What should be done to improve overtaking

[paulzinho]

What should be done to bring overtaking back to F1?

Manual gearboxes
no launch control
no traction control
faster circuits (allow slipstreaming)
keep hockenheim
get rid of barcelona
get rid of hungaroring
ban testing (controversial!!!)

[badoer fan]

ban Bernie and Max

[Wrex]

Originally posted by paulzinho
What should be done to bring overtaking back to F1?

Manual gearboxes
no launch control
no traction control
faster circuits (allow slipstreaming)
keep hockenheim
get rid of barcelona
get rid of hungaroring
ban testing (controversial!!!)

All of the above is a good start, ban refuelling too.

[Morris 1100]

Drum brakes
no wings

[f1manoz]

Originally posted by paulzinho
What should be done to bring overtaking back to F1?

Manual gearboxes
no launch control
no traction control
faster circuits (allow slipstreaming)
keep hockenheim
get rid of barcelona
get rid of hungaroring
ban testing (controversial!!!)

Agree with all those. Although F1 is supposed to be at the forefront of technology, realistically it makes the racing dull. So, get rid of it all I say.

Semi-automatic/automatic gearboxes - why not just put road cars on the circuit?? When manual gearboxes were used all those years ago, that's how most passes were made. The driver in front would miss a shift, the guy behind would be perfect, would slipstream him and pass. That was called REAL RACING!!!

L/C and T/C - just another bloody thing to go wrong for Mika at the moment. And it just takes more emphasis away from the driver skill and more emphasis on electronics. Soon drivers will control their cars with little more than a joystick.

Faster circuits - everyone would agree with you there, but the drivers have been pussified over the years. Everything is about 'safety' nowadays.

To quote the Great George Carlin - 'soon they'll need to wear a helmet for jerking off'

Circuits like Hockenheim and Spa are drivers circuits, or just real quick and make for exciting racing. If the FIA were to get rid of all these, we'd be left with mickey-mouse circuits, and why on earth would we watch cars just follow each other round the track (Hang on, don't we do that already.......)

Ban testing - superb idea that CART have done, but the F1 teams would never agree. Where else would they spend their millions??? If they ban all this testing, we may also see more unreliability, so teams like Prost and Minardi may score points (although it would probably be the reverse and they'd drop out quicker!) Manufacturers wouldn't agree as it makes them look bad, sponsors wouldn't like it as they might be allied to a losing team and team bosses would hate it because the money might not come in as much. The drivers, though, might like it.

Slick tyres - With grooves, there is less rubber contact on the road, so therefore less grip. With slicks, there would be more rubber contact. Plus could you imagine how grippy slick tyres would be with the war between Michelin and Bridgestone?!?!?

Another - aerodynamics has blossomed so the car is like one giant aerofoil, but a big (if not the biggest at the moment) is the floor/underbody of the car (could anyone back me up or tell me if I'm wrong?) They get so much grip from underneath the car that there is less emphasis on the front/rear wings (again, I don't know if I'm right). So to change this, put more emphasis on front/rear end wings for grip (particularly the front so cars can follow each other throught turns) and less emphasis (in fact make it illegal even) on other parts of the car. 100% downforce from the wings only.

[paulzinho]

Thanks f1manoz for reminding me of slicks. Is it ne or do the high noses seem to have resulted in less overtaking. just a theory.

[DNQ]

Higher noses just mean more air under the car, and therefore a bit more grip - so yes, it may have made it a little hard to overtake.

[f1grandprixshop]

Originally posted by paulzinho
What should be done to bring overtaking back to F1?

Manual gearboxes
no launch control
no traction control
faster circuits (allow slipstreaming)
keep hockenheim
get rid of barcelona
get rid of hungaroring
ban testing (controversial!!!)

i hope they'll remove the launch control, its no fun watching the start anymore.

[JeremySmith]

Well you guys have said it all...Ban traction control,semi-automatic gearboxes,launch control,re-introduce slick tyres,ban refueling,cut testing time in half,get rid of chicanes(bloody stupid things),ban bernie and max,introduce air bag style armco,keep carbon brakes,bring back skid blocks..


Best regards to all....Jeremy

[Sodemo]

I still stand by the fact that its the cars at fault not the circuits, hell we had overtaking at Hungary in 97' with Hill taking M Schu at the first corner.

Slick tyres, wide cars, steel brakes, manual gearboxes
maximum of 1 rear wing element.

[Crank Case]

Why are people obsessed with seeing more overtaking?
There is plenty of over taking especially the last few races (even from the front runners)
I think people moan just for the sake of moaning sometimes (I think it’s mainly the *** gits)
Instead of just watching the Ferraris and the Mc Larens try watching some of the other teams (failing that sit at the window at one of them restaurants that spans the motorways you could watch cars overtaking all day But please try to contain yourself there is lots and lots of cars overtaking
Try watching super bikes there is lot’s of overtaking in that sport but to be honest the whole race seems pointless you might as well just watch the last lap the lead can change that often do we really want to see that in Formula 1

THERE IS PLENTY OF OVERTAKING IN FORMULA 1

[hunttheshunt]

Get rid of Monaco! Thats far worse than Hungary or Catalunya. See DC w/Enrique this year.

[paulzinho]

Originally posted by hunttheshunt
Get rid of Monaco! Thats far worse than Hungary or Catalunya. See DC w/Enrique this year.

that was just DC being ****. Do you really think schuey would have stayed behind for that long?

[kristof14]

for decent overtaking watch touring cars! cars going round cars literally attached to each othereither door handle to dor handle or bumper to bumper! (and they can keep goin if bits fall off )

[paulzinho]

BTCC needs more toring cars karloff. saw them earlier this year at brands and frankly they were a bit of a disappointment.

[paulzinho]

BTCC needs more toring cars kristof. saw them earlier this year at brands and frankly they were a bit of a disappointment.

[mac]

Faster circuits don't necessarily mean more passing. Look at some of the tracks where CART have plenty of passing - they aren't necessarily fast circuits, and a lot of them are surrounded by concrete walls. As Alex Zanardi once said, "when you get to the braking zone at 300km/h and you're surrounded by concrete walls, that's what separates men from boys."

However, tracks that have only long, fast, sweeping curves (like Barcelona) are not going to produce passing. So some of the problem may be tracks. But, when you hardly get any passing at a place like Albert Park, and some of the other tracks, there must also be a problem with the cars.

When you bill a series as the ultimate, and give pretty much open slather to designers and engine manufacturers, you are never going to have equal cars. To have passing, the cars must be reasonably equal. A series without important standards (ie. not just the engines must be 3 litre V10s), will not produce great racing.

I'm not suggesting a CART style series, because, as much as I love CART, f1 must remain different. I would like to see a return to fat slicks, and a standard aero package (preferably no wings at all).

[Sodemo]

I think there are several contributing factors which result in a lack of overtaking. For a start there IS LESS overtaking than in previous years (ie ??-1997) because of

A) the cars have become ridiculous in terms of the technical rules/tyres.

B) the tracks themselves have changed, resulting in shorter straights and tighter corners.

C) the TV coverage is appalling. I'm sure Bernie makes the terrestrial feed **** on-purpose. I have many races taped of TV from previous years (1993-1997) and all of them are better than what passes for coverage today. Of course the Bernie TV feed may show more overtaking, but we (I) don't see that.

Tracks today need a huge long straight so the cars can draft one another to pass. The reason why that above poster stated that the last few races have been OK is because they are some of the best tracks for overtaking (Hockenheim - tiny wings, Silverstone - med downforce, Canada - low downforce track)

As soon as there are a few decent straights the teams have to start knocking off wing. A good example of this is Spa, where there are 3 reasonably long straights (the run down from La Source to Eau Rouge, the run from the top of Eau Rouge to La combe, and from Radillone to the Bus Stop)
As soon as the cars use less wing - its easier to pass.

So why don't they reduce the max wing level to 1 element?

[f1grandprixshop]

Originally posted by hunttheshunt
Get rid of Monaco! Thats far worse than Hungary or Catalunya. See DC w/Enrique this year.

what's wrong with Monaco? It would be fun to see M.Schumi at the back of the field and carving his way to the front...

DC should have done better on a faster car. (supposed to be his on a faster car) and his talent.

[Liz]

Get back to the Turbos of the 1980s (even Nigel Roebuck says so.)

Then get better drivers who can handle the cars when they discover they have to drive them, not just hold onto the steering wheel and follow orders coming over the radio.

On second thought, watch Champ Cars instead. They have already got these elements.