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Old 18 Sep 2017, 21:05 (Ref:3768390)   #196
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Toyota do need to figure out something. Even if there's a limit on what teams can do to modify their bodywork once it's homolgated, there's still stuff they can change. They also need to figure out if it's aero, chassis set up, or hybrid strategy.

Yes, the ACO's rules for this year make it basically default that you're going to have to double stint almost every tire run. Toyota did it first before Porsche did to try and gain track position.

IMO, one of two things happened. Either Porsche snookered Toyota by being the last to run their high downforce bodywork, or apples to apples, the Porsche is the better car right now. I still also feel that Toyota placed too much emphasis on LM and in the end their success or failure hinged on a good LM result, which they pretty much didn't get.
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Old 18 Sep 2017, 21:34 (Ref:3768402)   #197
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Originally Posted by Melcor View Post
Do you realize that this "I hope Fuji is a better race" gets old
First was Nurburgring.1-2 for Porsche

Toyota at Nurburgring : Nurburgring is damage limitation,track is more suited for Porsche hybrid system,in Mexico we will be better with that long straight - They were lapped at 3 hour mark,even worst than Nurbugring!

Toyota at Mexico : Awful race,but we will come back at COTA stronger.Yes they were stronger, but not enough...3 consecutive 1-2 victories.I think Porsche have advantage over them,and yes i am Porsche fan but i want more close fights.So right now Toyota have to figure something out because how it looks their season may end with next race!
Don't read my comments, that's the only thing I can suggest to you if it "gets old". The season is already over in terms of the championship. If you are only watching because of the slim chance Toyota gets the driver's title then you're wasting your time. I watch to see a good race. COTA was a good race. Especially compared to Mexico. What can Toyota 'figure out'? The Porsche has more downforce, they've acknowledged that. So tracks with lots of turns or ones that require lots of downforce (like Nurburgring and Mexico) they're going to be stronger. It's good Toyota were closer at COTA. Even last year when they didn't have as good of a car, they were close here, and won at Fuji. So please forgive my optimism
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Old 18 Sep 2017, 22:29 (Ref:3768422)   #198
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Only thing that's left for Toyota is try and win races and get back the form they had before Le Mans. However, seeing the roll that Porsche is on since winning LM, I think that's a tall order.

They need to find out why they're lacking pace, address that, and even then they're probably going to need a bit of luck to win some of these remaining races.

Their race pace improved at COTA, but still, so far since LM, no dice.
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Old 19 Sep 2017, 02:34 (Ref:3768456)   #199
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Originally Posted by chernaudi View Post
Only thing that's left for Toyota is try and win races and get back the form they had before Le Mans. However, seeing the roll that Porsche is on since winning LM, I think that's a tall order.

They need to find out why they're lacking pace, address that, and even then they're probably going to need a bit of luck to win some of these remaining races.

Their race pace improved at COTA, but still, so far since LM, no dice.
The equivialnt to what Toyota is going throug in GTE is Ford. The Ford GT's just don't seem to have it. They seem to be a second off everybody else. Even Porsche got their act together somewhat at COTA. It seems though Aston Martin and AF Corse Ferrari are the big 2 right now and are the favorites to win the rest of the races over Porsche and Ford. Which stinks. The later are the two I cheer for.
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Old 19 Sep 2017, 04:45 (Ref:3768474)   #200
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Originally Posted by chernaudi View Post
Only thing that's left for Toyota is try and win races and get back the form they had before Le Mans. However, seeing the roll that Porsche is on since winning LM, I think that's a tall order.

They need to find out why they're lacking pace, address that, and even then they're probably going to need a bit of luck to win some of these remaining races.

Their race pace improved at COTA, but still, so far since LM, no dice.
Why is this a surprise? Porsche spent more time and resources on the high downforce package than Toyota did. The car has more downforce. Toyota said this themselves. The only thing Toyota can do is play to their car's strength, which is tire wear, top speed and the hybrid. Top speed might only come into affect at Fuji and Shanghai. Tire wear isn't that much better than Porsche. The hybrid factor depends on the track length. I think Fuji and Shanghai is their best bet. Fuji is their best track and their home track. They have won every race there bar 2015. If they only get one more win this year it will be there
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Old 20 Sep 2017, 20:25 (Ref:3768859)   #201
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I still also feel that Toyota placed too much emphasis on LM and in the end their success or failure hinged on a good LM result, which they pretty much didn't get.
I think this summarizes Toyota's season overall (and even the last one to some extent). They just focused on the Le Mans aero kit the most (and it showed, they seemed to have the upper hand until they all three cars broke).
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Old 21 Sep 2017, 02:55 (Ref:3768958)   #202
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I think this summarizes Toyota's season overall (and even the last one to some extent). They just focused on the Le Mans aero kit the most (and it showed, they seemed to have the upper hand until they all three cars broke).
More like every season! Le Mans is the big one, you focus on that and design a high downforce car around it, that's what I think Toyota's philosophy is. And to be fair, every lmp1-h broke at Le Mans this year. Porsche just fixed their's first and fastest.
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Old 21 Sep 2017, 03:08 (Ref:3768963)   #203
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Why is this a surprise? Porsche spent more time and resources on the high downforce package than Toyota did. The car has more downforce. Toyota said this themselves. The only thing Toyota can do is play to their car's strength, which is tire wear, top speed and the hybrid. Top speed might only come into affect at Fuji and Shanghai. Tire wear isn't that much better than Porsche. The hybrid factor depends on the track length. I think Fuji and Shanghai is their best bet. Fuji is their best track and their home track. They have won every race there bar 2015. If they only get one more win this year it will be there
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More like every season! Le Mans is the big one, you focus on that and design a high downforce car around it, that's what I think Toyota's philosophy is. And to be fair, every lmp1-h broke at Le Mans this year. Porsche just fixed their's first and fastest.
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Old 21 Sep 2017, 22:06 (Ref:3769152)   #204
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Concentrating on Le Mans. Sounds like a good plan.
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Old 24 Sep 2017, 12:15 (Ref:3769564)   #205
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S griffin should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridS griffin should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridS griffin should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridS griffin should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
Wasn't a too bad race, good battle with Porsche and Toyota, shame they swapped places at the end, but what can you do?
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Old 25 Sep 2017, 07:11 (Ref:3769687)   #206
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hi guys,

I did a race analysis in my Blog:

https://drracing.wordpress.com/2017/...race-analysis/

I think there are a couple of interesting points coming out of the study.
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Old 25 Sep 2017, 21:52 (Ref:3769813)   #207
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hi guys,

I did a race analysis in my Blog:

https://drracing.wordpress.com/2017/...race-analysis/

I think there are a couple of interesting points coming out of the study.
Nice analysis. In Sector 2 the Porsche's were faster, the #1 notably so. But it had lower top speed. I think it's clear the Porsche's have more downforce total than the Toyota. Also in Sector 2 their hybrid is probably more favorable since it's a flowing type of nature with the high speed turns. Less braking in that area means Toyota doesn't use the (kers) hybrid as much. The only place they can make headway is the long back straight. But you see in Sector 3 that the Toyota can use it's hybrid more and even though it's still a downforce sector, they can actually keep pace and be slightly ahead of Porsche on average because of the types of turns- ones that see heavy braking and heavy acceleration. The same goes for Sector 1. At the end of the lap to the beginning of the lap you have two straights. They boost on the pit straight and the heavy braking gives them more kers to then use on the following straight before Sector 2 begins.

Lots of laps for an average are a much better gauge than just looking at fastest laps. Thanks for sharing. Another thing that can play into this is traffic. So without boost override on the #8, it may have been wasting hybrid energy it could have used when free of traffic. Also Sarrazin was on call up and he is not as familiar as Nakajima and Buemi in the #8, so his stint was well off the pace of the other two.
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