What do you guys think?

[orangewarning]

Hi guys, here is a track layour that I had in mind for quite sometime.. I had decided to put the design into sketchup to see how feasible it is.
What do you guys think of this track?
Pit straight is ~580m
and total length is around 4.4-4.7km
about 25 turns in total..
Contains bits of "classic" corners here and there.
insane amount of hairpins..
Looks like a tricky circuit..
Feedback please..

[ECW Dan Selby]

It's pretty nice 'on paper'.

One thing I can tell you from experience is that that'll probably be quite a bit slower than you think, especially given the length of the circuit. You'd need that to be about Spa length (7ish km), maybe more, in order for it to come out (i'm guessing...) as you'd imagine.

It's pretty nice, though. I reckon if it was 8-9km, and if you cut out one or two of those heavy turns, it'd be even better.

Selby

[SKG]

Hi there!

Yup, I was going to say something along those lines too, either removing a couple of the more complex sections ie. the infield loop at turns 8/9/10, or maybe lengthening the circuit slightly. Also, the pit straight is long enough for the pit exit to blend back into the circuit well before turn 1.

The first set of turns would be fun to drive I reckon, and I also like the tight hairpin out the back of the circuit... "the hook"???

Good job.

[bio]

Agreed: this one's way to curvy. F1 tracks of similar length typically have 15-20 turns. 25 is too much. I don't see a place there where the vehicle could get decent velocity. Cars would eat their tires very soon, while bikers would get calf and thigh crumps in a coupe of laps because they would never sit on the seat except for the S/F stratight.

Judged from the overall lenth, the S/F straight might be about 3-400 meters long and is preceeded by a very slow turn - no time to gain speed for any decent overtaking action at T1 - and there's even less overtaking chance elswhere.

I'd definitely cut some of the turns and loosen up others.

bio

[bio]

Originally Posted by ECW Dan Selby

. You'd need that to be about Spa length (7ish km), maybe more, in order for it to come out (i'm guessing...) as you'd imagine.

I'd say even more: well in the 8km-range.

bio

[orangewarning]

Thanks for the feedback and advice. Will look into it. Mainly taking away some turns and making the right side bigger to accomodate more length.
Just a question. How do I put tracks that I made into rfactor so I can test drive them? Or do I have to rebuild them from scratch in btb?

[bio]

Originally Posted by orangewarning

Just a question. How do I put tracks that I made into rfactor so I can test drive them? Or do I have to rebuild them from scratch in btb?

What software did you use to make it?

bio

[ECW Dan Selby]

Originally Posted by orangewarning

Thanks for the feedback and advice. Will look into it. Mainly taking away some turns and making the right side bigger to accomodate more length.
Just a question. How do I put tracks that I made into rfactor so I can test drive them? Or do I have to rebuild them from scratch in btb?

You'd have to do what i'm currently doing - get this picture in to BTB, then 'trace' it, almost. Basically, build the track over the top of your picture, using your picture as a reference.

See here: http://tentenths.com/forum/showthrea...125705&page=17

Selby

[ScotsBrutesFan]

Welcome to My Track Designs first up

I like the concept of your design but as others have said it needs scaled up a bit to make it practical.

When I designer gives the length of the Start finish straight, I start imagining a piece of string the length of that straight on my computer screen, being wound around the rest of the circuit,
You quickly find out that the infield loop is actually longer than the straight that follows, and combined they take up 1km plus your 580m of S/F. Suddenly 4.4-4.7km really doesn't appear that realistic, as the guys say.

I'll also make a comment on the pitlane, firstly it's nicely drawn (what software was used here?), Secondly and this fits to the scale thing as well, make sure you give your pit entry sufficient space for run off before it mirrors the inside of the final corner sequence. For the Pit out, I agree that it looks as though it could have come out on to the straight before T1, however as you have it, joining on the outside of T3 cars are going across from the T3 apex to the T4 apex, right across the front of the pit exiting car. If the pit exit had to be there, I'd have run it around the iside of T4 apex and blended in on the short straight - so off the racing line- before T5.

I hope these comments help, and I'm sure we all look forward to seeing more of your work.

[bio]

Originally Posted by ECW Dan Selby

You'd have to do what i'm currently doing - get this picture in to BTB, then 'trace' it, almost. Basically, build the track over the top of your picture, using your picture as a reference.

See here: http://tentenths.com/forum/showthrea...125705&page=17

Selby

I guess he was asking if he could somehow open his existing file in BTB?

bio

[bio]

Originally Posted by ScotsBrutesFan

I hope these comments help, and I'm sure we all look forward to seeing more of your work.

You were really nice - never even mentioned reversing the track direction

bio

[Sodemo]

Tracks need more banked, fast corners. I'd love it for someone to recreate something like Watkins Glen, or the old Osterriechring. Now that was a circuit.

[bio]

Here's a couple of ways I think this one could be edited.

Not all of them at once, of course

The only that IMHO seems unavoidable in some form is the one at the exit of that "stadium" kinda loop at the middle of the bottom section - for runoff and gravel pit reasons.

bio

[ScotsBrutesFan]

Originally Posted by bio

You were really nice - never even mentioned reversing the track direction

bio

I haven't suggested reverse direction in such a long time

[the_calculator]

Although I too agree the track's too twisty / has too many turns for the given length, I don't think we should be measuring up all tracks to F1 standards; Racing is so much more than F1.
For example, as a japanese drifttrack this design would totally qualify.

Originally Posted by bio

Cars would eat their tires very soon, while bikers would get calf and thigh crumps in a coupe of laps because they would never sit on the seat except for the S/F stratight.

For me that would all be pro's for building this track.

This is not a track I would design, but I like what you did!
Keep em coming Orangewarning.

Well done.

[bio]

Originally Posted by ScotsBrutesFan

I haven't suggested reverse direction in such a long time

What's happened?

bio

[werner]

Originally Posted by bio

bikers would get calf and thigh crumps in a coupe of laps because they would never sit on the seat except for the S/F stratight.

bio

They can sit on a seat at home...

However I agree that overtaking would be very difficult for anything other than the slowest cars or bikes. The track really needs a few faster bits, straight or otherwise.

[bio]

Originally Posted by werner

They can sit on a seat at home...

However I agree that overtaking would be very difficult for anything other than the slowest cars or bikes. The track really needs a few faster bits, straight or otherwise.

I remember Luiggi (an avid bike racer himself, as we all remember) talking about this a few years back, why extended stretches on the side of the bike is no good. I take his word on that

bio

[werner]

IIRC that was about being on the same side for a long time. However, in the real world there is the Sachsering, with from turn 4 to 11 about 500 degrees of left turns, so I don't think it is an absolute no-go.

[bio]

Well, I didn't say it was an absolute no-go. But, while we're at the topic of the Sachsenring, the timing is perfect - there was an interview with Gábor Talmácsi, my 125 cc world chamion compatriot, with nearly 20 years of bike racing experience, and he mentioned how enduring the Sachsenring is.

Also, there are 14 turns there, while the track of this thread has about 25... Also, compare the only extended stretch of the Sachsenring where the bikers have to use their body to negotiate turns, to this track - where almost the entire length of the track is like that, except for the S/F straight and that short "straightish" part before the hairpin on the right.

So yeah, not an absolute impossibility - but I don't think many bikers would choose to race on it either

bio

[orangewarning]

Hi! Im going to upload an edited version by today or tommorow..in it the whole infield loop is taken away and overall it will be less curvy, maybe 16-17 turns.

[bio]

Originally Posted by the_calculator

For me that would all be pro's for building this track.

Well, Luigi's among us again - maybe he'll have some input on this.

bio

[LuiggiSpeed]

Originally Posted by bio

Well, Luigi's among us again - maybe he'll have some input on this.

bio

Yeah I had a look and already got armpump by T15

Nah, seriously it looks fun but too complex when compared to a known track. We already came to the conclusion that a good track shall be between 10 and 15 turns with Austin being an exception. Anyways tracks are the expression of the designer and every competitor faces the same challenges, so we can leave that right there, but I see some spots on the track where sections are too close and in the impact area of one another, and that I don't like. If I was the FIA or FIM safety officer to sanction that track, I would for sure have problems with that.

[ScotsBrutesFan]

Picking up on Luiggi's comments, in some ways they go back to my own in terms of scale.

Before I made mention of the imaginary piece of string the length of the pit straight to give a reasonable approximation of length.

But also the width of the circuit as drawn has to come into consideration as well. So if you draw the circuit as a thick line then consider that the line is going to be 10m or realistically 13m or perhaps Tilke-F1 15m wide. so when brining sections of circuit close to each other, use the thickness of the track to consider how close the sections are. There are 2 areas of concern that really jump out, and that' the entry and exit to the infield loop in the first half of the lap and also around the apex of the infield "hook" on the second half of the lap.