Octagon ( good or bad ) ??

SILVERS95 · 28 Dec 2001, 10:10 (Ref:190289)

When octagon Bought out the Brands Hatch group a acouple of years ago , i thought that this would end up being a bad deal for race fans . When they took over from the BRDC at Silverstone , they then had the monopoly on nearly all major national racing circuits in the uk. But , Except for prices for the British GP which are absolutly crazy , i have to say that so far i think they have done more for race fans than i would ever have thought . Before they bought out Brand hatch lesiure a season ticket for Brands was £230 , after ocagon took over is was taken down to £100 !..thats not alot of money when you think it gets you in to 2 touring cars meetings , 2 powertour meetings ,British superbike , world superbikes , the Festival and every other event there for a whole year...i was impressed.

This year they have gone one better.....For £100 they will give you a adult pass to every CAR RACING event ( except F1 race )at all Octagon circiuts for a whole year....Silverstone , Brands , Cadwell , Outlon , Snetterton . That is such good value !......and if you bought the car racing season ticket through the autosport advert the other week , they gave you 2 of these passes for £100 .....buy one get one free.

Apart from the Formaula 1 prices being a joke ( which it always was under the BRDC ) i think Octagon are doing a good job so far for british motorsport fans......

what do you think ?

Chris Y · 28 Dec 2001, 14:04 (Ref:190400)

I have to say they've impressed me with that season ticket - that's a damn fine way to make motorsport more accessible to more people, and that's needed in this country. They're going to have to try a little harder with the circuits though - I know we have a fair few circuits in the country, but they should put a little more money into the smaller ones, and not just plough money into Silverstone. Some of the facilities in the 'not-so-major' circuits are laughable

Speaking as a club racer - next year costs are going to be higher for us, with compulsory transponders that are going to cost us £160. Race entry fees seem to go up every year - it'd be nice if they went down for a change - just by £20 per meeting for example - that'd help balance the added cost of the transponders, and make people feel a bit happier about coughing up the money every couple of weeks.

I was a bit worried by the merger as well, but I feel they're handling things quite well for the moment, and I think we're in safe hands.

Carrie · 28 Dec 2001, 20:25 (Ref:190563)

The season ticket offer for next year was definitely an unexpected bonus. I wasn't expecting Octagon to do anything like that and it came as a very nice surprise, especially as I would have classed Octagon as being just as bad as BHLG.
Chris makes a very good point about investment in the circuits, something which has been severely lacking at the smaller circuits. The one I go to most often is Oulton and until a couple of years back the facilities there were atrocious (weren't the toilets and grandstands actually condemned by the council!). Things might be slowly improving with new buildings, but with the prices at the restaurant, the public are once again being made to pay extra for what is much needed investment. I think the next step for Oulton and probably for other circuits is to get the grandstands back - we should have something better than the temporary wheeled in affairs we now have.

Les · 29 Dec 2001, 16:41 (Ref:191083)

I think the offer was brilliant and hopefully some who have the season ticket will go to a couple of club races as well.

It does worry me that there will probably be even less money being invested in the circuits - some really do need basic facilities.

AndyF · 29 Dec 2001, 19:08 (Ref:191144)

What Octagon have done for club racing bodes well for the future!

Here's a point to create a few different views:

Do you think it would be advantageous if Octagon owned all the Motorsport circuits in the country, and the BARC and BRSCC would combine (or at least work more closely)??

It would help relieve the problem of too many similar championships, and calendar congestion!

SILVERS95 · 29 Dec 2001, 19:52 (Ref:191162)

......"Do you think it would be advantageous if Octagon owned all the Motorsport circuits in the country ? "

Thats a really hard question.....I never really liked the fact that BRANDS HATCH LEISURE owned the 4 circuits that they did , when OCTAGON Bought BHL and then leased Silverstone from the BRDC i thought it would be a disaster for motor racing in this country.., but on Octagons track record so far ( which is still in very early days ) i thnk are going in the right direction.

So as long as there was a commitee or somethimg that that was put in place and had the power to stop a company ( i.e. OCTAGON ) ripping people off by having the monopoly on British Racing Circuits.....then i would think it could be a good thing. It all comes down to whether Octagon have got the right attitude to club and national drivers , and also the racing fans.....

but from the part evidence so far , i think OCTAGON have shown they do have the right attitude .

Simon Pullan · 29 Dec 2001, 23:23 (Ref:191292)

Octagon should definitely not own all of the circuits. They suddenly shut all of theirs at the start of December without any warning at all leaving just two days at Donington before they shut for winter as well. This left all of us who wanted to test, out in the cold so to speak.

**Stephen Green** · 30 Dec 2001, 10:10 (Ref:191391)

Hmm, this is a tough one to answer. On the whole Octagon have done a fine job so far but, as many of you say money needs to be spent on circuits outside of Silverstone. The problem as I see it is that they are being forced to spend the cash on Silverstone to keep the British Grand Prix. That pressure is coming from Max and Bernie, not something that Octagon relish I suspect. I am assuming that once Silverstone has been brought up to scratch for the FIA, there will be money to invest on other circuits. At the moment though all cash is going in the direction of Silverstone.

As for club racing, I suspect the reason for increased entry fees are twofold.

1. The organising clubs need to make a little extra cash to cover inflationary figures like staff expenses and office rents.

2. That Octagon have probably increased their circuit hire charges to the organising clubs.

As for merging BARC and BRSCC the two biggest race organisers, I'm not sure what benefit we, the public, would gain. I think it would be better for them to work closer together in order to avoid clashes in the calenders, thus allowing those true spectators to attend more race meetings?

Dave Brand · 30 Dec 2001, 19:43 (Ref:191614)

>> That Octagon have probably increased their circuit hire charges to the organising clubs.<<

The Vintage Motorcycle Club cancelled its 2001 race meeting at Silverstone. The reason given was that they could no longer afford it - the hire charge had doubled compared with 2000 & gate money now goes to the circuit, not the organising club. They felt that the increased entry fees they would have to charge to cover this would be unfair to their members.

Octagon is improving facilities for the punters at some of their circuits - Oulton is much improved, mainly, I think, because they are getting very heavily into the 'corporate' business; these facilities don't come cheap, though. Our bike marshals' club asked Oulton & a Holiday Inn to quote for its annual 'do' - Oulton's price was double the Holiday Inn's......and there's no hotel accomodation on site at Oulton!

Nice new marshal's huts at Cadwell!

>>As for merging BARC and BRSCC the two biggest race organisers, I'm not sure what benefit we, the public, would gain. <<

I agree with you on that - why merge two successful clubs which are both getting full grids for race meetings. Fixture clashes are maybe a problem in the south-east, but not up here!

One thing which does concern me about Octagon is that they have a controlling interest in BMP, an organisation which is not too popular in motorcycle racing circles right now, having arbitrarily decided to kill off the British 250cc championship!

Les · 30 Dec 2001, 21:06 (Ref:191672)

I have never liked the idea of a monopoly. You always end up with higher prices and lower standards.

SILVERS95 · 30 Dec 2001, 21:41 (Ref:191693)

But you only end up with higher prices and lower standards if the company that has the monopoly has got the wrong attitude......thats the question..

Do you think Octagon has got the right attitude for the future of national drivers and spectators ???

**Stephen Green** · 30 Dec 2001, 23:40 (Ref:191738)

Dave, I think the charges for circuit hire at Silverstone have come into line with those charged by Octagon elsewhere.

Jonny Apex · 2 Jan 2002, 13:07 (Ref:192666)

The season ticket for £100 (or buy one get one free deal) is superb but please Octago put something into the facilities at some of your tracks.

Smarter toilets and PA systems that work would be great (Snett BTCC they don't even provide a commentator at the chicane which means the commentator in the main box has to guess what's happening until they come back into view at Coram)! I also like the sign for the market on the road leading into Snetterton - Norfolk's number one attraction which doesn't say much for the track. Which is a dump. Ask the poor boys out testing there last year - except they couldn't test fr most of the morning because the circuit was covered in mud from the building work and hadn't been cleaned up.

Going back to the poor PA systems, if ever you've stood at Croft's opening corner and been drowned out by the overloud tannoy (which is truly embarrassing) then you'd perhaps be grateful if the system didn;t work! (as in 2000 when it went down for a minute much to the cheers of the assmebled crowd, only for this to turn to groans when it kicked back into life).

Or what about Donington who seemed to forget to swicth on the tannoy system for us freezing spectators at the ford/renault winter series meeting (although, for some curious reason, it did seem to work in the paddock)!

All right, I know Croft and Doni aren't Octagon, but you know what I mean!

**Stephen Green** · 2 Jan 2002, 14:03 (Ref:192690)

Jonny, just a small point but one that's very relevant.

At BTCC meetings, TOCA bring their own commentators so it's not down to the circuit if there is no-one posted at the chicane.

I do agree with you about poor toilet facilities but, if the season tickets sell like hot cakes as you guys are suggesting, it should give Octagon some extra cash to invest in that area. It's worth writing to Octagon as well, if they don't get feedback from their paying customers about the lack of or poor facilities, they won't be pressured into doing anything about them will they? I have always found a little 'constructive criticism' goes a long long way.

Jonny Apex · 2 Jan 2002, 15:43 (Ref:192745)

Well maybe the fine ladies and gentlemen who run the ten-tenths site might like to pass on our comments to those running the circuits/race meetings.

Stephen - I actually asked the race commentator at Snetterton's BTCC race why there was no-one out at the chicane to help him and he told me that Octagon/TOCA/BMP - whoever it is - refused to pay for one!

**Stephen Green** · 2 Jan 2002, 15:56 (Ref:192750)

Thanks Jonny, I thought there were always two with TOCA but I'm obviously wrong. It all comes down to money in the end doesn't it?

As far as writing to Octagon goes, you will probably get a better response by writing as individuals. That's not to say that 10-tenths couldn't join in, but the more mail they get complaining about lack of decent toilet facilities, the more likely they are to do something. Another aspect to look at is that of mothers of young children who have nowhere to change babies nappies. I know it sounds picky, but if you are selling family type tickets, then those facilities need to be looked at as well. For us men it's reasonably easy to go to the loo anywhere, for ladies it's somewhat more difficult. (no rude replies please!)

**Craig** · 2 Jan 2002, 16:16 (Ref:192757)

I know that these comments will have already been seen by those at Octagon who they are directed at... though i'd not expect a direct reply here.

Stephen has a good point about sending a letter though to express these thoughts in writing. Though they have acted on suggestions and/or criticism on these forums in the past, it's got to be a whole lot more effective in playing the game to their rules.

I am going to write myself actually after disappearing down through the embankment into a muddy hole at the last Oulton Park BTCC meeting. It wasn't fun to go round all day covered in mud and then have to drive home covered in it too. I'll let you know if I get a response.

SILVERS95 · 2 Jan 2002, 16:23 (Ref:192759)

i see it like this......octagon have only really just taken over , but , they have already done something for the race fan.....that season ticket is a bloody good deal.....i dont remeber BHL ever doin much for the race fan......also , the reason that brands , snett , oulton and cadwell are in a bad state is because thats how BHL left them..........Octagon have got a lot of work to do to get these circuits up to scratch , but at least they have started off the ownership of these circuits with some positve moves .

oh..stephnen.....there are 2 commentators for Toca , but they didnt always do all the rounds together i dont think.........

Alan Hyde was doing the pit lane commentry and David Addison was doing the main commentry in the tower at Sntterton when i went there last year for Toca event.

Dave Brand · 2 Jan 2002, 19:39 (Ref:192862)

>>Dave, I think the charges for circuit hire at Silverstone have come into line with those charged by Octagon elsewhere.<<

I'm sure you're right. Maybe that's why Octagon is a profitable organisation!

Jonny Apex · 3 Jan 2002, 09:33 (Ref:193124)

Alan Hyde. Top Man. And Ian Titchmarsh. A great double act whom I dearly hope do all the TOCA rounds between them in 2002. Not that keen on David Addison though. A bit James Allenie.

Alan Hyde · 3 Jan 2002, 13:18 (Ref:193204)

Thanks to Craig for letting me know about this conversation, just so that I can hopefully answer a couple of the points raised here.

You are absolutely right that Snetterton doesn't have a permanent commentary box at the Esses. Therefore, for the last three years, we have had a temporary commentary box installed there for the BTCC night meeting.

The first year, I went out there for the latter stages of qualifying and for the racing, with David in the main box. It soon became apparent that year that there was precious little point in me being there, (other than to make friends with the crowd on the banking who were great!), because once darkness came, the floodlights on the inside of the track put the cars into shadow on the outside, and therefore I was pretty clueless as to who was doing what and to whom! (No change there, then....).

For this reason, in 2000, we didn't have a commentary point there, but last year the lighting had been rearranged, so we had a proper ARB mobile commentary box installed there, (and this year they have added a pneumatic height adjustable vehicle to their fleet!) which Paul Truswell inhabited for the racing, with David in the main box, and me in the pit lane. It certainly is a whole lot better for everyone if there is a second box out there for the bigger meetings, as we can try to bring a much fuller picture of what's going on. And if you're watching there - it's just a mega place to be!

Of course, no night race on the calendar this year for Snetterton, so at least visibility isn't going to be a problem!

Hope that this has helped a little bit with a bit of info.

Al

PS No idea what the icon on this message means, but I thought he looked cool, and represents me trying to work out what the **** is going on in a night race!

PPS Sorry, Jonny, I hadn't seen your last posting there - that's very kind of you to say so - thank you! I hope so too!

SILVERS95 · 3 Jan 2002, 20:22 (Ref:193438)

I think Alans got one of the best jobs in the country !..he goes to all the Toca meetings..most of the Powertour meetings...he's at Silverstone for the Gp...gets hot rides around the circuits in race cars ( complete with microphone in hand ).....

really funny at Brands for the Toca final round last year., as Addison ( i think ) and Alan ended up like a commedy duo.....taking the p### out of each other for about 20 mins....

Alan , keep up the good work !!....it's great stuff

Alan Hyde · 4 Jan 2002, 17:05 (Ref:193882)

I reckon I do have one of the best jobs around - and I know that I'm extremely lucky!

Glad that we were able to amuse at Brands - I think that little twenty minute segue would be known within the trade as "losing it"!

I blame the weather.

SILVERS95 · 9 Jan 2002, 21:05 (Ref:196256)

it was funny though !!..

Do Toca commentators work in the winter ????..or do they just recharge there batteries for the hetic season ahead ....

**Stephen Green** · 10 Jan 2002, 08:23 (Ref:196412)

Alan, will you be commentating at the GP or Goodwood FOS this year?

View Poll Results: Octagon --good for British Racing circuits ?
YES	9	34.62%
NO	8	30.77%
DONT KNOW	9	34.62%
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