Brabham BT 2

[allenbrown]

Many thanks Denis. I've updated the page.

A photograph or two would be most useful as the BT2 page is phot-free at present. I'd need the permission of the copyright holder of course :-)

[piglos]

You are welcome to use this photo of FJ-3-62 that I took at Phillip Island early last year if it is of use Allen.

[Phil West]

Denis, there is an error in your details of FJ-3-62.

I sold the car to Mike Barker ar the Warwick Farm Tasman meeting, on the
18Th of Feb 68, so if the log book shows 67, it is in error.

There was a lot of engine swapping going on, with cars for sale, & Mike wanted to see me do the times I had been doing, before he took delivery of the car. I then had to deliver it to Melbourne, that night, with him riding shotgun with me.

In practice I did a 1 36.5, which was only 3 seconds slower than Clarkes F1 lap record ar the time.

Phil West

[Phil West]

Piglos, thank you for the kind words. We were pretty happy with the Brabham, although it was nothing like the car it became after a few months more development.

That was my first race in the car, & as we had not finished building the engine for it, I dropped the engine from the X Glen Scott Lotus 20, that I had not then found a buyer for, in the Brabham, for the race. It was a gamble, but I could not stand the idea of missing Bathurst.

It became a habit. I had my first race in the Monaro, & the BT 24 also at Bathurst.

That made it 2 in a row for that engine. I had finished 3Rd outright in 66 with the Lotus. It was getting a bit hard to get a light car to do 100 miles around Bathurst at that time, so, if you finished, you did OK.

My engine developer, Kevin Carrad had an old bike saying, "don't tell me what you won mate, tell me who you beat". After the win in 68, in the BT24 he said, "OK, now you've finished first, so lets see in the next race, if you can beat someone". It was hard to get too big headed with him around.

Phil West

[Denis Lupton]

G'day Phil
I think I wrote 1968, and you're right, '67 is incorrect.
Also , maybe the BT24 you mention was BT23A-1.
Kevin was one of the original characters in racing, and really called a spade a spade,and no more.
Denis

[Marcus Mussa]

I am looking for “period evidence” to show that a BT2 ran before 31/12/63 with a rear anti-roll bar. Has anybody any ideas? My car still runs inboard rear brakes. It seems some of the BT2 cars now running are converted to outboard brakes (BT6 type uprights etc.). Were these conversions done in period? And when was the BT6 first converted to use a rear anti-roll bar? It seems from the cut-out drawings and photos I have seen that they had no rear bar either.
All the best
Marcus

[Bryan Miller]

Marcus,

1] FJ-8-62 , my old car was converted in 1962 by Frank Gardner [ his car ] to outboard discs , many years ago I asked Frank why , typically the answer was the '' bloody engine oil leaks on rear discs ''.
So FJ-8-62 was Franks own car and converted , I also owned FJ-12-62 for many years , that car was subject of a 1963 Sports Car World track test , and that car only ever had outboard discs .

2] I have photo's taken as FJ-15-63 came off the boat from England [ about 20 photo's] and that CERTAINLY does Not have rear anti-roll bar and the front bar is the same as the BT2 s , NON adjustable.

So sorry to spoil your day , however as they only made about 20 BT6s , and as -15 has no rear bar , you could be flogging a dead horse.

Bryan Miller , Chairman , Historic Eligibility Comm, C.AMS.

[allenbrown]

Returning to the thorny subject of the interim 1963 car raced by Denny Hulme on Boxing Day 1972, Denis has sent me a fabulous picture of it. We're no closer to knowing whether it was FJ-13-62 of FJ-1-63 or even if it should be called a BT2 or a BT6 but at least we now know what it looked like.



Allen

[JWRBT2]

Hi Allen, I also have a good copy of the photo of Denis beside the car at Brands Hatch.
One interesting detail is the tiny makers label on the rear of the main body section, (which is just behind the drivers neck). The body section, which came with the car I now have, had this small label. On the label was, from memory, "Fibreglass Specialities, Huntington., England," as compared to "Specialised Mouldings". I have the notation written down in my records, so I can check if you are interested.
The label is the disinctive small rectangular shape, which was the givaway for me.
All I need is a photo taken that day showing the dash area, which would decide the BT2/BT6 question.
Regards,
John Rapley.

[supertiga]

http://www.oldracingcars.info/marques/brabham/bt2/

Brabham BT2 FJ-1-62
1962 Briggs Cunningham (US) for various drivers
1965 David Pabst (US)
1966-68 Thomas Gelb (US)
2006 Wayne Mitchell

Additional info on this chassis to help fill in the missing years from 68 to 06.
Brabham BT2 FJ-1-62
1962 Briggs Cunningham (US) for various drivers
1965 David Pabst (US)
1966-68 Thomas Gelb (US)
1970s Bill Anspach (Fla)(there may be 1 before Bill--possibly Doctor)
????-87(looking for name)(Texas)
1987-2005 W.D. Roland III(La)
2006 Wayne Mitchell

Wayne, do you have the letter from Bill? I do not find it in my stuff.
He stated years he owned.
Wife cleaned up office now cannot find things--Imagine that!!
Trying to get life in order after illness and chemo is worse than being sick.

David

[supertiga]

Allen

Did not have your name in earlier post oooppps! asleep at the wheel.

No edit option so will add as found.


Man from Texas name is Randy Morevant(spl?).

Although I found the BT2 and another formula car in the same barn Randy seem to actually have raced them.
From his description of racing he was an auto-Xer who called it racing.
The repairs done to the BT2 were not usable.(from Bills crash)
The other car was not that bad.
Both were missing engine and box.
Randy said he sent them to his engine man in Dallas or Houston.
Both were leaners.(Bill said BT2 was Holbay?)
The engine man then died and his wife sent all to scrap yard!

Pictures as marked on back from Bill.
Notice it grew wings and fat tires.


1st pic
Testing in West Palm Beach at abandon development.

2nd
Savannah DNF

3rd
Not marked

4th and 5th
After they were "home".

[Marcus Mussa]

To add to the story: Chassis FJ-5-62, ex Jo Schlesser, is now with Michel Rechede in France and is being restored. Michel has the full story/sequence of ownership.

Also Ned Spieker's BT6 is in fact a BT2 (it has the BT2 instrument bulkhead). It could have been an interim model.

Duncan Rabagliati mentioned the other day having established that the Goeldner BT2 is in fact the second MRD (there were two built apparently). DR traced it through the Monoposto Register archives.

[Chris Townsend]

Originally Posted by supertiga

http://www.oldracingcars.info/marques/brabham/bt2/

Brabham BT2 FJ-1-62


Additional info on this chassis to help fill in the missing years from 68 to 06.
Brabham BT2 FJ-1-62
1962 Briggs Cunningham (US) for various drivers
1965 David Pabst (US)
1966-68 Thomas Gelb (US)
1970s Bill Anspach (Fla)(there may be 1 before Bill--possibly Doctor)
????-87(looking for name)(Texas)
1987-2005 W.D. Roland III(La)
2006 Wayne Mitchell

Wayne, do you have the letter from Bill? I do not find it in my stuff.
He stated years he owned.
Wife cleaned up office now cannot find things--Imagine that!!
Trying to get life in order after illness and chemo is worse than being sick.

David

David

Anspach was a Doctor [plastic surgeon]. Gelb told me that he sold the car in Florida but couldn't remember who to

Chris

[supertiga]

Thanks Chris.

Where is/was Gelb living at the time?

Did not know Bill was/is a Doctor.
I do remember him saying that his company "Anspach Effort" manufactured custom/special surgical instruments.
Also that he bought car from up north.(?)
And that it came from a Doctor or Dentist.(?)
My memory is getting old also!(?)

I think bill is still kicking.
I located him through the SCCA RE of Fla(or SE or what ever it is) division of SCCA.
Florida is where/when log book number was issued/stamped on the (updated) roll hoop and that was my only lead other than his name on the car. First digits identify issuing region.
Anyone remember what the first year for log books was?

Wish I would have had the help of you guys here when I had the car.
I would have restored it! Original wheel $$$ was going to hurt.
Wayne--pics please!

[Chris Townsend]

Originally Posted by supertiga

Thanks Chris.

Where is/was Gelb living at the time?

Did not know Bill was/is a Doctor.
I do remember him saying that his company "Anspach Effort" manufactured custom/special surgical instruments.
Also that he bought car from up north.(?)
And that it came from a Doctor or Dentist.(?)
My memory is getting old also!(?)

I think bill is still kicking.
I located him through the SCCA RE of Fla(or SE or what ever it is) division of SCCA.
Florida is where/when log book number was issued/stamped on the (updated) roll hoop and that was my only lead other than his name on the car. First digits identify issuing region.
Anyone remember what the first year for log books was?

Wish I would have had the help of you guys here when I had the car.
I would have restored it! Original wheel $$$ was going to hurt.
Wayne--pics please!

Gelb is still alive and well up in Wisconsin; we talked quite a lot. He sent me a whole load of material connected to the BT2 and his other cars [he quit after a big accident in 1969 with a Chevron FB]. A really good bloke.
(I shared all the BT2 material with Wayne)

If you still have a working number for Bill Anspach I'd find it especially useful as he had a Chevron B34 and a March 80A that I'd like to know more about.

Cheers
Chris

[supertiga]

Chris
I can not locate Bills phone number.

Randy Morvant of Vidor Texas(North of Beaumont TX.) is missing name from ????-1987

I did run across some info.
The entry list and race results for the 74 ARRC.
Save to my pictures then open with windows picture and fax viewer and enlarge to read.

The Anspach special won the race.
Possible that this was the Chevron or March?
Out ran the BT29s and others.
My Dad had BT29(ARRC 69 and 70) and the BT2 was primitive compared to it!

What makes me wonder is the red car(Alexis) behind the BT2 in one of the previous post pictures was found in the same barn in Texas.
An Alexis FB/FC(X-Team Opert X-Anatoly Arutunoff)that is listed in entry list right after the Anspach Special. Interesting.
Charlie Irons driver.
Is this when the 2 cars became stable mates?

More info on Red car here
http://www.apexspeed.com/forums/showthread.php?t=34606

Wayne
Would like to see current pics of car.
If I ever find the file and original pics will send them to you.

David

[supertiga]

I do not know where the Bill Anspach name first showed up.
Bill was /is a Dr.?

Was just looking at pics of this car when it was in my shop I noticed something.

The name on the side of the car is Bud Bakels(driver) Bill Stuartsman(engine builder.)not Bill Anspach.
The car is labled the Laminar special(BT2)

The Laminar corp made surgical instruments.?

I do not know how all of this has become so confused from my end and apologize for it.

Some times I think going through Chemo therapy was not worth the damage to the memory and thoughts---I hope it clears on up even more.
Its been about 2-3 years now and is better?

I would like to edit my post to correct this but the feature does not seem to be available.

From post #46(Markus Mussa) this thread this seems to be the correct answer.

Quote Markus Mussa [[The photos of Wayne’s “car” show an extra instrument hole (compared with my car) and this tallies with the photo of the car used for the Blunsden test which said he drove the first BT2.]]

This is what I found with car and article in front of me when I had car.
Along with rear upper abjustable damper/spring mount and other chassis details that matched.
The only difference I found was the inboard VS outboard rear brakes.

Wayne
I do Apologize for the confusion I may have caused here.
When I realized it my heart fell to my feet.

David

[JagtechOhio]

with apologires for doing so, as I have not read the entire thread and do not know the chassis.

If you get in touch with Rick Capone in West Palm Beach Florida, he might have contact info for Dr. Anspach. Tell them both Andy says "hi".

There was a derelict Formula Junior chassis sitting outside behind Rick's shop in September, 1980. Those are the only nuggets from this nose, good luck sniffing out more info.

[John Dowson]

Hi everyone.

For those who are keeping records up to date I wanted to let you know that I am the proud new owner of FJ-8-62 which I have bought from David Zurlinden. The plan is to race it in the UK and European FJ calendars next year.

[allenbrown]

Thanks for the update John.

[John Dowson]

Thanks to Duncan Rabagliati and Denis Lupton I have updated the history of FJ-8-62 as follows:

1962 Factory car for Frank Gardner(NSW) (many mentions in the Autosport review of the 1962 FJ season - January 25 and February 1 1963 editions). 5th in Goodwood Chichester Cup, DNF at Monaco with clutch problem. Silverstone lap record holder.
1963 Len Deaton (NSW) bought March 1963 raced mainly in NSW
1963 Barry Collerson (NSW) bought late 1963, featured in his book 'Mount Druitt to Monza'
1965 Kevin Pinkstone (NSW) bought September, fitted Ford Twincam for 1966 Tasman, nasty accident at Sandown Park 26 Feb, 1966
1968 John Mellen (NSW) bought mid 1968 used sparingly with FJ engine
1971 John Hillyear/Brian Morrow (NSW) both drivers used car locally
1977 Spencer Bates (NSW) little use but much loved in great condition
1980 Tony Galletly (QLD) bought Nov. 1980 used locally
1982 Brian Miller (NSW) bought Feb 1982, restoration done, little use
1991 Tony Moody (VIC) bought Jan 1991 used sparingly
1991 Ken Hastings (VIC) bought Jul. 1991, full restoration, successfully raced in Historic FJ, many wins and lap records notably Phillip Island. Damaged in an accident.
2001 John Streets (USA) bought in January for his son to drive. Completed repairs.
2003 David Zurlinden (USA) bought Aug 2003. Completed further restoration works. Raced at Monterey Historic (2006-2008) and Goodwood Revival (2008)
2009 John Dowson (UK) bought Sept. 2009 to race in European FIA Lurani Trophy and UK historic events

[Bryan Miller]

John,

Your info. is incorrect , I found and restored car and used the car for many years after tracking down the original gearbox and cylinder head and carbs etc.
The late Spencer Bates purchased car , it had no engine or gearbox so Spencer could not have used car.
Sold to Tony Galletly , Queensland , his ''restoration '' consisted of chrome plating a few rose joints and selling the original rear wheels , car still had no engine/box.
I finally managed to save car and restored fully and correctly and a massive file of every race car had done in U.K. and Australia was with car when sold to Tony Moodie.I used the car quite a lot during the 9 or so years.
Car went from Moodie to Hastings whose son had an accident in car at Phillip Island historics and Hastings had new chassis made in NZ , how accurate I have no idea.
Hastings was approached to sell car back , but declared he would rather sell car overseas.

[edholly]

Hastings was approached to sell car back , but declared he would rather sell car overseas

.

I became aware that car was for sale about the time a buyer was found in the US. In full knowledge that the car was damaged, I tried to reason with Hastings, offered to match any offer, but was told in no uncertain terms he would not sell the car within Australia. He said he had his reasons which I still don't understand.

[Denis Lupton]

In answer to questions on this car, Ken was driving the car at Phillip Island when he noticed the oil pressure gauge showing low pressure, and drove well off the track to investigate. He left the car parked and climbed up on the dam wall to watch the last few laps, and another car left the track and crashed into the parked Brabham., badly damaging the car. Glen, Ken's son, was in the pits watching, and ,in fact, Glen never drove this car at Phillip Island, but did drive it at Eastern Creek. The Repco Brabham BT2 that Glen drove at Phillip Island, at another meeting, was Kelvin Prior's car,FJ-6-62, and, I notice on the Phillip Island Newsletter, is still the lap record holder. I dont know where the story of a NZ chassis came from,but I had never heard of this, and talking to Glen and his mother ,Lorraine,in the last twenty minutes, neither had they. Hope this is of some help.
Denis

[Bryan Miller]

Denis,

Ken told me he was sending the car to New Zealand as it was cheaper , that is all I know , whether this happened or not , this was Ken's explanation to me.

Bryan.