Mclaren and David

[Gt_R]

Much talk has been given to Ferrari using Rubens as a no.2. Much talk has been of the rivalry and relationship between Williams and their drivers.

How about Mclaren?
DC had quite clearly shown that he is not WDC material, being outshone by Mika, and comprehensively being beaten by a younger finn. For a top drawer team, why do they insist of keeping DC way beyond what we see as deserving?

It is not true that there are no other quality drivers around. Even Heidfeld seems like a good bet. So is Mclaren using DC as a "good-but-not-good-enough" helper to the team's lead? Sure, Mclaren insist that they let their drivers fight fair...but we all know who will NOT come out on top. So is Mclaren secretly doing a "Ferrari"?

Something very telling is the way DC's strategy in USGP is run. His pitstop timings were off beat compared to the other top guys. At the start, he was running quite strongly, but lots of strange strategic timing ruined his performance.

I personally believe that DC was made a "litmus test" for Kimi. Not only were DC's pitstop scheduled in a way to not affect Kimi's, hence giving Kimi a wider scope of having the luxury to choose the ideal time to pit in the changing and drying conditions, DC was also made to change to dry tyres WAY early while the track was still wet. I believe they are comparing Kimi's wet tyre time with DC's dry tyre time in the drying conditions to get the best idea when to change Kimi to dries.

If so, it is a clever, though cruel, strategic move, and i understand it is to maximise Kimi's chances. But though i'm no DC fan, he does seem to be the 2nd fiddle task all the time for Mclaren (DC had to run a whole lap of a soaking Spa in dries just for Mika to pit first) and Ron.

Why doesn't DC go to Jag instead?

What do you guys thinnk? Or am i reading too much.?

(PS. Pls avoid Ferrari/Williams/Mclaren bashing...)

[GTV27]

If your hypothesis is correct, I'd say it relates to DC's position in the championship relative to Kimi's and that should the situation be reversed that McLaren would require Kimi to make similar sacrifices for the good of the team.

As to why McLaren keep DC when most posters here seem to think he's a good for nothing loafer who's wasting a top spot...well, I'm sure Ron Dennis isn't doing it out of the goodness of his heart or for charity to DC, so there must be a performance related reason behind it.

I'm always a bit mystified when DC seems to float around in 8th or something and then 10 laps from the end pulls a fastest lap out of the bag when its too damn late to doing anything with the speed that was obviously lurking within the bloody car had he pulled his damn finger out 30 laps earlier... sorry, maybe that's an unfair generalisation.

Would Heidfeld do a better job? Hasn't really excelled in the Sauber has he?

[Gt_R]

Haha..i don't know, but i was looking through an old issue of Autosports... when JPM won the F3 championship where he had a close contest with heidfeld... Heidfeld was actually acknowledged to be as talented and quick as JPM and both would be the future of F1. Well...JPM did become the future, but Nick is now left wanting.

Besides a few wins, he really isn't a consistent performer at the top level. I agree that he can sometimes be brilliant, but those days are rare.

Yes, the talk is "if the situation is reversed", just like in Williams and Ferrari, but the thing is, we can safely assume that situation will NEVER happen in Mclaren. Considering the years of top quality car, DC's achievement is disappointing..

And i'm sorry if i offend DC fans(unintentional), but IMHO, Mclaren has the weakest driver pairing of the top 3 team, and DC is the weak link.

Perhaps it's just due to DC's superb PR skill? Or great developement asset?

[Gt_R]

To clear things up, i'm not implying DC is a good-for-nothing driver. DC is definitely in the top half of the current crop. It's just that he is good, but nothing out of the ordinary.

[GTV27]

Even though DC seems to go to sleep behind the wheel, there aren't too many drivers on the grid who you'd really want to take a risk on instead of DC - at least for 03 while Kimi has still been maturing.

However, beyond 03, now that Kimi has demonstrated his ability, perhaps McLaren could take more of a risk with the other slot - but wouldn't that be a F3 hotshot rather than somebody from the existing grid?

[The Lounge King]

David is to Kimi what David was to Mika.

Mika won 2 world championships, it is a proven formula.

Ron is well aware that Kimi is quicker than DC, but he is also well aware that DC will push Kimi. DC is capable of winning races. For DC's part, this is the best team that he will ever race for, he's not expecting a call from Frank or Jean. He will not go of his own accord.

[Mattracer]

Nowhere else to go for DC sadly. He does fit the team's environment well though, he's almost part of he furniture there now.

Now that Kimi is all nice and settled, they may have to decide whether to upset the applecart and bring in someone else or keep the status quo.

[Armco Bender]

Don't forget DC has won exactly the same number of GPs as Kimi this year,so he's not a total donkey.
I reckon next season we will see a renewed DC and 2004 will be his year for sure!.

[GTV27]

Armco, you are a scream!

However, I wouldn't be betting against the annual "DC, this is my year" story in Autosport in January 04.

[Valve Bounce]

Yeah!! next year is DC's year - and he is going to win the championship.

[gomick]

Originally posted by GTV27
Would Heidfeld do a better job? Hasn't really excelled in the Sauber has he?

but who ever did - dont say kimi, from my memory there was nothing between kimi & nick when they where team-mates......

[Gt_R]

Nick had done well in lower formulas, had raced well with Montoya, and he had raced with pretty bad machiney ie Prost-Acer and had shown well against pretty good team mates like Alesi and Kimi. So it's really quite unfortunate that he isn't given time behind a Mclaren, even if it's one year, to prove his stuff.

He can't do much worse than DC can he?

And what is worth noting is that Nick has a fair bit of knowledge on Ferrari engine's behavoir.

[GTV27]

Originally posted by Gt_R


He can't do much worse than DC can he?

Actually, I think it could be quite easy to do a lot worse than DC has driven this year (hence why he still has the drive, notwithstanding the Montoya and Webber rumours).

[DriverT]

Coulthard is a good driver but he's been made to look bad this year I think.

[Smokey 6 litre]

DC is a good driver, but he will never win the WDC or even put in enough of a challenge to make him worth while to a top team.
If Ron Dennis wants a Brit at McLaren button has the skill.

[jonathanc]

Ive said it before and I'll say it again.
When DC goes, I reckon Toyota would take him. None of this Jaguar cak. Remember, Toyota have always won every kind of motorsport they have entered. It is only a matter of time and good old cash.

He is a good racer, and a very good DEVELOPER with the latter being key to a developing team.

But then again Toyota arent known for using their brains when it comes to chosing drivers. They should have kept Alan and not taken on DeMatta (sp?).

As for Mclaren having the weakest pairing....doh!!!
IMHO Williams has the worst line up. They have a German who is paid way over the odds and whose performances are NO WAY consistent, more down than up. Then they have the latin toy thrower who throws himself and his car out of the big team pram when he doesnt get his way or loses a few places and screams down the radio at the daddy

[Burton]

Who says Jag would want DC anyway. It's about time people stopped thinking of Jag as a dumping ground for has beens!

[Redblurr]

DC is consistent driver and from RD's point of view will always earn McLaren points - maybe the new qually has unsettled him this year

[Super Tourer]

McLaren is all about constants and stability. Look how long they have been with their partners and sponsors, virtually no one in F1 can keep deals going like RD.

This is reflected in the way they select their drivers, even Kimi is an example of that, as his choice was recommended by Hakkinen.

DC is not a consistent performer and never has been (IMO), but he performs the PR role to perfection, which keeps McLarens 'partners' happy, and will play the back up man which undoubtedly heavily contributed to Mika Hakkinen's two WDC.

However this year has been a humiliation for him, scoring nearly half the points Kimi has, despite KR's two startline shunts and the engine blow when leading.

This has more or less resigned him to a No2 role at McLaren next year (IMO again,) to help Kimi secure the crown should he not make it in Suzuka.

I think 2004 will be his last at McLaren, so we can expect them to be eyeing up the field and testing new drivers ahead of 2005, when there could be some musical chairs up and down the grid.

[Adam43]

I think the situation is clear. They are given the same chances, but DC isn't as good as his team mate has been (generally).

Having said that I am not sure who would do better at McLaren. Arguably, apart from this year DC has always every year put in one or two good races that have secured his drive for the following year. There have been others that you might think that should have the drive instead, but it has always been a close run thing. I would say this year is the biggest case for saying they should have got someone else. However maybe McLaren are only looking for a one year deal. In which case DC again fits the bill for McLaren nicely.

IMHO it is simple. McLaren sign DC every year because he is the best option for them (in their opinion). Nothing more to it than that.

[DriverT]

Yes, I think he is their best option on the basis of continuity. He is a really good development driver, make no bones about it. There is nobody really better with a lot of experience of McLaren, who can act as the role of "experienced driver".

I wouldn't say Wurz would be quality enough to replace DC.

[Bononi]

When I think of DC, I remember Gehard Berger. With the difference that Berger, really tried to prove himself he was better than a #2, leaving McLaren for Ferrari.

[esorniloc]

Originally posted by jonathanc
IMHO Williams has the worst line up. They have a German who is paid way over the odds and whose performances are NO WAY consistent, more down than up. Then they have the latin toy thrower who throws himself and his car out of the big team pram when he doesnt get his way or loses a few places and screams down the radio at the daddy

If Williams line up is so bad, why are they just 3 points behind Ferrari then in the championship?????????????

Surely Minardi has the worst line up?????????????? :confused:

[cntmunky]

DC will probably stay at McLaren as a driver next year, and then should retire, and be their development/test driver.

[jonathanc]

Originally posted by esorniloc
If Williams line up is so bad, why are they just 3 points behind Ferrari then in the championship?????????????

Surely Minardi has the worst line up?????????????? :confused:

Dont get confused between the ability of the car and the ability of the drivers. There are better drivers in F1 than Ralf and JPM who could do better in a Williams than both of these two. I was originally comparing the top three teams.


Anyway, time will tell