5 Minute Spud Mouths Off Again - Page 2

Gunslinger · 13 Apr 2003, 00:25 (Ref:567748)

heh

Armco Bender · 13 Apr 2003, 09:10 (Ref:567935)

Skaife pushes Murph off at PI,no penalty for Skaife,double standards here?:confused:

Crash Test · 13 Apr 2003, 10:05 (Ref:567974)

Pfffttt... nutting your teammate is punishment enough, isn't it?

simon5574 · 13 Apr 2003, 10:45 (Ref:568012)

But they're seperate teams..

William Dale Jr · 13 Apr 2003, 11:42 (Ref:568051)

I just want to hear what Murphy and Skaife have to say about the incident...

Crash Test · 13 Apr 2003, 12:12 (Ref:568077)

Simon, ummm errrrm, ummmm, yep, correct!

**GTRMagic** · 14 Apr 2003, 06:28 (Ref:568771)

Killer Spud wasnt a happy boy after the race.... I bet he wishes he had a Bargs to crash into to take his vent his anger

simon5574 · 14 Apr 2003, 09:11 (Ref:568856)

and those sideburns aren't getting any better, get the guy a mirror!

racealign · 14 Apr 2003, 11:56 (Ref:568970)

i really don't think its appropriate or fair to call anyone a killer even if you are only half serious, thats a bit sick. I believe that Murphy is correct to say that he wouldn't do anything different. If he did brake to allow bargs in then he could have been hit from behind and still have caused a pile up. If he had moved over he may have been on the grass and he may have crashed or caused a crash that involved more people. The point is it is the drivers responsibility not to put themselves into a dangerous position. You can't expect another driver to concede positions just because you make a deliberate dangerous move on them and thereby put yourself at risk and therefore force them to save you. Thats rediculous! That means to pass everyone in front of you all you have to do is put yourself in danger.
Results are important to all the V8 supercar competitors and they all have to race hard to keep their drives or appease their sponsors. They are under enormous pressure and they ALL will do anything to intimidate, unsettle or out-psyche ALL their competitiors. What would you do if all your competitors kept pushing you off the track? Would you let them? Would you watch your drive be taken because you failed to perform? Would you let your sponsor walk away cause you couldn't cut the mustard?

**GTRMagic** · 14 Apr 2003, 23:10 (Ref:569566)

I dont doubt any of that racealign.... Murf is totally cold blooded yet runs hot and cold as if with a latin temprament.

I have seen how the guy gets out of his race cars, the fire and hate in his eyes... its not the way others in the sport operate... he seems to go into a weird funk... but can be as nice as pie to fans and the like.

You would almost call it bipolar.

Aggression is one thing, safety is another. Bargs is a very luck guy not to have been hurt in that incident.

Why Murf brought it all back up again I dont know. Maybe KRT needs a media vegemite to sanitise the thoughts of their alleged star?

Trevor P · 15 Apr 2003, 01:04 (Ref:569639)

Racealign.
You are kidding!
Murph had no one within cooee behind him when Bargs moved over. All that had to be done was for Murph to dab the brakes. Positions are lost all the time in racing. And who the hell cares if you are twelfth place? Murph obviously does! Life and death racing!
Bargs could have been killed for god's sake, even if it was initiated by his own stupidity!
Ironically, when Bargwanna was in his early racing career in Vees and Fords, he would do a Murph on others quite often, but there is still no excuse for the second party to react on avoid an incident.

Rhys_00 · 15 Apr 2003, 01:38 (Ref:569664)

This is going a bit far, get real people, nobody gets in a race car to kill people. SO you think Murph somehow knew Bargs would go pinballing across the circuit? Give the guy a break and think about the immature sh!t you are all posting.
"Murph obviously does! Life and death racing!"
" the fire and hate in his eyes... "
What stupid things to say, for one incident, initiated from a split second decision that was arguably wrong (quite obviously). That was a whole year ago. He doesn't deserve this and theres no reason why any of you should be saying it.

**GTRMagic** · 15 Apr 2003, 01:52 (Ref:569676)

Um No Rhys_00, I have been lucky enough to be standing in the area where Mr Murphy alights from his vehicle after every session of the AGP meeting, and PI...

Its not a one off, its a consistent (or inconsistent??) pattern of behaviour that is noted in this one particular driver.

When the guy gets out of the car still totally wound up physically and mentally, and looking for an outlet in a similar vein to the 5 minute penalty at Bathurst, there is something wrong with the mental attitude of the guy.

Does any other driver in the field do this stuff?? Not that I have seen, and rarely so consistently.

Trevor P · 15 Apr 2003, 02:27 (Ref:569709)

Rhys
No one can get into a person's heart and mind to know if they really want to kill under such circumstances. But thats only the difference between manslaughter and murder (to use a distasteful analogy).
Our message was simple. Murph could easily have avoided the Barg incident. Murph was not completely innocent. To use another distasteful analogy, if that incident had occurred on the road, the police would have come down hard on Murph as well.
This thread started over Murph announcing that he would do it again. That is the most stupid, immature @#%* I have heard so far.

Rhys_00 · 15 Apr 2003, 02:38 (Ref:569714)

Stupid, immature etc., true. But doesn't warrant comments like those I pointed out above.
GTR he certainly doesnt seem to have that unbreakable sunshine in his personality that some drivers have, but how many other drivers have had their Bathurst chances ruined by a controversial 5 minute penalty? I agree he seems agressive outside the car e.g. "I'll do it again" but aside from that incident I can't think of any of his driving that would warrant such labels that he has been given in this thread. He seems a clean driver who sometimes just gets the raw deal and certainly isn't the most aggressive driver in the field. (Remember Romano's stupid act?)
Saying he would do it again certainly wasn't smart, but maybe was taken out of context. He could have meant that faced with those circumstances he would make the same decision, not necessarily that he would turn Bargwanna's car into twisted metal again given the opportunity.
Just because he would do that again doesnt at all mean that he did it knowing what would happen, or that he would do it again knowing what would happen. It could, but like i said it isnt conclusively saying that he meant that. I sure hope all that made sense

RaceTime · 15 Apr 2003, 04:32 (Ref:569754)

Whilst we are on such an old topic, any chance of going over (and over and over and over) Senna's accident?

I mean - comeone guys - this happened last year - drop it and leave it....

Trevor P · 15 Apr 2003, 06:35 (Ref:569816)

Mr Racetime
This is a discussion forum. What are discussion forums for? Are you going to set rules for discussion forums? For better or worse, you discuss things on discussion forums.
Again, this thread was initiated not by the incident last year, but by a dumb thing that was said only days ago by a leading driver. That's what we are discussing.
I have read most of your inputs into this group for a few months now, and most of what you say is spot on, but you sure do have a have a high and mighty attitude.
Let people speak (or type in this case).
And why not write things about Senna's incident? (Somewhere else of course). You can learn lots from history.

racealign · 15 Apr 2003, 09:51 (Ref:569932)

Well trevor P, I guess you arn't a race driver. Don't you realise that all the guys out there are driving to win, they don't want to come second, or third, or fourth or fifth...etc..! You think that there are a few bad guys and all the rest are Mr Good guys. You have to be kidding...even gentleman jim will do whatever it takes to win...he hates coming second anytime anywhere...thats what makes them RACE DRIVERS!
you think murphy had time to check his mirrors?...to look around...have a picnic..?..things on the start line happen so quickly that half the time you have no idea who or what hit you..

Murph is not a killer nor does he intend to hurt someone from any incident and I think thats its wrong to say that about anyone in any forum.
In this category brake testing, door rubbing, intimadation,pysching, veering, blocking, taps, rubs etc are all tools of the trade and they ALL use them. None of the present or past touring car drivers (including Brock, moffat, jane, Jim richards etc) take any prisoners when they race and when you create that type of atmosphere then you are bound have incidents such as this.
I suggest you go out buy a supercar and get out there and see just how u get treated! You get in there way and they will turf you..

Trevor P · 16 Apr 2003, 03:00 (Ref:570709)

Sorry Racealign
I am a regular club competitor, and have a few race wins under my belt in about twenty years of racing.
Please go ahead and explain to us ignoramus's real racing car driver's attitudes. The results were there for all the world to see at Phillip Island last year. And Spud's words were there for all the world to read in the press release last week.
In my case, I stopped with that attitude about five years in.
Again, it doesn't matter whether you do something deliberately or not, it's the final result of the reckless behaviour or words that matter.

racealign · 16 Apr 2003, 10:15 (Ref:570939)

lots of laughs....
i take it you are talking on behalf of everyone else in the forum...you want me to tell "us ignoramus's" real racing drivers attitude...you talk in a condescending tone because...why? you don't like what's said?

I guess you didn't like the "your not a race driver" bit. I said that because I can't believe that you would expect a driver who was trying hard to get to the front, one who is looking for holes or opportunities to pass, who is already on the edge of the track, has someone come over on him very quickly and you then expect that the guy should jam on his brakes! i just don't think that is reasonable. I think that unless you were the actual driver (murphy), you wouldn't know if you could have done anything to avoid the incident, no matter what you think you saw on television. I think that anyone who has raced a car would know that things can happen very quickly and no matter how good you think you are or how many years experience you've had, you sometimes can't avoid the resulting accident. Especilly off the start line with 32 odd cars of fairly even performance and 32 odd drivers all desperate to gain position in a national race.
When Murphy says that he wouldn't have done anything differently, i think he believes that he really either didn't have time, didn't see or couldn't do anything about the accident without putting himself in danger. Maybe its not the best way of putting it, but when another guy is trying to belt you, you might say things that you shouldn't.
It sounds to me that in your twenty years of racing, that you have never had someone come over on you in a corner, hit you then spear off into the fence. Under your criteria, you are the one in the wrong. Due to your being hit by the other driver, you are the one that by your "reckless behaviour", caused the accident because you didn't avoid it. If you got out of the car and said.."I couldn't do anything about it... he caused it". Then I believe that you would be saying exactly what Murphy said .

From what I can gather, you have decided, in your infinite wisdom, that Murphy could have avoided the accident. Obviously then, you should be the driving standards observer at all race meetings! You wouldn't need to hear from the drivers because you have the unbelievable ability to make instantly correct judgements.

Trevor P · 16 Apr 2003, 23:22 (Ref:571644)

Racealign
I think we are taking this way off track.
This is what I wrote on my first reply to this thread.

"Why is it that some drivers don't know that they have a brake pedal underneath their feet. The pedal is there not just to slow down your car before a corner. Sometimes you are allowed to use it on other occasions for a wide range of reasons, including avoiding an accident.
Moving over to stop the car behind from passing you? Guilty Bargs.
Failing to slow your vehicle down to avoid a collision? Guilty Murph."

The "you are not a race driver bit" didn't worry me, but the implication that you know and others don't was my bait. That's OK though too. That's what discussions are for.

To quote you

"From what I can gather, you have decided, in your infinite wisdom, that Murphy could have avoided the accident. Obviously then, you should be the driving standards observer at all race meetings!"

Well, let's all of us then not email anything on these groups! Do you have any opinions ever on what a driver should have or shouldn't have done? It would be boring not too.

"...one who is looking for holes or opportunities to pass, who is already on the edge of the track, has someone come over on him very quickly and you then expect that the guy should jam on his brakes! i just don't think that is reasonable"

Actually, this can be very reasonable. Perhaps it was only luck that ensured it wasn't Murph who was rolling out of control.

"I think that unless you were the actual driver (murphy), you wouldn't know if you could have done anything to avoid the incident, no matter what you think you saw on television"

I guess collision avoidance is not a skill then.

"You wouldn't need to hear from the drivers because you have the unbelievable ability to make instantly correct judgements"

I heard all the driver's points of view last year. But I can make judgements based on what I saw as well. I am a spectator on this, but Murph is the professional racing car driver. Yes, they make mistakes, but it is their mistakes, not anyone elses.

"When Murphy says that he wouldn't have done anything differently, i think he believes that he really either didn't have time, didn't see or couldn't do anything about the accident without putting himself in danger. Maybe its not the best way of putting it, but when another guy is trying to belt you, you might say things that you shouldn't."

Yep, I never said anything otherwise. But his doesn't change anything. We are all responsible for our own actions.

Gone far enough on this.

Rhys_00 · 17 Apr 2003, 02:44 (Ref:571746)

Someone should kill this thread. And everyone else, stop flogging the dead horse. Murph hit bargs. Did he mean it? Its been discussed. Is he a "Killer"? Its been discussed. Did he make the right decision? Its been flogged to death people.

racealign · 17 Apr 2003, 07:53 (Ref:571853)

Rhys_00 don't read the threads if you don't like them.

I will not apologise for writing here about this because I particularly don't like that Murphy is labeled a killer. I don't care if trevor P thinks I have been condescending towards him. I have tried to point out the opposite point of view in an attempt to get a more balanced perspective. I have tried to set out a scenario that might get them to have some doubt about the whole incident. It seems that trevor p and others have made up their minds and really won't budge.

I really don't know if Bargs was in the wrong or Murph is right or vice versa but that is the point.

I don't have a problem with people having their say even if I don't agree but with all things in life balance is important.

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
Ambrose or Spud for Champion.	sukkondat	Australasian Touring Cars.	3	15 Nov 2004 11:19
John Bowe on The Spud at the Qld300	Buckshot	Australasian Touring Cars.	12	22 Jul 2003 07:04
JV mouths off	Schumacher	Formula One	31	22 Dec 2002 22:25