSchneiderFan]

So it's a manufacturers' closed shop? A shame. Thinking of the valiant Ruch Mustangs in the old DTM.

[FIRE]

Yep

No chance for privateers to enter.

[Speed-King]

Originally Posted by FIRE

Yep

No chance for privateers to enter.

Eh, not so sure anymore... with manufacturers apparently looking to downsize, I could actually see them changing their mind.

[FIRE]

What would it cost to enter a car full sesaon? So only running costs. Manufacturers lease their cars for little of even free to teams.

[Speed-King]

Originally Posted by FIRE

What would it cost to enter a car full sesaon? So only running costs. Manufacturers lease their cars for little of even free to teams.

Actual cars used to be around €750k under the last ruleset, supposedly cheaper now, but of course that's just the cost of building them, not for development.

I don't think running them is more expensive than running an LMP2 or a GT3 - why would it be?

[DS"]

Originally Posted by Speed-King

Actual cars used to be around €750k under the last ruleset, supposedly cheaper now, but of course that's just the cost of building them, not for development.

Actually Norbert Haug revealed during a DTM race that a current DTM car costs 700-800k €. Development not included. So a private team would need either a rich sponsor or loads of paydrivers to just get a DTM programm off the ground. But even then, you probably wouldn't compete head-to-head with the manufacturers, as their testing and development budget is simply much higher.

[Matt K]

I back DTM's strong manufacturers involvment, for me it's good for sport to have factory teams with their budgets and so on. Thanks to that, there are no paydrivers in the series, so unlike as in present pay-and-drive motorsport world. However, that's a huge shame that since 2000 there were only four manufacturers involved, and BMW only since 2012 while Opel only till 2005. Would be great to see new manufacturers in the DTM.
By the way, I wonder how big DTM drivers' salaries are.

[Speed-King]

By the way, I wonder how big DTM drivers' salaries are.

Had a discussion about that on the old Racing1-Forum a loooong time ago.
From what I remember, you could become a millionaire as a DTM-driver, but it wasn't by any means a certainty. Most of the grid probably didn't make more than a regular upper-middle-class salary. And the millionaire thing was when they still had household names like Schneider and Ludwig and Winkelhock, who were highly marketable and showed up in TV commercials and what not - somehow I don't think today's crop of drivers is nearly as much of an asset to their employers and might consequently be paid less.

[peebee2]

Originally Posted by Matt K

there are no paydrivers in the series

Of course there are, and there have been loads - it's just not quite so visible

[Matt K]

Are you able to name such drivers?

[DS"]

Originally Posted by Matt K

By the way, I wonder how big DTM drivers' salaries are.

I honestly doubt that any drivers makes one million € per year. If I had to guess, I'd say that most just make 150-200k€ per year.