Books Le Mans Annuals (merged) - Page 4

**Aysedasi** · 12 Jan 2005, 19:11 (Ref:1199202)

Can I please make it clear that I am not about to allow this thread to be usaed as a vehicle to place pressure on Simon to do something which he is cleartly not inclined to do. For the avoidance of any doubt, I have been in touch with Simon and, suffice to say, he stands by what he has stated already. I am not about to further any debate which might appear to question his integrity.

As we've already seen, antr has confirmed the existence of English versions of the 82 and 85 books and Simon himself tells me that last week there was an English version of a yearbook (1979 if his memory serves him right) for sale from a private book dealer in USA. ISBN2903356025.

So there it is.

jna · 13 Jan 2005, 09:29 (Ref:1199672)

Ok, I'll not mention this matter again, but I'm saddened to think that members on this excellent forum are not willing to advance their own knowledge for the benefit of others. Inexorably serious book collectors are bound to exhibit a great deal of interest and ask for information when comments like those are made. It has nothing to do with doubting a person's integrity whatsoever. This is all very silly and I remain with the view that I can't get to grips with why I can't be helped.

Ayse, the 1979 edition was printed in English. That book is fairly easy to acquire. The English editions that nobody else has seen, purely for the record, are 1980, 1981, 1982, 1983, 1985, 1986 and 1994, so in closing if anybody else reading this topic that has English versions and is willing to provide information for me please write to me at

j.n.allen@messages.co.uk

Thank you

John

David L · 14 Jan 2005, 20:32 (Ref:1201163)

Out of respect for the host's wishes in this respect, this shall be my last post on the issue of english editions relating directly to Simon and antr..

I second jna's comments..

Please check PM's.

Respectfully

**Aysedasi** · 15 Jan 2005, 10:47 (Ref:1201485)

OK guys, having corresponded with both David and John about this, to a degree I share your chagrin at not getting answers to your questions. I also share the general view that if something is asserted, the poster generally ought to be prepared to support his or her assertions. But that really is as far as I can take it. I accept that if Simon is unwilling to provide further information (and yes, I have asked), that will be viewed as unfortunate, but the bottom line is I cannot force Simon to do something he clearly does not wish to do. I think it is fair to say from what he has indicated to me that he has a sense of grievance over this too.

I don't want to take sides, and if that appears to have been the case, I apologise. But thanks to David and John for the way in which you have responded to my earlierr post, which I accept must have seemed rather one-sided.

The issue is still open, so if Simon or anyone else has information to volunteer on the subject of those specific "missing" English editions, we're all keen to to hear it!

Thanks

Ayse

rdjones · 15 Jan 2005, 19:56 (Ref:1201696)

Anyway back to the 2004 yearbook. I now have my copy and its OK I have only had a very quick look through but 1st impressions its a thumbs up.

500mm · 21 Jan 2005, 15:08 (Ref:1206469)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aysedasi

OK guys, having corresponded with both David and John about this, to a degree I share your chagrin at not getting answers to your questions. I also share the general view that if something is asserted, the poster generally ought to be prepared to support his or her assertions. But that really is as far as I can take it. I accept that if Simon is unwilling to provide further information (and yes, I have asked), that will be viewed as unfortunate, but the bottom line is I cannot force Simon to do something he clearly does not wish to do. I think it is fair to say from what he has indicated to me that he has a sense of grievance over this too.

I don't want to take sides, and if that appears to have been the case, I apologise. But thanks to David and John for the way in which you have responded to my earlierr post, which I accept must have seemed rather one-sided.

The issue is still open, so if Simon or anyone else has information to volunteer on the subject of those specific "missing" English editions, we're all keen to to hear it!

Thanks

Ayse

OK, I have no axe to grind on this topic other than curiosity and also wondering why if English editions were available at the time I wound up with French language versions.

The author, Jean-Marc Teissedre just called me on another matter so having the opportunity I put the question to him.

This is his reply to the best of his recollection.

As others have said 1978 and 1979 were in both languages; Renault paid for one and the Whittington brothers for the other. He was certain that for 1980, 1981, 1982 and 1983 there was only a French version.

I have a 1984 English version and once again 1985 and 1986 are French only. The English service started again when at the behest of Jaguar, Autotechnica produced books in both languages. 1994 was also French only.

I hope that this answers the question but I am only too willing to be proved mistaken…………I will plead the mitigation of JMT’s failing memory.

lemans_henrik · 23 Jan 2005, 16:03 (Ref:1207949)

I have just got the Le Mans 2004 annual and would like to do some comments on it.

I have been buying the Le Mans annual regularly since 1996 and do also have some of the old from the late 80's. Since the 2002 edition I have noticed that the picture quality has been dramaticly reduced.

With the 2002 edition I blamed the poor picture quality on the use of digital cameras. The 2003 edition also featured the same lack of colorfull, sharp images - and now the 2004 edition has been released, and the picture quality has not been much better...

If you take the 2004 edition and looks at page 122, it shows a shot from the Porsche curves but the picture quality looks like it was grabbed from the television or taken with a cheap digital camera: Too bright, not even sharp and lot of JPEG compression artifacts.

There are a lot of such examples where the photos are too bright and unsharp:

middle of page 121
top of page 125
page 143 bottom
page 149

Also a shot as the one on page 184 of the #64 Corvette in the pit area: The colors do not look healthy. Also the competitor picture at page 246-247 looks like it was taken with a cheap digi cam with JPEG compression level put to 20.

Not all pictures are bad. There are actually a few really nice shots:

page 96 bottom
page 138 at the top
page 140 at the middle
page 167
page 171
page 186 at the bottom

Besides the poor picture quality, the text at places looks like it has been written without typo correction. I have not read all text yet, but I read the text about car #20 page 41. In the top text Jens Moller is called Jess, Casper Elgaard is called "Caspar" and in the description of John Nielsens former Le Mans appearance the 1998 car is listed as a "Nissan R309" (should have been R390) and the 2003 car is called a "DBA-04S-Zytek" (should have been DBA4-03S-Zytek).

I know it is much data and pictures to put together on half a year to make this annual, but as it is the only "complete" documentary of the event it also needs to be in a good quality. And if the quality of the 2004 edition is compared with e.g. the 1996 or 1997 edition, I think there is still a long way for the 2004 edition to go.

I would like to hear other race fans opinion about the annual quality. Am I too expectant and demanding or have you also been disappointed with the last 3 editions of the annual?

Best regards

Henrik

MikeHoyer · 23 Jan 2005, 16:31 (Ref:1207972)

I've only got the 2 that I've been to 2003 and 2004, but I'm pretty happy. There are some typos for sure, but I think some of that is in the French translation?

Pictures I've generally been happy with, ones I don't like are generally more a matter of personal taste than technique, but I'll have a look at the ones you've mentioned.

Graham Goodwin · 23 Jan 2005, 17:15 (Ref:1208004)

It's particularly disappointing to see the obituary attributed to Steve O' Rorke rather than O'Rourke

The photo credits are tiny too - I simply don't believe that the pics supplied are the problem, it must be a reproduction issue.

rdjones · 23 Jan 2005, 17:28 (Ref:1208006)

The best photo in the whole book IMO is the one of Martin Short with his arm's raised in the Dallara. Fantastic shot.

lemans_henrik · 23 Jan 2005, 17:43 (Ref:1208014)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Graham Goodwin

...
The photo credits are tiny too - I simply don't believe that the pics supplied are the problem, it must be a reproduction issue.

The problem with the digital shots are that a lot of photographer do not realize that in most cases they have to process the pictures in e.g. PhotoShop before they are ready for reproduction.

gi_gav · 23 Jan 2005, 18:39 (Ref:1208054)

I think photographers that are respected enough to publish in the yearbook are more than well aware of what editing is required!

SALEEN S7R · 23 Jan 2005, 20:34 (Ref:1208130)

Ive got every Le mans annaul from 2000 and onwards and personally id say the quality now is as good as it has ever been in my experince. Sure theres a few typos but nothing major, and the photo quality IMO is very good/excellent, as good as u will find in any other annual review, ie F1/Moto GP etc. A very good annual of the 2004 Le Mans 24hrs IMO.

David L · 24 Jan 2005, 18:52 (Ref:1208805)

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Badger

but I wanna know how and who made the Courage C65 wheely like that on page 90-91 ? !!!

Who.. Gavin Pickering..
How.. Kerb hopping/jumping at the Ford Chicane..

Graham Goodwin · 24 Jan 2005, 20:04 (Ref:1208873)

Ladies and gents please recognise that Dave Lister (the Poster above) was the photographer who took the shot on the cover of this year's annual and also took one of the nicest shots in the book - P146-147

Whatever else may be wrong with the production of the book that is a very classy shot indeed.

Fogelhund · 24 Jan 2005, 20:15 (Ref:1208880)

Just for some clarification, there is no particular issue with using digitial format pictures for print media. If the production is of top quality, then the printed pictures should be as well.

kdr · 24 Jan 2005, 21:52 (Ref:1208969)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Graham Goodwin

Ladies and gents please recognise that Dave Lister (the Poster above) was the photographer who took the shot on the cover of this year's annual and also took one of the nicest shots in the book - P146-147

Whatever else may be wrong with the production of the book that is a very classy shot indeed.

if the dps is davids ferrari at dawn at dunlop bridge picture then graham is correct...sumptious. as for the dodgy pictures - i wish i didn't have to wait until i get down to the aco shop in june to see what all the fuss is about!

btw...did anyone buy the black and white photographed book of the 2003 race?

rdjones · 24 Jan 2005, 22:11 (Ref:1208993)

Quote:

Originally Posted by kdr

i wish i didn't have to wait until i get down to the aco shop in june to see what all the fuss is about!

There is always amazon, they finally have it in stock...........

MikeHoyer · 24 Jan 2005, 22:51 (Ref:1209028)

Yeah they got them in earlier than predicted in fact, which was handy.

Fab · 25 Jan 2005, 08:20 (Ref:1209266)

It won't help here, but for those who're interrested at, here is the website of La Librairie du Palmier (no ad, I don't have any connection with them)...

They've lots of stuff around LM, including english books... one source among others, though, and probably already well know by the specialists I can see here...

jna · 25 Jan 2005, 11:16 (Ref:1209392)

Thanks Fab for the interest. Yes, we are aware of this dealer, and one of our members was going to write to them about this subject, together with an approach to the ACO themselves.

John

**Aysedasi** · 25 Jan 2005, 13:29 (Ref:1209516)

It sounds to me as though it ought to be the case that we can rely on what one of the authors says on the subject.......

Another comment from me.

I realise that I had not fully appreciated the incedible depth of feeling over this issue. I know from a mail I received and answered yesterday that it is intense, to say the very least. And it is my intention to follow the matter up one further time. After that, if no satisfactory response is received (and I will leave it to you knowledgeable people to decide what is satisfactory and what isn't), I propose to leave the issue, on the basis that you can draw whatever conclusions you wish.

**Aysedasi** · 25 Jan 2005, 13:52 (Ref:1209551)

I have just attempted to PM Simon, but unfortunately he has the facility disabled.

I will try and email him this evening. I really do want to be able to draw a line under this - one way or the other.

**Aysedasi** · 25 Jan 2005, 22:05 (Ref:1209901)

I have emailed Simon C this evenming asking him to produce the evidence of the English edition yearbooks which he says he has. I have asked him to either post the confirmatory evidence here or provide it to me as an intermediary. I have asked Simon to provide his response by this Friday.

Fab · 26 Jan 2005, 04:02 (Ref:1210076)

I moved this one from Sportscars to AE, where it seems to fit... the tread still appears in Sportscars/GT.

Amended by Ayse for context

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