2013-2014 N.Z National Motorsport Classes..(Excluding NZV8 & ST please.)

[Bill Brown]

Originally Posted by Goat Boy

You'll never get the trucks to Pukekohe or HD, why run a series without a big drawcard like the ST's in at least some of the meetings though?

Also D1NZ are their own thing, like the drags, you will not get enough interest from either camp in combining them.

There are more circuits than Puke and Hampton, The thread title did ask that we exclude ST & NZV8. It was a hyperthetical meeting for discussion purposes only.

[Goat Boy]

Originally Posted by Bill Brown

There are more circuits than Puke and Hampton, The thread title did ask that we exclude ST & NZV8. It was a hyperthetical meeting for discussion purposes only.

Yes I am aware that there are more circuits than Puke and HD, but my argument was that if you were going to use trucks as a big drawcard (which they often can be) then you'd have to think of something else before you came to the two circuits closest to the biggest population centre in the country.

[Southern Man]

Originally Posted by Goat Boy

Yes I am aware that there are more circuits than Puke and HD, but my argument was that if you were going to use trucks as a big drawcard (which they often can be) then you'd have to think of something else before you came to the two circuits closest to the biggest population centre in the country.

Have you ever thought that there could be quite a large trucking fraternity around the Auckland & Waikato area who just might want to come watch them racing and that you can build a meeting around them. Sure works for Timaru & Teretonga

[smokin'joe]

Originally Posted by Southern Man

Have you ever thought that there could be quite a large trucking fraternity around the Auckland & Waikato area who just might want to come watch them racing and that you can build a meeting around them. Sure works for Timaru & Teretonga

has anyone ever thought that a decent feild of them might be a drawcard ??

[promax]

umm you two are talking to an Auckland, remember lol a simple thing like traveling north of the Bombay Hills is an issue for them lol

[promax]

hmm that's the second time i've posted north of the Bombay Hills rather than south?

might have to lay of the drink

[socram]

Originally Posted by promax

hmm that's the second time i've posted north of the Bombay Hills rather than south?

might have to lay of the drink

You might, as HD is south of the Bombay's anyway...

Whilst truck racing can be spectacular, so can the damage to the infrastructure, not to mention clouds of disgusting smoke everywhere. It is also quite frightening being a flaggie on some trackside marshal's posts.

[Southern Man]

Originally Posted by socram

Whilst truck racing can be spectacular, so can the damage to the infrastructure, not to mention clouds of disgusting smoke everywhere. It is also quite frightening being a flaggie on some trackside marshal's posts.

Sunshine, All infield marshalls are withdrawn off the circuit when truck racing is on, there are no flaggies etc. Excessive smoke is penalised which is why they actually run pretty clean exhaust once on load and out on the circuit. Best you go and have a look sometime.

[bluespur]

Is it not easier to negatively comment with no basis of knowledge?

[smokin'joe]

Originally Posted by bluespur

Is it not easier to negatively comment with no basis of knowledge?

to which post are you reffering to ??

[bluespur]

So rams one about trucks. Does demonstrate a total lack of knowledge as politely pointed out by Carl.

Was surprised as I had tagged him as talking with some substance.

Never consider that you would fall into that, however do recommend that you, perhaps could commence attending Teir 1 meetings if you are going to critique them

Creditability is big with me

[Jerico]

Originally Posted by bluespur

So rams one about trucks. Does demonstrate a total lack of knowledge as politely pointed out by Carl.

Was surprised as I had tagged him as talking with some substance.

Never consider that you would fall into that, however do recommend that you, perhaps could commence attending Teir 1 meetings if you are going to critique them

Creditability is big with me

Great lucky we have you here then. Can you tell me all the rules for the truck racing then. I have done Teir 1 for a number of years, but never did do the trucks so I don't really know all the rules. Funny how we build tyre walls and fill them with dirt, then send drivers out on the track in their little cars. Then when the trucks hit the track we send the flag marshels away to somewhere safe. That's nice. Maybe Carl can politely point out why that is.

[bluespur]

Jericho, at least you are asking questions rather than making ill informed, incorrect statements

Am sure that Carl can point out why flag marshals have to leave their points during truck racing.

[Swedish Brick]

How many times on this forum have Aucklanders stated they would rather not travel? Several. Including one series founder and promoter.

[Southern Man]

At least our paddock (race circuit) is paid for and owned by a car club, something that you have never managed in your patch yet.

You are well aware that the likes of Armco etc is not designed for head on impact, if I remember correctly I think it is something like a maximum of a 22 degree angle as it is a deflection barrier rather than something that brings you to a full stop, and that at Puke many years ago it took a head on hit from a truck that went pretty much straight through it.

For what it is worth a few years ago Robin Porter and Inky Tulloch had a coming together on the front straight at Timaru where Inky ended up riding the armco for quite some distance but even though the posts moved in the ground no bolts sheared anywhere along the length of the straight and the armco did exactly what it was designed to do.
Then because we have a pretty efficent repair crew on hand including some real trick Hiab operators we had everything back up and running 100% within 20 minutes.

Jerico, the reason why the infield is cleared of crash rescue crews and flaggies is simply because 5.5 tonnes out of control at 160kph can take a bit of arresting. At Timaru we have three quick access points to where they are withdrawn to and if there is an issue then it it is red flag (red light) and go sort it out.

During truck racing the pit lane is also cleared of all personal and vehicles and for those who have enjoyed their many visits to our paddock, you may now understand purpose of those large concrete blocks that are placed in front of the control tower, they are the last line of protection for the building.

Simply put 5.5 tonnes at 160kph can take a bit of stopping if things go wrong.

The regulations are quite clear about things like excessive smoke and it does not happen now, likewise over speeding for all trucks are fitted with a GPS speed recorder and this is downloaded every time the vehicle comes off the circuit. Overspeed is instant exclusion. Simple things like wheel nut protection has stopped many of the incidents seen in the past as no longer can exposed wheel nuts / studs get caught up in another vehicle and launch one skywards so they can rub wheels with no undue effects. Seriously guys, the truckies have put a lot of thought into a number of things to make their sport better other than the fact that they sure do take up some room in the Pit Paddock and of course the reliability factor which comes from streching the last available horsepower out of some of the older engines.

As for track damage, really over all the years that we have had the trucks at Levels we have not experienced it probably because our circuit is built on a good old fashioned hard Sth Canterbury paddock rather than a northern swamp or volcanic ash. For sure I was the most protective person you ever meet about our track prior to our first truck meeting all those years ago. I am not one who easily changes their mind but I now look forward to them arriving each year.

[socram]

Originally Posted by Swedish Brick

How many times on this forum have Aucklanders stated they would rather not travel? Several. Including one series founder and promoter.

If you are referring to me, then may I point out that yes, I would rather not travel these days, but that is my personal choice based on a variety of factors, not the least is cost but also based on history and the time committment.

Take Manfeild for example. Two visits and both very costly.

Having spent half the season's budget to do the Whittakers meeting (paying for a car transporter company - who managed to damage the car - accommodation, fuel etc and having to take two days off work) a few years ago, the meeting was called off on the Sunday due to rain...

Polling our members, they also elected to not include Manfeild as a series round, so it was democratic decision from drivers spaced all over the north island and not just north of the Bombays..

The old Taupo, (club circuit) just didn't suit my car at all and again, the cost and time commitment isn't justified if you are on a limited income - which many of our drivers are. The "new" Taupo appeals even less.

However, there is a 50/50 conflict with our own drivers. Half prefer a two day meeting and half prefer a Sunday meeting and we cover the series with three tracks with a 50/50 mix of one and two day meetings. Sadly, you can't please all of the people all of the timer and you never will.

As for Truck racing, I was a flaggie when they first came to Pukekohe and I still remember those horrific pictures where that unit demolished half the pit lane at Puke.

By all means run them on a track with wide open spaces, but not at the two local tracks where the owners have spent mega bucks trying to contain the cars. The disruption to a meeting should a truck get out of shape is now rather more than a few spanners and a few lengths of new Armco and a one hour delay.

[Swedish Brick]

No, I wasn't singling you out, I was speaking mainly in general terms

[socram]

Originally Posted by Swedish Brick

Including one series founder and promoter.

So who? It doesn't worry me SB. I am more than happy to stand by my posts and also my decisions but there are no simplistic answers.

I have just had a couple of emails in. One from a series organiser and one from one of our drivers who is not running this weekend. Interesting.

When you poll drivers for their opinions, even though you rarely get better than a 50% response, (which is normal for any poll), how do you cope with the demands of a family many trying to keep the family happy, who prefers a one day meeting, plus those who hate hanging around all weekend just for one practice and three races, against those who love the two day meetings as it gives them time to socialise and watch a variety of other races?

There is no right answer in terms of promoting a race meeting but as I discovered this morning from one email, a lot of summer events this year, despite the great weather, had far fewer tickets sold than normal.

So much choice - and not just for petrolheads. Events and venues keep getting added to the various calendars so many will suffer and in that, motorsport is not alone, whether drivers or spectators.

[Swedish Brick]

That's pretty obvious. Petch has stated he would prefer to go no further than Taupo. Yes I'm aware where Taupo is. Point remains he would rather have the STs as an Auckland based champs.

But that's getting away from the topic

[socram]

Originally Posted by Swedish Brick

That's pretty obvious. Petch has stated he would prefer to go no further than Taupo. Yes I'm aware where Taupo is. Point remains he would rather have the STs as an Auckland based champs.

But that's getting away from the topic

Probably, but I have no problem whatever with regional series, from ST down, as travel, time and accommodation costs just ramp up the overall costs of competing and times are still tough out there.

I sometimes wonder if the lack of support for national series' is due to that expensive patch of water between N & S? Not to mention of course the horrendous problems of getting away from Auckland and the north on a Friday night.

We are a pyramid as in any sport with relatively few well heeled and/or talented people at the top, but a vast base of club drivers across all disciplines.

That vast base comprises many small series but we'd be kidding ourselves if we thought the general public was in any way interested in paying to see the racing and even enthusiasts are piccy.

[Icarus_nz]

Too many class structures
Small population and small economy
Lots of tracks running lots of events = dilution of interest for spectator.

It would be interesting to know the rate of participation in New Zealand for any sporting activity involving an engine. Interesting to then factor in skateboarding/biking/sailing etc as they are activities involving a machine of some sort

Circuit racing is a very small sub group of the bigger picture.

Come any race weekend people are out in their kart/motorcycle/jetski/boat/rallycar/speedway car/offroader/hotrodclassicvintage car etc.
Why would they pay money to watch something that mildly interests them when they can spend that money having a go at something themselves?

There is this strangely egotistical desire to race in front of a big crowd with live TV coverage, shiny trophies for all and plenty of titles to go round. Oh and get paid to turn up and have to bat off big sponsors and pretty girls with a short stick.

Firstly - does any of that crap add a jot of enjoyment to your participation?

Secondly - this dream requires money. Lots of money. AND has to be earned through determination, dedication, ability and lots o luck.

The way to improve promoted meetings is to have less and be very very selective about the mix of competiors.
When desire outstrips availible promoted meetings to run at then, and only then, will the show have half a chance of appealing to the household entertertainment spend.

Race meetings are viable to run with 80 - 90 entries as costs are covered.
Focus on the pleasure of participation and throw open the gates for free.

Put yourself in the shoes of the casual spectator and stop overselling a tired lacklustre show. People have been burnt too many times by hyping glorified invariably unreliable club cars driven poorly.

[Old_Bob]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Swedish Brick
How many times on this forum have Aucklanders stated they would rather not travel? Several. Including one series founder and promoter.

If you are referring to me, then may I point out that yes, I would rather not travel these days, but that is my personal choice based on a variety of factors....

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I've been quite impressed how 'clean' this thread had stayed until now.
Not interested in V8 whining. Not interested in the people that can't or won't put their available funds, time & talent into a more affordable class to enable them to be part of a 'National' series.
Please keep the snivelling comments for posts on other more deserving threads. Or is retirement another possible option?
Thanks.

[Goat Boy]

Originally Posted by Old_Bob

Quote:
Originally Posted by Swedish Brick
How many times on this forum have Aucklanders stated they would rather not travel? Several. Including one series founder and promoter.

If you are referring to me, then may I point out that yes, I would rather not travel these days, but that is my personal choice based on a variety of factors....

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I've been quite impressed how 'clean' this thread had stayed until now.
Not interested in V8 whining. Not interested in the people that can't or won't put their available funds, time & talent into a more affordable class to enable them to be part of a 'National' series.
Please keep the snivelling comments for posts on other more deserving threads. Or is retirement another possible option?
Thanks.

I didn't notice any snivelling until you just posted... As your name implies, perhaps it is time for retirement.

[smokin'joe]

Originally Posted by Icarus_nz

Too many class structures
Small population and small economy

have to agree. could never understand why there had to be a new "single-make ' series every couple of years, and have a dedicated race for them, when boring class within boring class was bad enough.

Originally Posted by Icarus_nz

Race meetings are viable to run with 80 - 90 entries as costs are covered.
Focus on the pleasure of participation and throw open the gates for free.

Put yourself in the shoes of the casual spectator and stop overselling a tired lacklustre show. People have been burnt too many times by hyping glorified invariably unreliable club cars driven poorly.

Amen

[socram]

Originally Posted by Icarus_nz

Race meetings are viable to run with 80 - 90 entries as costs are covered.
Focus on the pleasure of participation and throw open the gates for free.

Put yourself in the shoes of the casual spectator and stop overselling a tired lacklustre show. People have been burnt too many times by hyping glorified invariably unreliable club cars driven poorly.

Agree, other than the costs are rising all the time, particularly locally with ambulance/paramedics etc. so lift your break even to 90 - 100 (or we have to charge more!) Also disagree about the standard of driving as it is much higher than some televised classes. Just one car damaged, which, considering the weather was quite impressive.

We threw open the gates for free, but from an entry of 92, we ended up with just 80 signing on.

Most local classes this year have seen higher registrations, but fewer race entries.