CSCC Brands 09/10 May 2009

[zefarelly]

I don't know any different than Dunlops, its a shame there isn't a period alternative to give them some competition in the market place as a monopoly is rarely healthy.

I've no idea what 'other' tyres cost as I've never used anything else, but £450 a set isn't cheap although they do last quite well, rears last years on my car!

I'd have thought too grippy tyres could be reason for accidents, over confidence in undertalented drivers as well as fatigued very old components sometimes failing as a concequence?

[Colin McKay]

Zef, £450 IS cheap! A set of Dunlops fitted & balanced cost me £1K, and there are no discounts to be had anywhere. Compare that with the Vredesteins we have to use in the JEC series (heavily discounted by Vredestein), about £48 a corner and I'm still using last year's set. Some competition would be welcome.

[Andrew Busby]

Originally Posted by andy97

I see that you were second on the grid but then appear to be a DNS, what happened?

Absolutely gutted. Engine died on me after only handful of laps in qualie and although think we know the cause couldn't sort it in time for the race. So a very brief 1st outing in CSCC. Was really looking forward to racing with you guys - 1st race of the season for me so even more disappointing. Still, at least I know the car is reasonably quick - just needs to keep going next time!

[zefarelly]

I looked long and hard at discounts . . . even spending nearly 90k on tyres on behalf of the MoD and asking for a favour didn't work . . . . Dunlop know which side their breads buttered on.

I bought the MoD tyres from the US instead

[Moosehead]

Excellent meeting as usual by the CSCC even though I was the wrong side of the fence

2 cracking Swingin Sixties races both with a good 2 car battle for the lead for virtually all the race(s).

Good to see Mike Wroe finish his race, he looked ready to put the car back in the trailer after his little drama in practice.

Zef, I too would rather race on Dunlops or something similar as I prefer the sliding around but as already mentioned the cost is ridicoulous, nearly a grand for me and only half a season use at best against £700 and a season and half with the Yokos.

[zefarelly]

obviously big motors/power shreds dunlops

which is good for Dunlop, not for those exploring modern tuning methods in aulde engines . . . or a yank V8 powered thing with big tyres presumably!

[Moosehead]

Originally Posted by zefarelly

obviously big motors/power shreds dunlops

which is good for Dunlop, not for those exploring modern tuning methods in aulde engines . . . or a yank V8 powered thing with big tyres presumably!

Well, the Dunlops are hard and the Yokos far softer so you would expect the Yokos to shred quicker wouldn't you???

[zefarelly]

it starts getting technical now . . .slip angles etc . . . I guess US cars don't handle and rely on grunt, therefore kill tyres . . .I kill fronts not rears, I'm underpowered and have Ford Cortina steering which aint that good . . . . then theres weight . . . . . something like a Lotus 7 could probably be competitive on 40 year old 145/13 crossplies though!

cars Like Ginetta G4's though can be over tyred, apparently, there has to be a balance, you'd have to talk to the squirty end people about that!

[Tim Falce]

I'd love to try set of Dunlop historic tyres on my car but cant warrant the expense just for a trial. I find that Yoko 032r tyres either grip or they don't with no way to get them sliding although that may be my lack of talent. On the other hand the 008s grip well and feel more controllable and I can get them drifting well.
Back on topic I had an excellent day and many thanks to Terry at the JEC for allowing me to race in the Powered By race.

[sideways steve]

I hate it when the back of the car slides around, it seems to happen whatever I run on!

Ha Ha, not really

Great weekend, well done CSCC and of course thank you to all the marshalls.

[jellison]

Originally Posted by falcemob

Back on topic I had an excellent day and many thanks to Terry at the JEC for allowing me to race in the Powered By race.

Aha - Tim - I see your were at Brands not Oulton then - I just popped along on the Sat. Were your there then watching. Cracking 2nd Swinging Sixties. In this race and in yours I see, God those Lotus / Caterham things are fast round the Indy track!

[zefarelly]

circa 200bhp, <500kg and slicks, its harldy suprising

great stuff though, both races where very good I thought

[jellison]

Originally Posted by zefarelly

circa 200bhp, <500kg and slicks, its harldy suprising

great stuff though, both races where very good I thought

Impressed with the Lotus 7 (peroid mods but on Yokos not slick in the Swinging Sixties), just pipped Mark Campbell in the the race. Presume at a less tight track the TR5 would have had the legs. Both every well driven.

[zefarelly]

I was being sarchastic
yokos are slicks . . .with the odd line cut in!

[LAK]

Great weekend and as usual many thanks to all the officials, marshalls and fellow competitiors.

Jason had a very enjoyable race in the Griff until the water temperature rose and wouldn't go down despite some slower laps. Not wanting to risk the engine he came in for an early bath. A great achievement to get the car on the grid after the slave cylinder issues suffered at Snetterton and then finding the rear upright cracked with only days until the race...

My mate Graham and I were playing with Jason's Lancia Beta in Future Classics and had a great practice and race until a spring in the distributor jammed and made a mess of the rotor arm ending our race early. Shame as we'd got past a Davrian and were tracking an Alfa with another gaggle of cars ahead and we were confident of a super fast driver change.

Great grid of cars in Future Classics but I'd suggest that we need a Classics race in between Swinging 60's and Future Classics as the 70's cars like our Beta are technically much less advanced than those 80's and 90's cars on the same grid. Not a gripe just a suggestion if grids allow.

Disappointing to get 2 DNFs but the boys got the Beta working to drive it home okay. A really great day with our mate Laurence doing well yet again in his Corvette despiite being deafened by the side exhaust that got a hole in it which affected the car's performance. Good to see Zef, Jon and others.

Next CSCC event for us is Spa with Graham and I again in the Beta and Laurence kindly allowing Jason to share the Corvette with him. Can't wait!

[jellison]

Originally Posted by LAK

Great weekend and as usual many thanks to all the officials, marshalls and fellow competitiors.

Jason had a very enjoyable race in the Griff until the water temperature rose and wouldn't go down despite some slower laps. Not wanting to risk the engine he came in for an early bath. A great achievement to get the car on the grid after the slave cylinder issues suffered at Snetterton and then finding the rear upright cracked with only days until the race...

My mate Graham and I were playing with Jason's Lancia Beta in Future Classics and had a great practice and race until a spring in the distributor jammed and made a mess of the rotor arm ending our race early. Shame as we'd got past a Davrian and were tracking an Alfa with another gaggle of cars ahead and we were confident of a super fast driver change.

Great grid of cars in Future Classics but I'd suggest that we need a Classics race in between Swinging 60's and Future Classics as the 70's cars like our Beta are technically much less advanced than those 80's and 90's cars on the same grid. Not a gripe just a suggestion if grids allow.

Disappointing to get 2 DNFs but the boys got the Beta working to drive it home okay. A really great day with our mate Laurence doing well yet again in his Corvette despiite being deafened by the side exhaust that got a hole in it which affected the car's performance. Good to see Zef, Jon and others.

Next CSCC event for us is Spa with Graham and I again in the Beta and Laurence kindly allowing Jason to share the Corvette with him. Can't wait!

Louise - I'll PM you to get the right email (have to but not sure if either current), re the uprights.

God I got Sunburnt! Gingers!!

[jellison]

Mike (W) - just like to say a big tanks for the tickets, Fiscracer (Richard) and myself had a Great time. Nice chatting. All the best. Jelly

[andy97]

Originally Posted by LAK

Great grid of cars in Future Classics but I'd suggest that we need a Classics race in between Swinging 60's and Future Classics as the 70's cars like our Beta are technically much less advanced than those 80's and 90's cars on the same grid. Not a gripe just a suggestion if grids allow.

Given that there were two grids of Swinging Sixties at this event, for the first time, I wonder how you'd feel if the 70s cars like the Lancia, and the Alfa Suds from the Tin Tops race had a "70s class" within "Swinging Sixties"? Perhaps that would be a better match, however, how would the Swinging Sixties people react as a 70s car is more sophisticated than the early 60s cars, obviously. No winning really. I doubt there's enough 70s cars available for their own grid of "Smashing 70s" at the moment, unless you know better.

[snowen250]

I would say andy a series for cars built in the 70s should be very popular, certainly the Black Capri in the second 60s race could have a home there. And i would have thought there are lots of potential entrants.
Great weekends racing on both days, enjoyed all the races, bar perhaps the bescar ones, great racing though for the smaller classes in the 60s race, really enjoyed it
Simon

[andy97]

Originally Posted by snowen250

I would say andy a series for cars built in the 70s should be very popular, certainly the Black Capri in the second 60s race could have a home there. And i would have thought there are lots of potential entrants.
Great weekends racing on both days, enjoyed all the races, bar perhaps the bescar ones, great racing though for the smaller classes in the 60s race, really enjoyed it
Simon

You are probably right about a 70s race being popular but it needs 20 people regularly to make it happen. "Future Classics" is meant to be the home for cars from the 70s and 80s. Perhaps there needs to be a seperate class structure between 70s and 80s cars to entice a whole bunch of MGB V8s, Capris, Escorts, Alfa GTV6, BMW 2002s etc etc out.

As for the BESCAR races...what is that all about? 6-7 cars in a 30 min race, pathetic. I know they bought the grid but they should have been made to join up with the Open Sportscar Race.

[jonbryant]

Photos from Saturday are on here gents http://www.snappyracers.com/album/Brands090509/

Will stick some up from Sunday if I get time tonight.

JB

[LAK]

Originally Posted by andy97

Given that there were two grids of Swinging Sixties at this event, for the first time, I wonder how you'd feel if the 70s cars like the Lancia, and the Alfa Suds from the Tin Tops race had a "70s class" within "Swinging Sixties"? Perhaps that would be a better match, however, how would the Swinging Sixties people react as a 70s car is more sophisticated than the early 60s cars, obviously. No winning really. I doubt there's enough 70s cars available for their own grid of "Smashing 70s" at the moment, unless you know better.

Hi Andy. The Beta has been allowed to run with Swinging Sixties when we go to Spa/Germany but as the grids are now so full we have correctly been moved however we are now a little over whelmed if Brands is an indicator.

I think something like the HSCC split could work with everything before 1969 in one race (Swinging Sixties), cars from say 1970 to early 80's in a race we shall call "Classics" and the mid-80's to the 90's cars in Future Classics (hoping to prepare a Fiat Coupe for this one day - we have one waiting to be converted!). This would tempt quite a few HSCC 70's Roadsports cars out for a longer play. However I do completely understand that to make the argument for another race or race within a race, you need to have the competitors.

Andy, also love your previous idea in another thread of an all Italian grid(although not sure what years would work) - Top Hat used to run the GTA challenge years ago with mainly Alfa's but Lancia's and Fiats used to play too. That was terrific fun.

Anyway, all good talking points. Isn't it so nice to have such healthy and diverse grids that we can think about things like this? Tha main thing that we felt from the weekend was how relaxed it was and the standard of driving (especially in FC) was very good given the difference in times.

[andy97]

Originally Posted by LAK

Hi Andy. The Beta has been allowed to run with Swinging Sixties when we go to Spa/Germany but as the grids are now so full we have correctly been moved however we are now a little over whelmed if Brands is an indicator.

I think something like the HSCC split could work with everything before 1969 in one race (Swinging Sixties), cars from say 1970 to early 80's in a race we shall call "Classics" and the mid-80's to the 90's cars in Future Classics (hoping to prepare a Fiat Coupe for this one day - we have one waiting to be converted!). This would tempt quite a few HSCC 70's Roadsports cars out for a longer play. However I do completely understand that to make the argument for another race or race within a race, you need to have the competitors.

All good talking points, yes! I think that Swinging Sixties is now so popular (regularly getting 8-10 reserves) that it could legitimately run two grids at most places, as at Brands. Time on the programme is then a real difficulty, partularly as Tin Tops and Future Classics both seem to be on the up this year, and the intro of the Magnificent Sevens has also gone well. You could have a 70s class into one of two Swinging Sixties races, the Magnificent Sevens could live alone and then combine Tin Tops and the remaining Future Classics. I'm not sure that either group would want that, though, and the series' are just getting in to their stride and establishing their own identity so it would be shame to change things and possibly confuse the market place from which the club is trying to attract racers. Its an interesting "problem" to have - the club is a "victim" of its own success!!!

[jellison]

Ouch - you gotta pity the Trans-Am guy having parked it in the gravel at Druids.

Only for another Newbie to drop it right into the back of him!

Made of string stuff those big Chevy's (Pontiac).

[clint73]

Hi guys, im new to this site so be nice to me lol. Had a great weekends racing at brands and just wanted to know if anybody got any pics of the tin top race?