[WEC] 2014 FIA World Endurance Championship

[joeb]

Level5 possibly?

[Beetle]

Originally Posted by joeb

Level5 possibly?

It says "from outside endurance racing"...

[jasonjessica09]

While P1 grid numbers are going up and P2 looks to be the same, I am starting to get worried about GTE, particularly the AMs. We had 14 full season cars in WEC in 2013. For 2014, perhaps no more than 12. And for Le Mans itself I expect a larger LMP grid this time with fewer GT cars.

Speculation:
Pro:
2 Aston Martin
2 Porsche 991
3 Ferrari 458 (AF Corse, Ram)

Am:
2 Ferrari 458 (AF Corse, Ram)
1 Porsche 991 (Proton)
2 Aston Martin

Need to bring in the GT3's soon folks. Too many good GT cars and teams being left out of WEC/Le Mans now.

[Simmi]

I'm not losing sleep over GTE. It's very difficult to see big increases in a class which will have new regs in the next few years.

Having the big three re-up was great news. You didn't mention Larbre on that list, or Imsa, plus the above speculation of a new GT team coming in.

At Le Mans the numbers always swell, but for the WEC if it simply stays the same as '13 then that's a good result.

[Starfish Primer]

It doesn't surprise me considering the GTE price tags. Pro survives with the factory support but Am needs a rethink in my opinion.

[Speed-King]

Originally Posted by Starfish Primer

It doesn't surprise me considering the GTE price tags. Pro survives with the factory support but Am needs a rethink in my opinion.

Go back to one GTE-class, I say. With the tech freezes applying to both classes, even the argument of Am having slightly different cars, isn't valid anymore.

[chernaudi]

And there's an interesting point in the GTE vs GT3 debate, a couple, actually, and both can be effected by the proposed merger of the classes at the ACO/FIA WEC level.

One is cost: GT3 cars aren't that much slower in terms of laptime now than GTE cars at about any track. Yet, GT3 cars are, relatively speaking, significantly cheaper.

The big one for me is an issue that the TUSCC Roar test this weekend may bring up; GT3 cars are designed to race against each other pretty much. GTE cars are BOP'd, especially in terms of top speed, because of having to race against other classes.

That all will be interesting to see how those factors will work out, if the specs even get merged.

[Beetle]

Originally Posted by jasonjessica09

While P1 grid numbers are going up and P2 looks to be the same, I am starting to get worried about GTE, particularly the AMs. We had 14 full season cars in WEC in 2013. For 2014, perhaps no more than 12. And for Le Mans itself I expect a larger LMP grid this time with fewer GT cars.

Speculation:
Pro:
2 Aston Martin
2 Porsche 991
3 Ferrari 458 (AF Corse, Ram)

Am:
2 Ferrari 458 (AF Corse, Ram)
1 Porsche 991 (Proton)
2 Aston Martin

Need to bring in the GT3's soon folks. Too many good GT cars and teams being left out of WEC/Le Mans now.

I think the ACO is wasting time that could be put towards quality GT racing in the FIA WEC by just sitting around, waiting for 2016 to come. Very few are going to make an effort to get into a class when the regs are unclear for future years. GT3 cars run at the same speed, on average, as GTE cars -- as Chernaudi said above -- so why not, in the meantime, before we hit 2016, make GTE-Pro and GTE-Am open to GT3 cars as well? Essentially, preserve the driver classification standards, but open up all FIA WEC GT racing to both GTE and GT3 spec cars? More teams, more opportunities, more commitment, more fun. Plus, it's easier for teams if they can evaluate their options while they go through 2014 and 2015.

I'm just afraid that in 2015 there will be practically no GTE field at all.

Originally Posted by Simmi

I'm not losing sleep over GTE. It's very difficult to see big increases in a class which will have new regs in the next few years.

Having the big three re-up was great news. You didn't mention Larbre on that list, or Imsa, plus the above speculation of a new GT team coming in.

At Le Mans the numbers always swell, but for the WEC if it simply stays the same as '13 then that's a good result.

Larbre is not for certain... IMSA Performance Matmut is rumored not to come back as they'll be focusing primarily on ELMS next year. At least that's what the journalists say -- I can still see them putting forward one or two cars for Le Mans but not much else, unfortunately.

To me, if Larbre doesn't get the opportunity to run a C7.R than they won't run the FIA WEC at all. Here's hoping we'll see them, but there is no love loss between the ACO and Jack Leconte at the moment.

Although, being an inherent optimist, I'd speculate this:

GTE-Pro
2x Aston Martin Racing
2x AF Corse
2x Porsche AG Team Manthey
1x RAM Racing

GTE-Am
2x Aston Martin Racing
2x AF Corse
1x Proton Competition
1x RAM Racing
1x Larbre Competition
1x Prospeed Competition

Something to note here, from Graham Goodwin (@dsceditor) on Twitter:

Looks like #FIAWEC may be set to add a successful team from another branch of motorsport - Waiting for call back from them #GTE

Then...

Ah, sorry, my mistake - looks like we'll have TWO teams that are set to announce #FIAWEC programmes very soon

[Maelochs]

"I think the ACO is wasting time that could be put towards quality GT racing in the FIA WEC by just sitting around, waiting for 2016 to come."

As I understand it, factory participation is one reason for the current GTE-GT3 divide.

Factories are invested in GTE chassis and motors, and were willing to make that investment because they were assured that FIA would keep the field balanced through the rules; i.e. no one make would get any unfair breaks.

Also, since the chassis and motors were expensive to develop, factory teams would have an edge over privateers. This made GTE a sound investment for a manufacturer seeking PR from its racing campaign.

When GT3 became popular most factories had already built GTE cars. GT3 cars were seen as a great way to sell customer cars, but not a great place for factory teams becuase with BoP, a privateer in a Camaro, for instance, might take down the factory teams in their Ferraris and Porsches.

Also, cars from manufacturers like Mercedes or Lamborghini could compete with, and beat, cars built by factories with GTE programs; a GT3 Gallardo that cost half what a GTE Porsche cost might beat a GT3 Porsche.

Factories wanted a rules-bound (as opposed to BoP-balanced) top class where others had to pay a lot to play, to protect their ongoing investments in GTE. In GT3, a latecomer like McLaren could produce a (relatively) low-cost GT3 chassis and beat Ferrari and Porsche, but in GTE, Ferrari and Porsche could maintain primacy because Mclaren (or Lambo or Merc) didn't want to fund a GTE version.

Immediately going all-GT3 would mean that all that GTE money would be wasted; now factories are getting a last couple years to amortize their GTE chassis investments.

Another reason might be because factories cannot dominate in GT3 by building a better car. BoP can make a Camaro equivalent to a Gallardo. GTE set sort of a minimum standard, where a factory had to make a serious investment to build a serious performance car as a base model; no amount of waivers could make a Camaro keep up with a 458.

This ensured that factory (or de facto factory) Porsches would likely only get beat by factory Astons or Ferraris, not by privateer Camaros or whatever, so there would be no prestige lost in losing, nor undue PR advantage gained by a factory making a half-hearted effort.

So, basically, politics.

[Speed-King]

Another reason might be because factories cannot dominate in GT3 by building a better car. BoP can make a Camaro equivalent to a Gallardo. GTE set sort of a minimum standard, where a factory had to make a serious investment to build a serious performance car as a base model; no amount of waivers could make a Camaro keep up with a 458.

... and then the Z4 happened.

[TheNo1F1Fan]

Originally Posted by Speed-King

... and then the Z4 happened.

Hmm...

[Flo aus N]

how many Waivers did the Corvette C6R get ? 65 ?

[TheNo1F1Fan]

Originally Posted by Flo aus N

how many Waivers did the Corvette C6R get ? 65 ?

What's a Waiver?

[Victor_RO]

Originally Posted by TheNo1F1Fan

What's a Waiver?

ACO-issued allowance for a car's homologation/specification to disregard certain aspects of the technical regulations. One waiver has to be issued for every article/sub-article of the rules that is circumvented.

[Japanese Samurai]

Motorsport channel (Japanese motorsport news website) rumours that a Japanese team (and Japanese driver) might participate in WEC.

Team Gainer?

[Starfish Primer]

Are there any confirmed entries with Lotus LMP2?

[FstrthnU]

I don't know where exactly to post this, so I'll put it here

I decided to finally start a LM GTE/FIA GT2 category page on Wikipedia. However, I'm not too familiar with the evolution of the class from the 1990s to today. Is anyone around here more familiar with that history that could help with the page?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LM_GTE

[TheNo1F1Fan]

Originally Posted by Japanese Samurai

Motorsport channel (Japanese motorsport news website) rumours that a Japanese team (and Japanese driver) might participate in WEC.

Team Gainer?

Might be Team Gainer.

[Pandemonium]

No news about lotus but I hope they stay with two lmp2's

[rich07]

Originally Posted by Japanese Samurai

Motorsport channel (Japanese motorsport news website) rumours that a Japanese team (and Japanese driver) might participate in WEC.

Team Gainer?

Toyota?

Seriously-here's another vote for Gainer. GT-AM Ferrari 458??

[kurski]

Allan McNish said if the FIA WEC to expand the calendar, how many team can afford to participate in thereto ?

[TF110]

Originally Posted by rich07

Toyota?

Seriously-here's another vote for Gainer. GT-AM Ferrari 458??

Doubt Toyota will make a GTE car with new regs coming. I could see the rumored sportscar shared with bmw in the future as both of the company's racers in a couple years.

[cmk]

Originally Posted by rich07

Toyota?

Seriously-here's another vote for Gainer. GT-AM Ferrari 458??

I think Gainer with a P2. The exploration with Greaves (both running as Gainer once and sending Bjorn Wirdheim scouting) was supposed to be in aid of evaluating such a program. Not necessarily with a Zytek, but if Greaves is out of WEC it would be nice if someone ran one!

[Beetle]

My vote goes to Gainer as well... they debuted successfully at Fuji, showed some solid speed, and with Greaves dropping out of the FIA WEC full time, perhaps this is their tie-in with world LMP2 racing? Greaves ran under the Gainer moniker while at Fuji, so I'd expect there would be some sort of connection if Gainer chose to run the FIA WEC full season next year.

Most likely, it wouldn't be in GTE, but in LMP2... unless we get a Mercedes-Benz SLS AMG homologated to GTE spec.

[TheNo1F1Fan]

Originally Posted by Beetle

My vote goes to Gainer as well... they debuted successfully at Fuji, showed some solid speed, and with Greaves dropping out of the FIA WEC full time, perhaps this is their tie-in with world LMP2 racing? Greaves ran under the Gainer moniker while at Fuji, so I'd expect there would be some sort of connection if Gainer chose to run the FIA WEC full season next year.

Most likely, it wouldn't be in GTE, but in LMP2... unless we get a Mercedes-Benz SLS AMG homologated to GTE spec.

1. If LMP2, they might use the same car, wouldn't they?
2. If GTE, what car should they use...?