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Old 18 Sep 2017, 22:12 (Ref:3768420)   #316
rich07
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rich07 should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridrich07 should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridrich07 should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridrich07 should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
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Originally Posted by V8 Fireworks View Post
DTM is nothing like V8 Supercars... the entire premise is flawed. DTM only has works car from three, later two, manufacturers, with very rigid team order structures to ensure the "chosen" driver collects maximum points.

While I only skimmed the article did they mention that DTM is incredibly boring? It's what happens when you let manufacturers run their own series.

BTCC would be a better comparison, as like Supercars it's full of independents out for themselves.


Very good points

The manufacturers call the shots there, no room for privateers to fight the factory teams. Merchandise is surprisingly hard to come by also. The cars are pretty cool but they're too aero dependant unlike a Supercar which makes for some processional racing. Don't get me started on them incorporating DRS...

When DTM first returned around 2000 the cars had much less aero which lead to some fantastic racing which can be found on YouTube. Maybe DTM has to go that way.
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Old 7 Nov 2017, 00:28 (Ref:3779128)   #317
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Umai Naa should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridUmai Naa should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
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Super Tourers are baaaaaack...
Aaaaannnd they were a no-show at the October Wakefield Park event.

Will they appear at Sandown this weekend?
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Old 7 Nov 2017, 06:42 (Ref:3779176)   #318
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Aaaaannnd they were a no-show at the October Wakefield Park event.

Will they appear at Sandown this weekend?
Nope. 944's (IIRC) were sourced as a replacement about 4-6 weeks ago.
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Old 7 Nov 2017, 07:58 (Ref:3779182)   #319
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A pity, any revival of an historic Super Touring class would surely warrant the revival of "ol faithful" of this section of the tentenths.com forum, the "02 astc" thread
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Old 7 Nov 2017, 08:35 (Ref:3779193)   #320
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And the same reasons for that thread's length, are the same as now; no one can afford to run one, let alone buy one.
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Old 10 Jan 2018, 03:46 (Ref:3791656)   #321
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Is switching to SuperGT's as DTM are investigating the answer?
DTM to SuperGT?
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Old 10 Jan 2018, 04:06 (Ref:3791658)   #322
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Is switching to SuperGT's as DTM are investigating the answer?
DTM to SuperGT?
I saw that article and wondered the same thing. would in theory allow an easy Commodore transition if required

Not a v8 which would be a negative, but maybe Gen 3 will move the audience on and be ok with that
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Old 10 Jan 2018, 04:50 (Ref:3791662)   #323
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I thought Supercars already had SuperGT planned for this season??
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Old 10 Jan 2018, 05:02 (Ref:3791666)   #324
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I saw that article and wondered the same thing. would in theory allow an easy Commodore transition if required

Not a v8 which would be a negative, but maybe Gen 3 will move the audience on and be ok with that
I am with you on this, can I add this :


The GT categories , GT- GT 4 , are popping up more across the globe.

There is still a few places to race V8 powered cars.
but that seems to be diminishing, in line with the main manufactures in Europe going towards diesel, and in the near future , hybrid and elec cars , as the European Union push towards no fossil fuel powered cas by the next 10 years or less.

That basically leaves the God-dam US of A , to still run V8's.

So GT series running at first, Turbo Diesel 4's then crossing to all out elec series
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Old 11 Jan 2018, 01:46 (Ref:3791880)   #325
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And the same reasons for that thread's length, are the same as now; no one can afford to run one, let alone buy one.
Lots of people, however, can afford to run GT4s.

GT4s are:
  • Relatively cheap
  • Production based
  • Relatively slow
  • Wide variety of manufacturers

The Nissan 370Z GT4, Ford Mustang GT4 and Chevrolet Camaro GT4 are already homologated and would be a simple turn-key solution for the respective teams (or they could choose from the wide range of other homologated marques).





Would they be a suitable regulation for the Supercars/ATCC? Would it be a faux pas for "Supercars"/ATCC to be significantly slower and less spectacular than GT3 cars?

Technically these are GT cars not touring cars, and they have the wrong number of doors. Should a "sedan" subclass of GT4 be created for slow and affordable GT4-style production-based four-doors such as the BMW M3, Mercedes C43 AMG and Alfa Romeo Giulia QV to compete in the Supercars championship?
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Old 11 Jan 2018, 02:12 (Ref:3791884)   #326
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You could potentially model a new sedan class off the GT4 ruleset. The only key difference being the body shape.

Or just re-jig the existing rules to run the Mustang, the Zed, and the Camaro shapes regardless of manufacturer input, using the existing V8 and V6 Supercar engines. Before anyone pipes up, yes a V8 fits in the Zed.
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Old 11 Jan 2018, 03:54 (Ref:3791895)   #327
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Or just re-jig the existing rules to run the Mustang, the Zed, and the Camaro shapes regardless of manufacturer input, using the existing V8 and V6 Supercar engines. Before anyone pipes up, yes a V8 fits in the Zed.
It absolutely mystifies me why this hasn't occurred already.
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Old 11 Jan 2018, 05:19 (Ref:3791901)   #328
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Before anyone pipes up, yes a V8 fits in the Zed.
Many different V8s as well. I've seen LS, Nissan VK and Dodge NASCAR swaps all done.
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Old 11 Jan 2018, 09:23 (Ref:3791924)   #329
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You could potentially model a new sedan class off the GT4 ruleset. The only key difference being the body shape.
Would GT4s, be they coupes or sedans, be too slow though? The proudction-based GT4s are fast compared to a standard roadcar, but ten seconds or more per lap slower compared to a V8 Supercar or GT3.

The Italian V8 Superstars series were essentially production-based V8 sedans, and they were quite lumbering and slow, given the high weights of most V8 production sedans. With production-cars, weight would be up from the circa 1360kg of the current V8 Supercars to more like 1760kg and power would be much less, down from 700bhp to around 500bhp.

V8 Superstars racing: https://youtu.be/8w5QsL_ISdU?t=17m35s Good variety though, and the Italians don't seem to have heard of the phrases "muffler" or "trackside noise limit" which is pretty amusing!

could one could argue Italian Superstars racing went out of business due to lack of environmental sensitivity and/or lack of manufacturer support?

Is itimportant that Australian Supercars shows environmental sensivity and adopt hybrid powertrains with downsized eco-turbo power units, say a 1.6L turbo four?

Last edited by V8 Fireworks; 11 Jan 2018 at 09:32.
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Old 11 Jan 2018, 11:13 (Ref:3791950)   #330
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if we introduce Gt4 in Australia as main stream Motorsport we have killed mainstream motorsport in Australia.

Go back to drawing board and do it quick

thats why the Super Gt/DTM is a good startegy. It is much quicker than GT4 (and even gt3)
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