Injuries prompt V8 pitstop rule change

[PVDA]

http://www.speedcafe.com/2011/11/12/...p-rule-change/

In simple terms an extra person per wheels is being allowed to reduce the effort required to do the wheel changes safer.

One thing I'd like to see added is some form of traction control when the pit speed limiter is active.

This would allow take offs without wheelspin and lessen the risk of the rear of the car from swinging and hitting another crew person in pit lane.

[peckstar]

The new rule has not garnered unanimous support however, with some members of pitlane expressing concern to Speedcafe.com that having more people involved in the pitstops will actually increase the risk of injuries.

interesting issue and both sides are valid.

Of course we could just stop pit stops and that solves the problem also

[peckstar]

murph loses a wheel in the race, was it the fault of the new pit crew setup?

ingall also has an issue?

[MattV]

Originally Posted by peckstar

Of course we could just stop pit stops and that solves the problem also

But what would they then introduce for entertainment control?

[TSR]

Kelly Racing and Mr Potato Head r not a big fan of the new rules as per Murf interview today

[Woolley]

Would prefer it if they kept the same number of total crew but required two on each wheel change. One thing that NASCAR does make interesting is pit stops which are a genuine race between teams - all that running round the car and manual jacks.

[bludvl_x19]

Originally Posted by PVDA

http://www.speedcafe.com/2011/11/12/...p-rule-change/

This would allow take offs without wheelspin and lessen the risk of the rear of the car from swinging and hitting another crew person in pit lane.

Or you could just write a rule like at Le Mans for the 24hr; no wheelspin allowed in pit lane. Cheaper to do it that way

[Uncle Cranker]

I watched a 300 km endurance race yesterday, (with a 29 car field) and making the compulsary pitstop a minimum of five minutes long worked very well.
Every car pitted at least once, for tyres, fuel & a driver change, and not an injury in sight......

Lets get back to basics, manual wheel-braces, lightweight trolley jacks, and a five minute minimum CPS.

People are only getting injured in the haste to get back out there as fast as they can......

(Oh & close the pits to CPS during Safety Car periods too)

[peckstar]

during yesterdays coverage of a pit stop, the driver was told to start spinning the wheels while the car was on the jacks still, seemed to me that is not exacatly a safe thing to do

Cranker, just wondering how lightweight manual trolley jacks and manual wheel braces are safer than what we have?

off interest also is that this year they slowed the stop down, by decreasing the fuel flow

maybe we should go more pit crew to increase these sort of issues, watch an F1 pit stop, much less frantic

oh and whats a CPS

[Uncle Cranker]

Originally Posted by peckstar

during yesterdays coverage of a pit stop, the driver was told to start spinning the wheels while the car was on the jacks still, seemed to me that is not exacatly a safe thing to do

Cranker, just wondering how lightweight manual trolley jacks and manual wheel braces are safer than what we have?

Peckstar again you only read the bits you want to, and quote back even less.

Originally Posted by Uncle Cranker

I watched a 300 km endurance race yesterday, (with a 29 car field) and making the compulsary pitstop a minimum of five minutes long worked very well.
Every car pitted at least once, for tyres, fuel & a driver change, and not an injury in sight......

Lets get back to basics, manual wheel-braces, lightweight trolley jacks, and a five minute minimum CPS.

People are only getting injured in the haste to get back out there as fast as they can......

(Oh & close the pits to CPS during Safety Car periods too)

Onboard jacking systems & pneumatic rattle guns only exist as time saving devices......

QED.

[Uncle Cranker]

Glad I quoted you before your edit......

[peckstar]

your quote didnt change what i wrote though, says the same thing, you seem more interested in having a go at me than discussing the subject.

but you didnt answer the question! how are lightweight manual trolley jacks and manual wheel braces safer than what we have??

[Uncle Cranker]

Originally Posted by peckstar

your quote didnt change what i wrote though, says the same thing, you seem more interested in having a go at me than discussing the subject.

but you didnt answer the question! how are lightweight manual trolley jacks and manual wheel braces safer than what we have??

This will put a full stop on our apparent friendly banter Peck. (I will type it slowly, please read it the same way....)
I am not going to go back & forth about this, I have my opinion based on 22 years of marshalling, you have yours based on watching the sanitised tripe Motortainment that TC has decided you should see.....



Mechanical pit equipment is only designed and used to make the pit stops faster.


Removing the urgency to pit & resume (and all the hurry up tools) would:

· eliminate the need for the car to come to screeching halt (albeit from 40 kph) maybe the pit lane speed limiter can even be lowered to 25 ? (car controllers have been hit by cars in all forms of the sport, when the car overshoots the pit box)
· eliminate the frantic running around the car (leading to personnel being exposed to a slip trip or a fall)
· allow the fuel to be fully delivered safely, without the urgency of an accidental release, which tears out a hose from the fuel rig. (Which is a proven hazard, increasing the risk of a fire)
· Make the race result less driven by the speed of the pit stop/ability of crew/luck (as the stop would be x minutes of total time in the lane, using the pit-in timing loop, and the pit-out timing loop)
· eliminate the need for nitrogen bottles, overhead gantries, air hoses, etc. All long proven to be hazards to the pit lane personnel (numerous history of injuries)

And if you don't know what a CPS is, then you must watch the telecast with the sound turned down...

[peckstar]

Originally Posted by Uncle Cranker

This will put a full stop on our apparent friendly banter Peck. (I will type it slowly, please read it the same way....)
I am not going to go back & forth about this, I have my opinion based on 22 years of marshalling, you have yours based on watching the sanitised tripe Motortainment that TC has decided you should see.....



Mechanical pit equipment is only designed and used to make the pit stops faster.


Removing the urgency to pit & resume (and all the hurry up tools) would:

· eliminate the need for the car to come to screeching halt (albeit from 40 kph) maybe the pit lane speed limiter can even be lowered to 25 ? (car controllers have been hit by cars in all forms of the sport, when the car overshoots the pit box)
· eliminate the frantic running around the car (leading to personnel being exposed to a slip trip or a fall)
· allow the fuel to be fully delivered safely, without the urgency of an accidental release, which tears out a hose from the fuel rig. (Which is a proven hazard, increasing the risk of a fire)
· Make the race result less driven by the speed of the pit stop/ability of crew/luck (as the stop would be x minutes of total time in the lane, using the pit-in timing loop, and the pit-out timing loop)
· eliminate the need for nitrogen bottles, overhead gantries, air hoses, etc. All long proven to be hazards to the pit lane personnel (numerous history of injuries)

And if you don't know what a CPS is, then you must watch the telecast with the sound turned down...

No i get the whole idea of slowing things down, and that issue is fair and i get it. No problems with it from a safety point of view (i do from other areas but not from safety)

but i dont get how are lightweight manual trolley jacks and manual wheel braces are safer than what we have?? .

a mechanical way of doing these things will produce an easier and safer way of doing them, , a side benefit is thats its faster, but safer also
less issues with strain or repetition, no need to leift heavy cars, but partially off set, by gantry issues, although work has been done on that

[Denosaur]

Any of you blokes ever had a go at changing one of those wheels?? I have and can tell you how bloody hard it is especially once you have to pull that wheel and tyre off. There's close to 20kg's, from what I was told, in weight with the wheel, tyre and gun. You try and also practice the propper lifting technique when doing it and you'll find it doesn't work. Unlike NASCAR where crews specifically train to do pit stops, the V8 guys train, but ultimately pit stops are only 1% of there job descriptions.

Plus anyone ever consider if any of these blokes done any warm up exercises to try and avoid some of strains and sprains?? That's probably the core of the issue right there and not the speed of the stop.

[F J Nedos]

If there was an issue with the speed of stops, couldn't they just reduce the fuel filler flow - much along the same lines as in Bathurst? Reduce it more if need be. The pressure would then be off the crews if they know the fuel will take a minimum of 15 seconds, say...

[peckstar]

FJ, it is already slower than that,

But at places say like saturday at Tassie, it was only about ten secs of fuel needed, compared to sunday when two stops were needed,

but limiting the amount of people on a vehicle, means people have to move fast if they want things done, especially additional things

[F J Nedos]

The commentators did mention that they have gone back to the faster fuel flow rates after the enduros. While I don't know exactly what the flow rates are, I am suggesting they slow it down to either the enduro rate - or even slower again.

I like the idea of two people per wheel.

[rik]

Originally Posted by Uncle Cranker

I am not going to go back & forth about this, I have my opinion based on 22 years of marshalling, you have yours based on watching the sanitised tripe Motortainment that TC has decided you should see.....

I think it would be much safer if we cut off 6 cylinders of the engine... especially at street circuits where the concrete walls are so close!!! We could then put the DVR on fast forward and it would look the same on TV!

[aussiemuscle308]

Originally Posted by peckstar

Of course we could just stop pit stops and that solves the problem also

Yay, someone who likes racing for racing's sake! pitstops are fine for entertainment value, but not for pure racing.