ALMS - Stability - NOT!

[LouisTheShark]

http://www.theracesite.com/index.cfm...m_article=5667

What a joke! Wonder if Alex Job had the prize money in his budget?

Not paying the endurance prize money is pretty cheezy too. Remember when Sanchez paid the IMSA prize money in the first Miami GP when the race only ran a few laps in the rain?

Smells like cash flow problems again. The Alex Job decision still means they have to pay out the money to privateers, but I believe this decision allows them to wait until the end of the season.

[Es Nes]

alex jobe, simply put, were deemed a factory team and now they are no longer eligible for privateer prize money. simple as that.

[danhx]

And they are, basically, a factory team so i think IMSA is right. AJR don't really pay for their cars and they get the best factory drivers; they're the closest thing to a factory i've seen without actually being one. Racer's Group, PK, Petersen, etc. get favors and such from the factory, but nothing to the extent of Alex Job. Whether it's a good change or not is kinda hard to tell.

[dretceterini]

That's absurd1 Job a factory team and Joest isn't? I suppose Pratt & Miller isn't a factory team either...

[noise boy 2]

Job gets drivers, cars, and parts from porsche sans charge, that makes it a factory supported team. Joest is running last years car, with no support from audi, ergo not a factory team. Pratt & Miller is a factory team and thus not eligible for privateers prize money. Robert

[vwpilot]

The sticky ones would be the Champion Team and the Joest team. They are not really factory teams because they do not get monetary support from Audi, however, they are using factory drivers, so its a little tricky.

Job is as close to factory without Porsche campaigning the team themselves. That is why they were declared factory.

It is the right decision. It now gives the smaller guys a chance to win some money towards their efforts.

BTW, from the way that I heard it, Job was fully supportive of the idea and almost sounded like they initiated the change. I dont think you will hear them complaining at all.

[Kurt Maxwell]

So how does Joest run a for profit team without support from Audi?

Don't think that Champion isn't as much of a factory backed team as Job is.

All this privateer Audi **** is manufactured by the wizards of PanOZ land. Just like the news that Panoz was not entering a factory Panoz team as it would be un fair to the privateers was bs, so is this fable.

Try buying an Audi R8 and racing it without their support. They even tell you who is driving YOUR car-IF they let you buy one. But you do get their other help as well.


ALMS-"fur die kinder"

[Chevyguy]

To further your point Kurt, Dyson looked into an R8, but didn't want to do it because Audi exterts too much control. Also, I don't beleive Champion is eligible for the IMSA cup either, as they are so well supported.

I beleive it is fair that the Job team is not eligible, and they aren't complaining. I'll also don't know why Louis implied this thread about rules stability. This isn't a rule, it's a rewards program.

[Jay]

Having spoken at length with a few members of the Alex Job team this weekend (great bunch of people), I think it is totally fair, and I think they do too. I really dont see what the fuss is about there.

[noise boy 2]

Originally posted by Kurt Maxwell
So how does Joest run a for profit team without support from Audi?

Don't think that Champion isn't as much of a factory backed team as Job is.

All this privateer Audi **** is manufactured by the wizards of PanOZ land. Just like the news that Panoz was not entering a factory Panoz team as it would be un fair to the privateers was bs, so is this fable.

Try buying an Audi R8 and racing it without their support. They even tell you who is driving YOUR car-IF they let you buy one. But you do get their other help as well.


ALMS-"fur die kinder"

So I am assuming then that the giant INFINIEON Stickers on the car are just for play? Maybe it all revolves around shelf space? Robert

[noise boy 2]

Originally posted by Chevyguy
To further your point Kurt, Dyson looked into an R8, but didn't want to do it because Audi exterts too much control. Also, I don't beleive Champion is eligible for the IMSA cup either, as they are so well supported.

I beleive it is fair that the Job team is not eligible, and they aren't complaining. I'll also don't know why Louis implied this thread about rules stability. This isn't a rule, it's a rewards program.

Do you know that dyson rejected the audi, and for that reason? This has been a long running rumor, but I have never heard Rob say so. As far as champion goes, I am assuming that the ADT stickers that dominate the car are just a shelf space deal too? Robert

[Ken May]

ROTFLMAO!

[Kurt Maxwell]

Infineon is a large vendor to Audi, so it is like a vendor-retailer program,smartguy. If that was an R&S those stickers and any funds would not be there.

As far as ADT, I have been told that they did a trade for alarm systems for their stores. There may be some money involved as well, but enough to run the car without help from Audi and/or cash out of pocket from the dealership? Sure.

Still think noiseboy is funny, Kenny?

[Ken May]

"I have been told...."
ROTFLMAO....

Ah yes, the days and months change, but some things stay constant...

Yawn..........maxisporty

So much for your so many claims, on so many boards, so often, of ignoring me! ROTFLMAO!

[Kurt Maxwell]

No,things never do change with you. You still have no clue and make fun of those who do.

Have a nice trip to Road America,Ken.
Be sure to be very careful while you are in
Elkhart Lake. I want you around to rub your nose in your own bs.

[vwpilot]

Originally posted by Kurt Maxwell
Infineon is a large vendor to Audi, so it is like a vendor-retailer program,smartguy. If that was an R&S those stickers and any funds would not be there.

And you also wont find McKenna Porsche sponsoring a Ferrari. Whats your point?

Sponsors often will choose something they are related too, doesnt mean they are not paying to be on the car. Porsche dealerships dont get to advertise free on Porsches, so what makes you think an Audi supplier would get to advertise free on an Audi?

[noise boy 2]

Mr Maxwell, you are the easiest goat to get on the internet. Robert

[noise boy 2]

By the way, I already knew that Infineon is a business partner to audi (computers and such for the cars, both road and race), a friend works in the DNA research field, and they do a fair bit of work with Infineon as well. As far as ADT goes, you may be right, but I suspect not, knowing how cheap an alarm install is, even for the more complicated ones, the money is in the monitoring. Robert

[Ken May]

Yet again, Kurt you find it difficult to keep your word....ahem, you know, of not responding or using foul comments that have no bearing on a thread. Are you tring to get banned from yet another baord? Oops, dont answer that, as I know you will again try to make good of your earlier comments!

But alas, thank you for your concern about my well being at Road America, should be fun...lets see..that is Daytona, Sebring, Barber Park, Mid Ohio, and now RA...probably will be more fun than Daytona!

Yawn...the more things change, the more they stay the same....um with some!

[Chevyguy]

OK, noiseboy, back to your question.

Pat Smith-"There have been some talks between Rob and Audi, but I am not privy to them. I wouldn't except anything on that front because Audi exert too much control on their teams. We're rebels."
-Le Mans Series and Sportscar Racer Dec. '01

Not so much rejected as blown off. Just the team manager's speculation, but backs what I was saying.

I looked at imsaracing.net, and I saw the privateer points fund, and guess what! Joest is eligible and Champion is not. What I find intriguing is the fact that JML is also eligible. Now how are they not just as backed as Alex Job? I get a favoritism, or some sort of motor vehicle neputism from Dr. Don on that one.

[Kurt Maxwell]

Infineon are simply supporting Audi-so it is in effect Audi money because it is a leverage deal- "we like having your business and if you think this is good we will help out" -and it may not even be but a portion of the Joest budget. Big stickers don't always mean big money.

It is a bit like seeing GMAC on the Corvettes, except that it is an outside supplier.
Do you really think GMAC is spending tons of ad budget on that? They may not be spending anything.

Infineon may just be defraying the budget or paying for much of it. The real point here is that Audi are making sure the money is there for this "privateer" R-8.

Perhap the deal with ADT included the monitoring as well. I only know what a former team driver told me.

[noise boy 2]

I believe the real issue is whether or not the team is being used for development. In previous years, the Joest team was the development team for Audi, and Champion got the bits after Joest had figured them all out (or lemans). In the current iteration the car is done with the real development (and quite handily the best engineered car on the track as a result of it) and Champion and Joest seem to have the same equipment for this season.
AJR on the other hand is getting development pieces at no cost, thus is a factory team. As someone either here or at the imsa forum pointed out, the difference is that the other teams can get these pieces but they have to pay.

Corvette Racing is owned lock stock and barrel by GM and wholly supported (or at least predominately supported) by GM Funds, GM contracts to have Katech build the motors (and provides the custom LS6 block that allows 7liters displacement) and has Pratt & Miller build and run the cars as another contract. Which is entirely different than the Ferrari 550 for instance, which is being developed by an independent party (prodrive) with non factory money (as far as I know), or Dyson and Field developing the EX257 out of their own pockets.
I understand why infineon is putting their decals on the Joest Car, much as I understand why Audi Sport North America is probably paying at least part of Champion's Budget. I think that the difference is that unlike GMAC on a Corvette, real money is passing between the sponsor and the team. Robert

[gttouring]

right on Noise Boy

[vwpilot]

For those that still see the conspiricy in AJR being excluded in the privateer points, posted on the Race Site today was this.

8/5/2003 - Yesterday we wrote a piece on the Alex Job Racing effort and the fact that they are no longer included in the Privateer Points Fund. Andrew Schupack, who handles Public Relations for Porsche, was kind enough to help us understand the situation:

1. Alex Job Racing, in consideration for the extra support it gets from Porsche for fielding factory drivers, withdrew from the fund in fairness to the other comeptitors.
2. IMSA did not declare AJR a factory team, or eliminate AJR from the fund. AJR, as a private entrant, could re-join the fund at any time, and keeps all the money he has earned so far.
3. A factory team is one for which the entrant is the factory (BMW Motorsports versus PTG, Audi Motorsport North America versus Team Joest, etc.). A Porsche factory team would be entered as Porsche Motorsport, Porsche AG, or Porsche Motorsport North America.

Since Peter Gregg and Hurley Haywood drove for Brumos with factory support in 1972, Porsche has picked top private teams to support in a series rather than enter a factory team. AJR and ALMS in 2003 is no different.

Thanks Andrew for the clarification. The fact that Alex Job Racing withdrew from the fund themselves makes for a much different slant than them being removed from the Privateer Points Fund.

Porsches method of picking key privateer teams, rather than entering a factory team, has been a key ingredient in Porsche's success in sportscar racing. Of course it doesn't hurt that they build one of the most reliable and best performing machines on the market either.

So in other words, they are not even factory under the definition of the rules, although they are as close as it gets, just like Joest and Champion.

[Carousel]

Originally posted by Kurt Maxwell
Perhap the deal with ADT included the monitoring as well. I only know what a former team driver told me.

At the number I heard (just shy of seven figures per year for the last two years), that's a lot of monitoring.