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Old 21 Feb 2016, 16:56 (Ref:3616505)   #326
Mike Harte
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Originally Posted by old man View Post
Over dinner recently a very well known team manager, now retired after a long career, commented that in the modern era because of the CVC control Bernie's hands are tied in financial matters. In the past he would quietly assist teams in trouble but cannot now do this. From other comments made by those present I fear many misjudge the man, I do accept he is no saint

The present situation is beset with vested interests that are difficult to overcome IMO
Part true and partly not. BCE has always helped out where he saw a real need, and always did so out of the public gaze - no blowing his trumpet about these type of arrangements, although the recipients or their staff often let the cat out of the bag.

A typical example, and proves that CVC don't over-rule him about these arrangements, is that he paid the entire staff payroll for at least one month for the guys at Lotus, and also made facilities and sustenance available to the Lotus boys and girls at least two GPs last year.

There is a longish list of his helping out when it was required.
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Old 21 Feb 2016, 16:59 (Ref:3616506)   #327
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Thinking about it, IF the Renault engine doesn't make significant progress, and IF Manor improve, and IF Haas hit the ground running, Renault could be struggling to get out of Q1. They seem prepared for a painful year, which is probably good expectation management, but it could be a case of worse before it gets better.
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Old 21 Feb 2016, 18:25 (Ref:3616521)   #328
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Thinking about it, IF the Renault engine doesn't make significant progress, and IF Manor improve, and IF Haas hit the ground running, Renault could be struggling to get out of Q1. They seem prepared for a painful year, which is probably good expectation management, but it could be a case of worse before it gets better.
I am of the same mind. It seems like everyone wants to be improving and fighting mid-field, but the problem is.... Someone will always come in last place.

Next few days might be really telling regarding the teams you mention. Sauber and Force India as well.

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Old 21 Feb 2016, 19:41 (Ref:3616541)   #329
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Sauber might struggle with a driver line-up that is, in my opinion, modest at best. Grosjean could shine at Haas, and Wehrlein could be quick for Manor.
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Old 21 Feb 2016, 20:37 (Ref:3616555)   #330
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Apologies if this has been covered already on this thread but what now happens to th Lotus name/brand? Are Renault at liberty to sell the Lotus branding?
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Old 21 Feb 2016, 20:54 (Ref:3616559)   #331
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Apologies if this has been covered already on this thread but what now happens to th Lotus name/brand? Are Renault at liberty to sell the Lotus branding?
I would imagine that that would be subject to the particulars of sale contract between Genii and Renault. Mind you, Genii were in a vunerable place, so they probably couldn't dictate terms to the white knight that rescued them; all the Lotus debts cleared bar the Genii loans that Genii had to eat.
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Old 21 Feb 2016, 21:07 (Ref:3616563)   #332
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I would imagine that that would be subject to the particulars of sale contract between Genii and Renault. Mind you, Genii were in a vunerable place, so they probably couldn't dictate terms to the white knight that rescued them; all the Lotus debts cleared bar the Genii loans that Genii had to eat.
So presumably the ownership of the Lotus brand could still be in the hands of Genii Capital? or perhaps as you suggest the ownership may have been offered as part of the deal to Renault as a sweetener?
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Old 21 Feb 2016, 21:25 (Ref:3616573)   #333
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So presumably the ownership of the Lotus brand could still be in the hands of Genii Capital? or perhaps as you suggest the ownership may have been offered as part of the deal to Renault as a sweetener?
Well, it might well have been the most prized asset that the racing team had. After all, they had had to go to court to fight over it's ownership, so it must have some true monetary value. But, as far as I am aware, no statements have been made about it's current ownership.
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Old 22 Feb 2016, 02:44 (Ref:3616636)   #334
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They never owned it as it was a sponsorship and licensing agreement with the Lotus road car company I thought?
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Old 22 Feb 2016, 10:41 (Ref:3616689)   #335
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They never owned it as it was a sponsorship and licensing agreement with the Lotus road car company I thought?
Yep, I believe the Lotus name is ultimately owned by Proton via DRIB-HICON and was a licence arrangement. Not be confused with the Team Lotus name which was bought by Fernandes from David Hunt.

All in all it brings to an end what has been a somewhat messy period for the Lotus name in F1 and I can't help but think Lotus Cars will be all the better for it now.
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Old 22 Feb 2016, 17:16 (Ref:3616782)   #336
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Yep, I believe the Lotus name is ultimately owned by Proton via DRIB-HICON and was a licence arrangement. Not be confused with the Team Lotus name which was bought by Fernandes from David Hunt.

All in all it brings to an end what has been a somewhat messy period for the Lotus name in F1 and I can't help but think Lotus Cars will be all the better for it now.
Group Lotus plc, is divided into Lotus Cars and Lotus Engineering and is owned by DRB-HICOM, through its subsidiary Proton Holdings Berhad. As you say, the Team Lotus name was bought by Fernandes, allowing Lotus Renault GP team to be renamed as "Lotus F1 Team", after its branding partner Group Lotus plc.
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