Home Forum T-Shirts etc.: Europe/Worldwide. eBay Motorsport Links Advertising Live Chat  
Site Partners: OldRacingCars.com  

Go Back   TenTenths Motorsport Forum > Historic Racing & Motorsport History > The Chassis History Archive


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 12 Apr 2006, 13:07 (Ref:1579435)   #31
Dan Rear
Veteran
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location:
West Lancs
Posts: 2,006
Dan Rear should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by allenbrown
Chris

Have you spoken to the Bob Relinski who is listed as owning chassis JM11-061-SV in the FSV register? His email is given as karwashbob at aol dot com.

Allen
Allen wasn't the JM12 the FSV, not the JM11 ? I'd thought that for that year, 1982, the F3 was the 10, the FAt the 11, and the FSV the 12. Except that Bill Burley (?) used a JM12 FSV in the 'year-old cars' F3 class a year or so later in Britain IIRC.
Dan Rear is offline  
Quote
Old 12 Apr 2006, 15:14 (Ref:1579530)   #32
allenbrown
OldRacingCars.com
Veteran
 
allenbrown's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location:
Farnborough, Hampshire, England
Posts: 3,917
allenbrown should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridallenbrown should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Absolutely no idea Dan!! Not sure Argo always did.
allenbrown is offline  
Quote
Old 15 Apr 2006, 05:21 (Ref:1582682)   #33
jleonard
Rookie
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 14
jleonard should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
I'm sorry I haven't had a chance to go look at the ex Nugent car to confirm it's a JM-8.I thought there was only 2 JM-9 FA built, we had sn 056 (which we bought used, not new) and Wille Stobart in Perth Australia had the other. Could sn 057 that is hillclimbing be the Stobert car gone back to the UK? We did own the 11 (065) that came to Seattle. There is another 11 style car in the area which started life as a super V and left the factory as an FA. It's been a while but I think it is stamped with SV/FA. I do own JM5-036-FA and it is the Rackham car. He did race the car at a boxing day event and had an accident which was rapaired at Anglia cars.
jleonard is offline  
Quote
Old 15 Apr 2006, 09:24 (Ref:1582735)   #34
allenbrown
OldRacingCars.com
Veteran
 
allenbrown's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location:
Farnborough, Hampshire, England
Posts: 3,917
allenbrown should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridallenbrown should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Hi jleonard

Thanks for this - very useful indeed. I had completely failed to spot the information you posted on the 1-off F2 cars thread so I've just grabbed this so it's accessible on this thread. Maybe John can transfer the posts across later and remove the quotes?

Allen

Quote:
Originally Posted by jleonard
From here: I see this thread is over a year old but I thought I would add a few notes on Argo atlantic cars. The Rick Gorne car was a converted F3 called a JM1X. The Mike Nugent car was a 1980 JM8 and is in the Seattle, WA. U.S.A. area.It is rumored to have been in a shop fire with partial damage.We imported JM9-056-FA to the U.S. in about 1982. The car was sold and went to B.C. Canada was raced then the suspension was used for an autox special and the gearbox,adapter and tubs (yes 2, one was a used F3) went to Tennesee U.S.A. I was told there was also a JM9 in Australia. We also owned JM11-065-FA which was rebuilt as a sports racer using JM21 bodywork after an extensive accident.The last I heard that car is in Florida.The gem though is our JM5-036-FA which we purchased from Dave Rackham in 1980. I won the first SCCA national it was entered in which we think was the first for an ARGO atlantic.In recent years we have run the car in some vintage events and also against current Swifts and Ralts in SCCA nationals when the Reynard hasn't been ready.Like the comment about the RT1 the 5 is a great car to drive.I think there is also in the Seattle area another JM11 built as a super V converted to atlantic before it left the factory,a JM4 type SV and a ff2000. I just got to thinking that the JM5 could be the only operational true ARGO atlantic car in North America, maybe the world?
Quote:
Originally Posted by jleonard
From here: Dan,Jon Peterson arranged the sale of the 9 to us and the money was paid to Anglia Cars.I'm 90% sure it's the Arnold car. We got quite a few spares with the car as they were disassembling the F3 cars after they turned out to not to be very good. The 9 did look much different, Pininfarina's wind tunnel might have made the aero OK but the cars were very flexible. When we bought the JM5 it was the intention of my brother and I to inspect both the 5 and the Nugent JM8. When we left the US both cars were for sale, when we landed in the UK 12 hours later Nugent had taken a deposit on his car from an agent in the US. We also bought an Alan Smith engine from Andy Barton (iron man of the north?) on that trip.I still have the autosport ad listing the Nugent car as an 8,also I should have race results from here in the US with the car listed as an 8.The 5 and 8 Have different tubs the 8 being longer extending into the engine bay along with some other minor changes.The nose and upper bodywork are the same,the sidepods are different as well as most of the rear suspension.The 11 we had was built as an atlantic same bodywork as the F3 but with all the right brakes ,wheels and wings. It did use the front upright from the 1981 F3/atlantic. Back in about 1985 the 5,9and 11 all attended the same pro atlantic race (half the worlds population of ARGO atlantics?) Thanks for the intrest,Jo would be pleased. Is there an area for atlantics I don't want the F2 guys to be upset with us? J
allenbrown is offline  
Quote
Old 15 Apr 2006, 09:26 (Ref:1582740)   #35
allenbrown
OldRacingCars.com
Veteran
 
allenbrown's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location:
Farnborough, Hampshire, England
Posts: 3,917
allenbrown should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridallenbrown should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
"Argo" JM6

Tom Johnston in Canada has emailed me to say that:
Quote:
The JM6 referred to as being driven by Ross Bentley is actually a Johnston JM6, one of my cars. The similar mark designation often resulted in confusion at the time.
Allen
allenbrown is offline  
Quote
Old 15 Apr 2006, 09:37 (Ref:1582744)   #36
Chris Townsend
Veteran
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
United Kingdom
London
Posts: 2,169
Chris Townsend should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
I'll say, I only found one contemporary reference to it as a Johnston rather than as an Argo!
Though from seeing a photo on CMSHG a few years back I recall it did have an uncanny resemblance to Argo's FF2000 car that appeared at the same time.
Chris
Chris Townsend is offline  
__________________
'Some days you eat the bear, some days the bear eats you.'
Quote
Old 15 Apr 2006, 09:43 (Ref:1582747)   #37
allenbrown
OldRacingCars.com
Veteran
 
allenbrown's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location:
Farnborough, Hampshire, England
Posts: 3,917
allenbrown should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridallenbrown should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
I've asked Tom for some background on the car. He's also said he'll look into our other Argo queries.

Allen
allenbrown is offline  
Quote
Old 16 Apr 2006, 10:31 (Ref:1584866)   #38
Chris Townsend
Veteran
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
United Kingdom
London
Posts: 2,169
Chris Townsend should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
From what jleonard is saying here it looks as though JM9-056-FA was the Blackwell car in Atlantic before being AX'd and had previous in 1981 -
presumably as the Arnold car which disappears after 81. That would make our UK/Irish based JM9 the ex Goodwin Racing chassis. I can't find any evidence of an Argo in Australian Pacific class in 81/83.
The Seattle location makes the Nugent JM8 a fine prospect for the car of Jim Burnett. All we need here is the chassis no!
The outstanding question is JM11-65.
jleonard is your car the ex Karlberg-Boley Atlantic racer or was that the hybrid FA/SV that's still up there in Seattle?
Also, would love some results and background on SCCA Nationals in the 1980s as I start doing pro races in that period
Chris
Chris Townsend is offline  
__________________
'Some days you eat the bear, some days the bear eats you.'
Quote
Old 16 Apr 2006, 11:09 (Ref:1584895)   #39
Bryan Miller
Veteran
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location:
Kiama , N.S.W. Australia
Posts: 1,379
Bryan Miller should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Chris,

Western Australia is a long way from the other side of OZ where most Atlantic stuff happened , Willie Stobart certainly is a name that rings bells re . one of the two Argo's that came here, which has reminded me to try and find out about the one I was told of up the coast from Sydney.
Bryan Miller is offline  
Quote
Old 16 Apr 2006, 18:56 (Ref:1585268)   #40
jleonard
Rookie
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 14
jleonard should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
The JM-11-O65 is the Karlberg/Boley car that I owned and yes I am Jim Blackwell. Jim Burnett owns the 11 FA/SV the 8, ex Nugent car and a JM17 FF2000. I called Jim and confirmed that the early car is JM8-044-FA. So the list of ARGO atlantics goes JM1X sn?,JM5-036,JM8-044,all early design. JM9-056 dismantled, parts in US and Canada. JM9-057, one of two built for Irish series now speed event car, back from OZ? 9s were the Arrows F1 lookalikes. JM11-065 ex Karlburg/Boley,Blackwell,now in Florida with JM-21 sportsracer bodywork.And the Burnett JM11 S.N. unknown, car in storage. The 11s looked like Ralt rt4s. Wille Stobert also had a March 832. Please do not call Jim about his cars as they are not for sale.
jleonard is offline  
Quote
Old 17 Apr 2006, 10:09 (Ref:1585690)   #41
Chris Townsend
Veteran
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
United Kingdom
London
Posts: 2,169
Chris Townsend should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Jim

A proper welcome to CF3 and thanks for all the information. Apart from the Willy Stobart mystery you've cleared up every query on the Argo Atlantic cars. [I have a pencil written note of the Gorne chassis number, but need to clarify the handwriting with the original note taker.]
Have a look at the 84 WCAR results on www.oldracingcars.com and tell us if we're gettting it right.

Chris
Chris Townsend is offline  
__________________
'Some days you eat the bear, some days the bear eats you.'
Quote
Old 17 Apr 2006, 10:42 (Ref:1585719)   #42
allenbrown
OldRacingCars.com
Veteran
 
allenbrown's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location:
Farnborough, Hampshire, England
Posts: 3,917
allenbrown should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridallenbrown should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Townsend
Have a look at the 84 WCAR results on www.oldracingcars.com and tell us if we're gettting it right.
Somewhat confusingly listed under Canada: try here.
allenbrown is offline  
Quote
Old 18 Apr 2006, 10:04 (Ref:1587480)   #43
Dan Rear
Veteran
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location:
West Lancs
Posts: 2,006
Dan Rear should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
I'm getting lost here chaps. Are we saying there were/are only 2 JM9s made, thats why I think FWIW - the Lees/Goodwin car, and the Arnold one. One is still in UK with Ritchie, the other with Jim B in US/Canada.

I still maintain the Nugent car was a 1979-80 model, a JM5, and NOT an 81 JM8/9. The 2 models, ie the 79/80 and 81 cars were distinctly different. I think the sequence is as follows :

JM1X 1979 convert of a 78 F3 car
JM5 1979-80 'new' car, similar to the classic JM6 F3, 2 made for Nugent and Rackham
JM9 1981 car, the equivalent to the awful JM8 F3 car - 2 made, Lees and Arnold.
JM11 1982, one only and slightly RT3-4 looking.

How do we think about the above ??
Dan Rear is offline  
Quote
Old 18 Apr 2006, 14:16 (Ref:1587691)   #44
allenbrown
OldRacingCars.com
Veteran
 
allenbrown's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location:
Farnborough, Hampshire, England
Posts: 3,917
allenbrown should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridallenbrown should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Rear
... JM11 1982, one only ...
Definitely more than 1 as we have Bob Relinski's JM11-061-SV, Jim Blackwell's 'JM-11-O65' and Jim Burnett's '11 FA/SV'. With the known JM9s being chassis 056 and 057, there are gaps in the numbering that may hide more JM11s.

Allen
allenbrown is offline  
Quote
Old 18 Apr 2006, 16:04 (Ref:1587747)   #45
Chris Townsend
Veteran
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
United Kingdom
London
Posts: 2,169
Chris Townsend should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Allen and Dan

I too wondered about the calling out of JM8-044 as Nugent's car as he has his Argo in 1979 and the JM8 was the 1981 F3 car. 1979 should make it a JM5. It's retained 1980 but then disappears 81. However, my records of Irish Atlantic in 1981 are decidedly thin, it's quite possible that Nugent got a JM8 for that year. Given the competitiveness of the JM8 it's entirely plausible that he would not figure in any results!

Remaining problems:
Nick May has a JM5 October 79 at Brands Atlantic race, perhaps on loan from works. This might be the Rackham JM5 which then goes to Jim Blackwell.

Nick Adams has a "JM6 " October 80 at Brands Atlantic, also perhaps a one off works loan with a view to the following year. I can't see where this one goes. Chassis number 044-F3 works as well for a 1980 chassis as an early 1981 JM8... [Both 041 and 042 were early 1980 F3 cars for the works and Colin Thorpe]

JM9s - only two
056 Arnold, then to Jim Blackwell, Marty Knoll, Terry Edwards, and A/X
057 Goodwin Racing, then unknown to Neil White [h/c 1995]

Agree that we have at least three JM11s.

Any offers on JM12 Super Vee?

Chris
Chris Townsend is offline  
__________________
'Some days you eat the bear, some days the bear eats you.'
Quote
Reply

Bookmarks


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Argo JM19 cybersdorf Motorsport History 7 17 Jun 2016 13:17
argo jm14 help fast.eddie Racers Forum 7 29 Apr 2012 17:03
Argo/Formula Asia/Monoposti MikeBz Club Level Single Seaters 21 22 Nov 2005 08:26


Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3

All times are GMT. The time now is 16:12.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Original Website Copyright © 1998-2003 Craig Antil. All Rights Reserved.
Ten-Tenths Motorsport Forums Copyright © 2004-2018 Royalridge Computing. All Rights Reserved.