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Old 7 Sep 2008, 16:41 (Ref:2283543)   #51
macca
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macca should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by Speedworx
"Totally justified, imo.

Lewis gained an advantage by cutting the chicane and made a half hearted effort to give the place back.

The reason its 25 secs is he was handed a drive thru penalty, which is around 25 secs. "



Errr....no. Kimi squeezed him off at the second apex, and then out-accelerated him over the line.

Hamilton was behind approaching La Source and just outbraked Kimi, even while on the damper part of the track.
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Old 7 Sep 2008, 16:41 (Ref:2283544)   #52
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yeh but there wasnt a big wall, same as on any other circuit....same as other examples...time and time again, you let the other guy past and then its game on...
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Old 7 Sep 2008, 16:42 (Ref:2283547)   #53
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Duffacus should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
I thought that was real racing for a second there, obviously not. Silly me....
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Old 7 Sep 2008, 16:42 (Ref:2283548)   #54
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jonm2 should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Im not even a Hamilton fan at all, but this stinks way too much. Ill probably watch Monza, but im really considering not watching the rest of the season.
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Old 7 Sep 2008, 16:43 (Ref:2283549)   #55
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Suze should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridSuze should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridSuze should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suze
Why wasn't whatshisname punished for his involvement in the Webber incident? :/
Actually, he got a drive through didn't he? I forgot that one, my mistake, sorry!
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Old 7 Sep 2008, 16:43 (Ref:2283550)   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Speedworx
Totally justified, imo.

Lewis gained an advantage by cutting the chicane and made a half hearted effort to give the place back.

The reason its 25 secs is he was handed a drive thru penalty, which is around 25 secs.
So lets get this right...Hamilton cuts the chicane to avoid an accident and gets the equivalent of a drive through

Ferrari at Valencia nearly causes an accident in the tight confines the pitlane by an unsafe release of Massa and gets the back of their hand slapped and a pocket change fine.

Something clearly isn't right somewhere, and if F1 want's to retain any of it's already failing credibility it needs to get itself sorted out. Starting with overturning Hamilton's penalty
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Old 7 Sep 2008, 16:44 (Ref:2283552)   #57
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BILTEL should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Not at all!!!!!!

How can they fine Ferrari for the pit lane sillyness and yet do this to Lewis!!

WRONG WRONG WRONG!!!
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Old 7 Sep 2008, 16:44 (Ref:2283553)   #58
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Speedworx should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Kimi didn't force Lewis off. Watch the replay and you see Lewis chooses to take that route and cut the chicane. He then doesn't really give the place back (does a gesture to try and avoid the penalty he knows he will get).

He coulda backed off and won legally, but chose not to.

Therefore he gets rightly penalised.

End of story.
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Old 7 Sep 2008, 16:45 (Ref:2283554)   #59
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Funny, I think Hamilton ran Massa wide about 3 times in a race not so long ago and there was no-one bleating about him being 'run off the track'.

Hamilton could have braked and made the chicane but chose instead to maintain position alongside Kimi by cutting the corner. That's an unfair advantage ... he'd not have been so close or able to out break Kimi in the following corner otherwise.
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Old 7 Sep 2008, 16:45 (Ref:2283555)   #60
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Spawinte should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kebab
Lets put this another way, had there been a big wall in the middle of the chicane, Hamilton would have been forced right into it by Kimi turning in on him while knowing right well he was there beside him.

Case closed.
Fixed your post for you.
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Old 7 Sep 2008, 16:45 (Ref:2283557)   #61
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JamesRamone should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
It really is becoming a joke
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Old 7 Sep 2008, 16:45 (Ref:2283558)   #62
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dude you need some new glasses!....kimi clearly forces him wide!.....then hamilton backs off and gets into his slipstream...
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Old 7 Sep 2008, 16:46 (Ref:2283559)   #63
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No
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Old 7 Sep 2008, 16:46 (Ref:2283560)   #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by macca
Errr....no. Kimi squeezed him off at the second apex, and then out-accelerated him over the line.

Hamilton was behind approaching La Source and just outbraked Kimi, even while on the damper part of the track.
That's not the point. McLaren had Hamilton let KR past and checked with Charlie Whiting if that was OK, and Whiting said yes. The FIA effectively led McLaren to believe that they had complied with the rules - which of course they had - and then when Ferrari whined like stuck pigs AFTER the race (so McLaren could not race back into contention) the stewards decided that the most senior official in F1 was wrong. Despite McLaren acting on his words and not having LH let KR past a second time which would still have resulted in LH winning.

Ferrari's part in this is utterly, utterly detestable as well. Can't win by fair means so they win by foul.
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Old 7 Sep 2008, 16:47 (Ref:2283564)   #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spawinte
Fixed your post for you.
OMG, watch the replay ... Kimi had track position on the INSIDE and Hamilton was hung out to dry. Its called racing, and Lewis is pretty good at it ... just made a bad call that time.
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Old 7 Sep 2008, 16:47 (Ref:2283565)   #66
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ralf fan should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridralf fan should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridralf fan should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridralf fan should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by ascarracinguk
dude you need some new glasses!....kimi clearly forces him wide!.....then hamilton backs off and gets into his slipstream...
Sorry mate. I don't think Kimi forced him wide. He just took the racing line. Lewis went in too hot and had to cut the chicane. Still doesn't warrant the sanction though.

1. Because he let him past
2. Because it didn't affect the race outcome.
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Old 7 Sep 2008, 16:49 (Ref:2283567)   #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Speedworx
Kimi didn't force Lewis off. Watch the replay and you see Lewis chooses to take that route and cut the chicane. He then doesn't really give the place back (does a gesture to try and avoid the penalty he knows he will get).

He coulda backed off and won legally, but chose not to.

Therefore he gets rightly penalised.

End of story.
Were you watching the same race as every one else??

How can dropping back and crossing the track behind Kimi not be regarded as giving his place back? He has to be behind Raikkonen to do this !!!
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Old 7 Sep 2008, 16:49 (Ref:2283568)   #68
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yes hung out wide and had nowhere to go but across the chicane....kimi put him there, if hamilton didnt move over then he kimi would have run into him.....
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Old 7 Sep 2008, 16:50 (Ref:2283569)   #69
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What we don't know is whether Lewis 'let' Kimi out-accelerate him after the chicane or whether they were both flat out and Kimi got ahead by a tiny amount anyway ... I imagine that is data the stewards looked at?
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Old 7 Sep 2008, 16:50 (Ref:2283570)   #70
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ralf fan has a very good point...even if hamilton did gain an advantage...which i dont think he did...it didnt affect the result of the race!...
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Old 7 Sep 2008, 16:51 (Ref:2283571)   #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Speedworx
Totally justified, imo.

Lewis gained an advantage by cutting the chicane and made a half hearted effort to give the place back.

The reason its 25 secs is he was handed a drive thru penalty, which is around 25 secs.
Is this comedy value or should I escort you to Specsavers as you wouldn't be able to see it?

Ferrari's pit crew release Felipe Massa in a position as if they were aiming to get his knees under Adrian Sutil's arse and they get fined his christmas tip for the paperboy, and a Prancing Donkey forces a McLaren off ... oh, let's penalise the McLaren.
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Old 7 Sep 2008, 16:51 (Ref:2283572)   #72
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OVERSTEER should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by tator2001uk
no way....
A - forced wide
B - l;ets him past before next corner
C- driver in front wimps on brakes retaken
D - shunted up read
E- shunted harder up the rear by fia t
Absolutely the points I were going to bring up, blatent bias towards towards Ferrari. What was he supposed to do when he was forced wide, drive into him!!?

I hope they appeal, and somehow they win it.
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Old 7 Sep 2008, 16:51 (Ref:2283573)   #73
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Spawinte should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kebab
OMG, watch the replay ... Kimi had track position on the INSIDE and Hamilton was hung out to dry. Its called racing, and Lewis is pretty good at it ... just made a bad call that time.
He was inside for the first part of the chicane, Hamilton was level for the second turn and Kimi knew it so he turned in knowing what would happen. Hamilton could have just kept going if he really wanted to cheat but he slowed and gave the position back and then regained it fairly.
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Old 7 Sep 2008, 16:52 (Ref:2283574)   #74
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Darren Holmes should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
And you think Max brought disgrace to the sport, this is an absolute joke.

a) short of stopping, Hamilton had to cut the corner
b) he handed the place back and got fully behind KR
c) Mclaren checked that it was ok with Charlie
d) KR crashed, therefore any "advantage" he gain was nullified by RK crashing out, i.e. it didn't effect the race result, Hamilton would have won anyway (in theory)

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Old 7 Sep 2008, 16:54 (Ref:2283576)   #75
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Speedworx should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
ensign14: better re-read Dennis' comments;

Quote:
"Of course Charlie can only give an opinion because he is not the stewards, but he gave the opinion that we had probably complied. Charlie is of course a very important opinion to have," he added.
The word PROBABLY doesn't sound convincing.
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