[Tech Issue] Closed cockpits- Closer to reality then we might think?

[S griffin]

Yeah, it's basically polishing a t*rd. It won't make it any better. Shame really

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by sizzle

And here I was hoping they would find a way to make them invisible!

https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/13...-yellow-jersey

As head of the FIA, is that the best Jean Todt can do?

[sizzle]

There can be little doubt now that it was a knee jerk reaction with no proper thought put into it!

https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/13...l-halo-details

[VIVA GT]

Originally Posted by sizzle

There can be little doubt now that it was a knee jerk reaction with no proper thought put into it!

https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/13...l-halo-details

With his stupid thoughtless ideas, I'd like to have knee jerk reaction to Jean Todt...

[ScotsBrutesFan]

Begs the question, how have F2 with their all new chassis, with a halo, got around similar load testing?

Given its a single design for the series, have they just over engineered the mounting points/chassis in that area?

[S griffin]

Originally Posted by sizzle

There can be little doubt now that it was a knee jerk reaction with no proper thought put into it!

https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/13...l-halo-details

My thoughts exactly

[chillibowl]

Originally Posted by ScotsBrutesFan

Begs the question, how have F2 with their all new chassis, with a halo, got around similar load testing?

Given its a single design for the series, have they just over engineered the mounting points/chassis in that area?

good question.

Originally Posted by sizzle

There can be little doubt now that it was a knee jerk reaction with no proper thought put into it!

https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/13...l-halo-details

i wonder if we starting to a see a narrative being formed through which the FIA and teams can back away from introducing the Halo for 2018?

if an adequate test cannot be created to determine proper installation then they may have the legal cover/liability shield to delay its introduction.

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by chillibowl

good question.



i wonder if we starting to a see a narrative being formed through which the FIA and teams can back away from introducing the Halo for 2018?

if an adequate test cannot be created to determine proper installation then they may have the legal cover/liability shield to delay its introduction.

I personally think the whole business of cockpit protection should be re-evaluated. No adequate testing for the Shield was carried out, just a few laps and now this. This is about driver safety, so it behooves the FIA to get it right and not rush it.

[chillibowl]

Originally Posted by bjohnsonsmith

I personally think the whole business of cockpit protection should be re-evaluated. No adequate testing for the Shield was carried out, just a few laps and now this. This is about driver safety, so it behooves the FIA to get it right and not rush it.

agreed!

[Richard C]

Originally Posted by bjohnsonsmith

I personally think the whole business of cockpit protection should be re-evaluated. No adequate testing for the Shield was carried out, just a few laps and now this. This is about driver safety, so it behooves the FIA to get it right and not rush it.

But, but... Vettle got dizzy?! What more is needed?

Richard

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by Richard Casto

But, but... Vettle got dizzy?! What more is needed?

Richard

So he claims.

[S griffin]

And most of the teams voted for the shield anyway

[wnut]

Originally Posted by bjohnsonsmith

I personally think the whole business of cockpit protection should be re-evaluated. No adequate testing for the Shield was carried out, just a few laps and now this. This is about driver safety, so it behooves the FIA to get it right and not rush it.

It behooves the .... to do something now, this thread has been running since 2011, and nothing at all has been done.

Just spec the supports to be capable of holding the halo till it will fail.

[bjohnsonsmith]

No surprise that IndyCar won't be using the Halo.

http://classic.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/132592

[S griffin]

I'm glad, it was rushed through in F1, in mysterious circumstances, Indycar are not making the same mistake

[Adam43]

Mysterious circumstances?

[Akrapovic]

Originally Posted by Adam43

Mysterious circumstances?

From an engineering point of view, it was pretty mysterious. Well, it was blatantly agenda pushing. Entire concepts were written off after 5 minute test sessions, and received no development beyond the initial concept. Meanwhile the Halo got years of work.

There are qualified engineers on this forum who know much more about development processes than me, but I am studying engineering. The way the Halo was introduced raises huge red flags for me and goes against the entire engineering process I've been taught, literally from the first week of my studies. There has been no attempt to flesh out the different concepts to find the best solutions. It's quite blatantly agenda pushing. Who is doing it and why? That's the mysterious bit.

The worlds most advanced motorsport is deliberately not exploring what the most suitable solution is. That is pretty odd.

[Adam43]

Ah, I read more into it than that, maybe incorrectly. I was reading a suggestion that someone was on a back handed or something, rather than we just don't know everything about the process.

Is this the final version forever, or just the one that is ahead at the moment? That's the engineering approach I'd have, explore many solutions and perhaps introduce the one that is ahead first, that not commmit forever. I don't know, honestly just trying to understand as I haven't fully kept up with this, especially over the last few months. Still it's just a guess from me.

[wnut]

Originally Posted by bjohnsonsmith

No surprise that IndyCar won't be using the Halo.

http://classic.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/132592

Newgarden is right, the line of sight required on an oval is completely different from that of a flat circuit, you spend your time looking up and left on the corners where a lot of the structure of the halo is.

Guess their solution will look like the red bull screen.

[Number4]

Typical F1 BS trying to reinvent the wheel.
It isn't rocket science.

[chillibowl]

so this thread started back in 2011 and i imagine other variations existed prior (post Massa's injury and Surtees' unfortunate passing).

but here we are in Nov of 2017 and we are about to see the last race without any head/face protection (well not including helmets).

A) shocking that it took so long and B) sad that after so many years the only viable concept they came up with is a partially effective half measure and one that lacks any aesthetic appeal whatsoever (not the priority i know but still).

have been rereading some of the earlier posts and it seems like some of the worst fears have been realized....lack of action and will to mitigate unnecessary risks and the implementation of a flawed system.

i should add, and unless i am mistaken, it is also sad that the adoption of the 'Halo' also seems to have come with an abandonment of pursuing any other alternatives.

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by chillibowl

so this thread started back in 2011 and i imagine other variations existed prior (post Massa's injury and Surtees' unfortunate passing).

but here we are in Nov of 2017 and we are about to see the last race without any head/face protection (well not including helmets).

A) shocking that it took so long and B) sad that after so many years the only viable concept they came up with is a partially effective half measure and one that lacks any aesthetic appeal whatsoever (not the priority i know but still).

have been rereading some of the earlier posts and it seems like some of the worst fears have been realized....lack of action and will to mitigate unnecessary risks and the implementation of a flawed system.

i should add, and unless i am mistaken, it is also sad that the adoption of the 'Halo' also seems to have come with an abandonment of pursuing any other alternatives.

Apart from Vettel's few laps round Silverstone, that was it for the Shield and iirc, the Halo will be adopted forthwith and no alternative will be pursued, which seems totally wrong.

I've said it before it behooves the FIA and F1 to get this as right as possible and thoroughly test the alternatives. It would be tragically ironic, that with the forced introduction of the Halo, a driver were to suffer an injury, just to highlight how inept the FIA have been in pursuing alternatives. Hopefully, that won't happen.

[Akrapovic]

Red Bull also tested the aero shield in 2016. There were no vision problems reported with the Red Bull designed version.

[S griffin]

I'd almost forgotten about the halo for next season. I still feel the FIA were terribly negligent in not giving the shield more tests, as it was alright for RBR. It all seems fishy to me that Ferrari didn't like it and now it's not going to be used, even though all the other teams were in favour of it

[bjohnsonsmith]

"Teams have found that adding halo mountings and beefing up the chassis to pass the associated load tests has added extra weight even greater than that new allowance."

https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/13...rivers-in-2018