[FIA GT] FIA GT Finale - Zolder - 23, 24, 25 Oct.

[Jimmy Magnusson]

Not the first time Kumpen has recieved the short end of the stick from the series (think Oschersleben 07, seems as reasonable a disqualification as this one).

[The Badger]

Now I know why im not that interested in the Fia Gt ..... cuz you never know the true results for weeks after the event ..... utter crap !!!

If I was Kumpen and crew , I would vote with my feet .

[Dani Filth]

why do people think they're innocent just because they're corvette fans pk fans or just have vitaphone ..
if they think they have a case they will surely appeal the decision /

[The Badger]

I would assume that a Pratt & Miller engine is a sealed unit . So therefor it would be forfeit if any seals were broken . Much like most electrical units , if the seal is broken , the warranty is null & void .

Exactly what improvements could PeKa do that P&M dont do ?

The same thing happened to Martin Birranes NASCAR team in the States back in the mid 90's ,Team Ireland it was called I think . His engines we're deemed illegal , but the engine was a sealed unit supplied from Roush and all Ford users used the same engine ..... differant rules for differant people is seems .

Appeal the decision ..... where exactly has that gotten Larbre ? Thats where your appeal might get you . It seems that objecting carries its own sentance these days .

[Jimmy Magnusson]

Originally Posted by Dani Filth

why do people think they're innocent just because they're corvette fans pk fans or just have vitaphone ..
if they think they have a case they will surely appeal the decision /

I shan't say too much before I have all the facts, but this whole case strikes me as quite similiar to the one with the illegal petrol tank they were disqualified for at Oschersleben in 2007. IE the FIA having a fit at something that really wasn't any important at all, and had not been done by the team. I remember that appeal dragged on for quite some time, too.

[Dani Filth]

Originally Posted by The Badger

Appeal the decision ..... where exactly has that gotten Larbre ? Thats where your appeal might get you . It seems that objecting carries its own sentance these days .

didn't Larbre won the campionshi after an appeal about 4-5 years ago ? or that's what you're talking about ?
that's exactly the posture everybody should have Jimmy .. know all the facts .. just like people calling Pk sore losers for the protest .. it was their right to do it if they believed in it.
"wasn't any important at all" .. that's not up to me to decide but aren't the penalties that somebody can get for infraction of the tech rules written in the sporting rules??

[Splendid Cat]

This is like the Rover v Volvo off-track distractions of the 1985 and 86 ETC.

Whatever the outcomes, whatever the reasons constant aggravation behind the scenes, disqualifications, appeals, re-instatements dilute the merits of any high achievers and discredit the series. I'm not sure that this is a stragegy comensurate with attracting teams, sponsors and well-heeled drivers.

I accept that rules are pushed to the extreme and can be violated - but the time delay that occurs between race, notification of violation and any resulting appeal add considerable gravitas and irony tp the "Subject to Official Confirmation" monikers when results are published.

[rich07]

Originally Posted by The Badger

Appeal the decision ..... where exactly has that gotten Larbre ? Thats where your appeal might get you . It seems that objecting carries its own sentance these days .

Larbre appealed in 2005 after the car was excluded from the final Bahrain race because there wasnt the regulation three litres of fuel left in the car (stewards could only get 2.6L from the car after the race), the car nearly running out of fuel at the end of the race. The decision to exclude came from the stewards, I never knew of another team (Vitaphone?-they had everything to gain) protesting. The steward's decision was overturned on appeal and Gardel was crowned 2005 champion. Basically how I read it they got off on a technicality. If I was Jack Leconte I would've appealed too.

The decision is here BTW http://www.fia.com/EN-GB/THE-FIA/COU...ages/2005.aspx FWIW it says nothing of another team in the results of the appeal.

As for PK, I was amazed and mildly amused when I read this latest twist five minutes ago, who knows who's in the right? How long is this circus going to go like this? Seems like tit for tat to me. And how long has it been since Zolder? If there was indeed a irregularity with the engine then why is it being brought up now rather then earlier?

If GM Racing were consulted then why are they still being excluded if the heads and block were the same as the other Corvette teams? What exactly could PK do to improve the engine that P+M couldnt do with so much more money and resources? (as has been stated already) Why would they even try? This whole affair stinks to me and is damaging to the championship's credibility and reputation..

This isnt the first time PK and the stewards have crossed paths, I'm surprised they are still in FIA GT, if they were racing an MC12 this wouldnt have happened.

[gwyllion]

According to Anthony Kumper there is a problem with the homologation of all customer engines built by Katech!

source: http://translate.google.com/translat...bouwer....html

[Dauer 962]

It’s not the only exclusion. The FIA also disqualified this week very quietly the championship winning Phoenix-Audi in the second race.

http://translate.google.de/translate...n&hl=&ie=UTF-8

[gwyllion]

Some more background about the PeKa complaint: http://translate.google.com/translat..._vervolgd.html

[SALEEN S7R]

Im just glad that it is all finally over, this has dragged on for far too long. Im glad too that Vitaphone won the championship. http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/80504

[NightStalk3r]

Originally Posted by SALEEN S7R

Im just glad that it is all finally over, this has dragged on for far too long. Im glad too that Vitaphone won the championship. http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/80504

It's not over yet.

[dxk1]

It appears that the issue with the PK Corvette could have been an inadvertent error from Katech (something having to do with a mislabeled engine part or something to that effect). Anyway, here are two articles with some more details on the exclusion of the PK Racing Corvette which discuss this possibility:

http://www.corvette-motorsport.com/n...er-results-181

and

http://www.planetlemans.com/2009/12/...hone-champion/

DK

[gwyllion]

Originally Posted by SALEEN S7R

Im glad too that Vitaphone won the championship.

... thanks to (alleged) team orders:

• Budapest: at the end of the race Guidi slowed down to let Bertolini past
• Algarve: Guidi again lets Bertolini past
• Paul Richard: Vitaphone calls Guidi in for a splash/dash (because he is allegedly low on fuel) and as a result Bertolini gains one position

[The359]

You think PK wouldn't use the same tactic if they had three cars?

[dxk1]

Originally Posted by The359

You think PK wouldn't use the same tactic if they had three cars?

I agree, that's why you run three cars so you can use a little team strategy to set up as many points as possible for the number 1 car. It's not fair, but it's team strategy. Who said things had to be fair anyway?

DK

[rich07]

Originally Posted by dxk1

I agree, that's why you run three cars so you can use a little team strategy to set up as many points as possible for the number 1 car. It's not fair, but it's team strategy. Who said things had to be fair anyway?

DK

As 359 pointed out, if PK had three cars they would've done the same thing-who wouldnt? I very much doubt that the majority of team owners wouldnt adopt the third car strategy just to be fair to the other teams- I think the sponsors for one would have something to say about that. If you have an advantage you use it.

On one hand it isnt fair that PK with one car is taking on Vitaphone with three cars but on the other hand it isnt Vitaphone's fault that they have the funding to run a third car to help the championship fight.

IMHO if PK had've beaten Vitaphone fair and square on the track without taking it to court then it would be a much more impressive win in my eyes then Vitaphone winning this year's championship.

[Splendid Cat]

Previous series / championships have seen extended entries for purpose of the win.
TWR ran 3 cars at Spa 87 to ensure the the driver's championship was wrapped up for Boesel.
Same team with 5 entries at LM 88 (US and GB, but still 5).
Nissan ran 5 cars at LM 90.
Until the, now usual, metronomic performance of cars at LM the bigger teams used the hare and tortoise approach with extended entries.
I remember drivers switching cars in the early years of GRP A or one off drives for star drivers to support a championship push - usually around the aspirations of Tom Walkinshaw, Dieter Quester.

Am sure you can all point to similar.

The larger teams have always had the opportunity to crank it up.
No difference with Vitaphone.
What is different is the animosity this has caused this year - HTTT certainly was blatant and created a very foul taste. Add to this the post race protestations and uncertainty associated and it cranks the ill-feeling.
Given that Vitaphone is the only team that has had the resources to extend its operation and the imbalance and contrived events at some races are amplified.

[The Badger]

Originally Posted by gwyllion

According to Anthony Kumper there is a problem with the homologation of all customer engines built by Katech[/url]

And I suppose the ACO have the same problem with Luc Alphand then , and Corvette Racing ?

Im sick to death of championships being dicked about with by governing bodies .

[GTfour]

Originally Posted by The Badger

Im sick to death of championships being dicked about with by governing bodies .

I second that.

Especially the constantly changing enginespec rules,which used to be tampered with soulely for raining in horsepower figures but nowadays them scamming environment nonsense is starting to have negative effects on these specs as well...

[arakis]

why is this thread still hot topic, its more then 3 months old now, I call moderators to pay atention

[NightStalk3r]

Because the protests still aint finished.

[arakis]

oh for the love of ....
its just taking up space, when the proests finish someone can post the final results, in a new thread, now its just stannding here poking my eyes out everytime i come to the forum...

[rich07]

Originally Posted by NightStalk3r

Because the protests still aint finished.

PK have appealed again? Oh for crying out loud...