Watkins Glen Race

[Hazard]

Wasn't that a mess?

Funny all the talk about the road racers with experience likely to do well!

Dixon and Ganassi okay, but three of the AGR's driving scattily, all shown up by little Marco.

Penske spins and bad strategy all round.

D&R and Panther fill out the podium of Dixon's easy victory in a race with a ridiculously high number of safety car periods.

And the Cheever/Andretti incident!!! How did that happen? You can't see why Cheever would have done it on purpose, it really must be as they say - Marco's youthful reactions kept him on track (a lot!), but clearly Cheever's eyesight and reactions are going!

[rush1]

Originally Posted by Hazard

Wasn't that a mess?

Funny all the talk about the road racers with experience likely to do well!

Dixon and Ganassi okay, but three of the AGR's driving scattily, all shown up by little Marco.

Penske spins and bad strategy all round.

D&R and Panther fill out the podium of Dixon's easy victory in a race with a ridiculously high number of safety car periods.

And the Cheever/Andretti incident!!! How did that happen? You can't see why Cheever would have done it on purpose, it really must be as they say - Marco's youthful reactions kept him on track (a lot!), but clearly Cheever's eyesight and reactions are going!

Just one of those races with a lot of attrition. No big time racing series is immune to that, especially with those conditions.

Vitor Meira impressed me the most. Driving like a champ on a small budget team. Hopefully Harras will step up to the plate and keep him in the series the remainder of the season.

[Fogelhund]

I caught about half of the race, and certainly enjoyed it a great deal. Cheever does need to sit down. I don't think that was on purpose, which perhaps makes it even scarier.

[Bluewolf]

Actually AGR was 3rd and 4th toward the end before Kannan made that crazy move trying to pass Herta when he wasn't anywhere near being alongside him.
Unbelievable -- and Cheever shouldn't be on a road course at 48 years old --makes no sense. Lastly --- Marco was amazing -- fastest lap and with a real chance to win. This kid is drenched to the bone with talent.

[1 Lotus]

Originally Posted by Fogelhund

I caught about half of the race, and certainly enjoyed it a great deal. Cheever does need to sit down. I don't think that was on purpose, which perhaps makes it even scarier.

Agreed!
He tapped Danica on the restart and caused her a lap (he probably didn't like being passed by a girl).
He just plain took Marco out. I don't think he tried to take him out, but if his response is "I didn't see him" then his eyes aren't good enough to be racing. He also said he had nowhere to go. I guess his periferal vison the left isn't any better than on the right, which is why he couldn't see the 40' of open track immediately to his left.

[mac]

What about Ryan Briscoe!!!!????

I know there was a lot of attrition, but that was a magnificent drive to third, with the second fastest lap of the race, in a cruddy D&R car.

He is as good a talent as anyone in American open wheel racing - he still has the ability for F1.

[rustyfan]

What a great, crazy race! Congrats to Scott Dixon on picking up his second straight win at one of the best real race tracks in the world.

The high number of yellows was annoying, but at the same time I expected a lot of them when it became clear what sort of conditions they would be racing in, and the race wasn't all that different from quite a few late 90's Champ Car races in the wet.

I could live with the number of yellows though, seeing how truly great the racing was at times, with drivers dicing for position - and actually overtaking each other! - and racing side by side despite the tricky conditions. Some of the moves they pulled out there had me right on the edge of my seat, and especially quite a few pulled by one driver in particular...

...namely Marco Andretti! Wow, what can you say - he just drove an awesome race, and if Eddie Cheever hadn't taken him out I think he could have won it. How he kept his car on the track at times is beyond me, and it was great seeing him being right on the edge several times over.

Another driver that impressed me a lot was Vitor Meira, and he drove a solid race.

The race wasn't all good, of course - the high number of yellows, as mentioned, was annoying, and I always hate to see a time-limited event (although the IRL should get credit for making sure it ended under green though).

All in all, however, I think it was a great, crazy race, and IF we ever see a merger, it should be a federal offense to not include the 'Glen on a unified schedule.

[okeefe]

Originally Posted by mac

What about Ryan Briscoe!!!!????

I know there was a lot of attrition, but that was a magnificent drive to third, with the second fastest lap of the race, in a cruddy D&R car.

He is as good a talent as anyone in American open wheel racing - he still has the ability for F1.

I agree!!!!!!!!!! Guts and talent!

[okeefe]

and Good On You Dixon!!!!!!!!!!!!

[luke]

I was looking forward to the race, it was ok but I thought it would be better. I switched over from the Champ Car race as it was boring from Race Director.
Danica did qualify poor and also spun twice and again on a restart but there was the combined practice times to set the grids so who knows but Honrish Jr did very well to be up at the front.
He was doing well and I will never stop being impressed with Sam as is the same case with Marco Andretti. Amazing how everyone has forgotton about Danica and the hype is going, and you sure can't over hype Marco! To be right up there and consistently up there without any advantages and lets remember AGR is no where this year to be fair to some extent. Just a shame Cheever did that move. It was a little over the top with what Andretti said (Michael for the history) but its true Eddie was an idiot with that move especially for a F1 veteran etc.
A shame the race had too many cautions, and I wouldn't say these IRL road / street races are exciting. Yes it's nice to have these alternative racing but it's still weird in my opinion seeing these cars on the road courses, they look out of place if you will. But there was some good racing threw out the pack just a shame there wasn't more green flag laps and less silly moves.

[Michael Edick]

Originally Posted by rustyfan

All in all, however, I think it was a great, crazy race, and IF we ever see a merger, it should be a federal offense to not include the 'Glen on a unified schedule.

Absolutely!!!

In Mr. Cheever's defense, you might question why Marco tried a pass on the right side, when a left turn was coming up. To be sure, Eddie had to know Marco was crawling all over his back side and was looking for a way past. All I've seen is the replays of the impact, not what led up to it...with Marco's youthful enthusiasm running full tilt, should he have maybe tried for an inside (left side) pass? There is no doubt that Marco is bound for greatness (there's even talk already about F1!) but it's moves like that, that snatched defeat out of the jaws of victory many a time for his his dad.

But maybe it's time for Mr. Cheever to hang up the spurs...again. To say "I didn't see him" is a rookie excuse, not for someone of Eddie's experience...

[ian_w]

The IRL could learn a lot from the Europeans about road racing. The number of cautions was just ridiculous. Why throw a full course yellow just because somebody has spun - surely a local yellow would have been sufficient for about half the incidents. There were a number of silly accidents which I would have expected from a F.Ford race but not from professionals - I guess this just highlights the relative lack of road racing experience for a good proportion of the field.

I thought the team tactics were also questionable. Its hard to judge from the TV pictures but the track looked dry enough at the start for at least a few people to gamble on slicks. Scheckter was the first to switch and the commentators said he was 10sec per lap faster than the leader, yet it was still 2 or 3 laps before anybody else decided to change - don't the teams monitor the timing screens!

Overall though, a very entertaining race ( if you ignore all the yellows ), probably the best IRL road race to date.

[Fogelhund]

Originally Posted by ian_w

The IRL could learn a lot from the Europeans about road racing. The number of cautions was just ridiculous. Why throw a full course yellow just because somebody has spun - surely a local yellow would have been sufficient for about half the incidents. There were a number of silly accidents which I would have expected from a F.Ford race but not from professionals - I guess this just highlights the relative lack of road racing experience for a good proportion of the field.

Funny thing, is most of the field comes from a road racing background. Some of the incidents were by those most experienced in Road Racing, such as Eddie Cheever, who I might add did drive some type of European cars. These cars are not designed to be ideal on Road Course, and have no traction control. With mixed weather, you expect some degree of spinning. I'd suggest that if you took away traction control for the F1 guys, and you had similarily mixed weather, you'd have similar results.



Unfortunately/Fortunately (depends on your view), the rules in North America for course workers are quite different than in Europe. With litigation being ever present in America, most often the rules state that emergency personnel are not allowed to move, unless the full field is under the control of a pace car.

[BootsOntheSide]

Sounds like absolute chaos, but highly entertaining. Fogelhund makes some good points about the problems IRL drivers face on road coarses.

[Knowlesy]

Marco has really impressed, you can see his confidence growing. His car control is what does it for me. It reminds me so much of Montoya in his Champcar days and, for that reason, I am very excited about this kid.

Scrappy race yesterday, some real amateur stuff. And what was Cheever doing?!?

[deejay]

Originally Posted by ian_w

The number of cautions was just ridiculous. Why throw a full course yellow just because somebody has spun - surely a local yellow would have been sufficient for about half the incidents.

Totally agree. It was very annoying at times, especially when you then had a couple of laps behind a pace car with no obstructions on the track. I think the track configuration and the equipment on hand made getting to some of the cars difficult though - so IRL are probably due some slack. Can't compare them to the F1 setup on roadcourses.

Considering the very tough conditions (puddles everywhere with the drivers on slicks) and the lack of running these cars do on the road I thought the drivers did a good job though, so I don't blame them. It seemed to be the "fast" guys making mistakes as well; Kanaan, Franchitti, Scheckter etc. so some less experienced guys got a good result out of it by tip-toeing around all day.

Anyway, congratulations to Scott. Drove a perfectly judged race for the conditions and got the result he deserved. Got lucky at the end with Penske screwing Helio's pitstop and Marco taken out of contention - but he was overdue some good luck.

Marco was extremely impressive. Pushing too hard at times which showed his inexperience, but at the same time his pace and car-control show that he really does have a lot of potential. I think one of the reasons we saw a guy like Kanaan making mistakes was because he was having such a hard time keeping up with his young teammate.

[deejay]

Just an aside: I found the ESPN commentary here really poor. They barely discussed the race situation at all - Helio and Scott were battling for the lead for many laps in the middle of the race with Marco closing rappidly and the guys barely seemed to notice. Imagine the corresponding excited F1 commentary in a similar situation? Guys were running different fuel strageies and they didn't talk about it properly (Wheldon lead for a while because of this and I don't remember them ever discussing why). They kept going on about high and low grooves like it was an oval. Okay so the corners are banked so I'll cut some slack, but have these guys not heard of an apex?

If IRL is going to sucessfully package itself as a road course series it needs to get some guys commentating who actually understand what they are seeing.

[slicktoast]

I think Eddie's remarks after the "idiot" incidents were telling. "I was trying to pass her..." This was on the restart BEFORE they crossed the S/F line, a no-no according to the new rules. " I was doing all I could to keep it straight..." On the short straight! Reminds me of Uncle Leo " What! I'm old, I'm confused."

[drdisque]

Fun fact alert: Danica Patrick has placed 8th in 3 races in a row

Also, Scott Dixon is the only driven to finish in the top ten of every race this year

[tanalised]

Originally Posted by drdisque

Fun fact alert: Danica Patrick has placed 8th in 3 races in a row

Also, Scott Dixon is the only driven to finish in the top ten of every race this year

I believe that Scott has completed all but 1 lap thus far.