Vettel To The Metal. Vettel/Webber/Hamilton incident.

[Hazard]

Originally Posted by dazbaz_99

Having viewed this 'video evidence' it would be a disgrace if Lewis is given anything more than a verbal warning, are the FIA forgetting he is a rookie?! Fernando's required 'miracle' may yet happen though I fear.

Of course, there is the rookie leeway rule, how could we forget that?

If he was doing stupid things, he should be punished so he does do stupid things again. I think it's a marginal call, but wouldn't expect the penalty to be anything other than a 10 place drop if called. A Japan disqualification is way over the top.

I'm sure Red Bull would like that, as it moves RBR closer to Williams - but I doubt it's their motive - an obvious goal for STR is clearly to get 2 points out of the last two races, and if they're really lucky - 3 and beat Honda! Vettel starting from last isn't going to help that cause.

[staid davenport]

Have a read of today's FIA press conference.

Vettel admits that when the accident happened he wasn't watching Webber's car, he was watching Hamilton's.

I can only repeat what I said after the race: just exiting turn 13, all of a sudden I saw... as a human being you react to movement, I would say, and all of a sudden I saw Lewis pulling far to the right and slowing down a lot.

I was wondering what happened to him, I already thought he's retiring, there's no more power. That's what it looked like for me because he was going so slowly, and yeah, by the time I looked back in front of me I was already in Mark's rear, so for sure, I apologise again. Obviously I did not plan to destroy both of our races in the end.

How can that be Hamilton's fault?

Even if Hamilton was in trouble, Webber still slowed down not to run into the Saftey car, and Vettel still collided with him because he wasn't paying attention to what was going on.

[brands]

There isn't a driver on the grid that doesn't break the 5 car length rule (that rule isn't just for the leader but all drivers) so to punish one driver is stupid.

At the end of the day 20 drivers did 25 laps each behind the safety car in Japan, some 1400 miles worth of braking, accelerating and weaving and only one driver fell asleep.

[Fiorentina 1]

Look at the video and judge for yourself!

http://mediacenter.corriere.it/Media...8-0003ba99c53b

What was hamilton doing? Like Vettel said, it looked like he broke down. He was playing games all race long behind the safety car, this was bound to happen, he's just lucky Alonso or Weber didn't run into him....

[gsmith2424]

and FOM has made youTube pull the video of the incident that a fan took.

[Adam43]

Originally Posted by my PM to the F1 mods

Dear mods

Please can we have a new poll in the F1 forum? I would like people's opinions on what penalty Lewis will get for causing Vettel to crash into Webber. the options would be:
1) Nothing, he'll be reprimanded, but basically let off.
2) A $20,000 fine
3) A five place grid penalty
4) He'll be removed from Q3
5) McLaren will lose 10 constructors points (that'll be -10 then!).
6) A $100 million dollar fine
7) Exclusion from the 2006 GP2 season and the 2008 F1 season.

Thanks
Adam

This was rejected. Jobsworths.

[FFmygale]

Interesting, but in National motorsport at least, there is a time limit to file an appeal.....does this not apply to F1?

[Adam43]

Originally Posted by FFmygale

Interesting, but in National motorsport at least, there is a time limit to file an appeal.....does this not apply to F1?

Well what is actually happening. The Stewards are "investigating" according to Autosport, that doesn't mean that this is an official appeal of results.

[Knowlesy]

Poll option 7!

I fear the decision will include picking one of those out of a hat.

[Baroche]

Originally Posted by Fiorentina 1

Look at the video and judge for yourself!

http://mediacenter.corriere.it/Media...8-0003ba99c53b

What was hamilton doing? Like Vettel said, it looked like he broke down. He was playing games all race long behind the safety car, this was bound to happen, he's just lucky Alonso or Weber didn't run into him....

When you have backmarker "Monkeys" who suddenly find themeselves near the lead of an F1 race, I do not find it unreasonable that Lewis was as nervous with Webber that close to him. Webber as we all know has problems finishing an F1 race - there is a reason for that. As a result, he is the punchline to serveral jokes floating around the paddock, if you understand that, you will understand Hamiltons actions. Naturally, it looks like Vettel is trying to share some of the blame. Why did't he just keep his eyes on Webber and maintain the required distance.

[Down F0rce]

I don't see why Hamilton would be worried about Webber at all - Webber may nogt have finished many races this year, but how many of them were down to him and not his car? Off the top of my head, virtually none.

[NAC]

Poll option 1

How is this Hamiltons fault. He nearlly went up the back of the SC himself and pulled off to the side. This was not one of Hamiltons most erratic moves behind the SC

[Leighton Irwin]

Sodemo: With McLaren's fine and LH's new salary McLaren cannot afford my 'hit' fee.
The nonsense behind the safety car occurs in every series and happens when rolling starts are used in CC and IRL. It gets pushed more and more by the drivers until something happens, like this incident, or the officials jump on it at the drivers' meeting. You can be sure Charlie will telling them to knock it off. Naturally the drivers and teams will reply "we have to brake hard to stop the pads from glazing etc." Things will settle down for a while but soon the drivers will be back to seeing how much they can get away with. All of them!
The rules as written are really not possible to obey as far a distances are concerned and everybody knows this. Heck, every driver wants to get an edge and don't think that Mark wasn't trying to figure out how to get the jump on Lewis and Seb on both of them.

[Adam43]

Yes, this is about being practical, not inforcing the letter of the law. Charlie should, behind closed doors*, tell them how it is.

*no comedy transcripts.

[Chaos81]

The question I have, is since he was doing it during the race, Button I believe complained about him during the race, why is it the stewards, didn't tell him to stop?

Maybe it's just me, but one would think the stewards would notice it, we sure all saw it, and if in fact they didn't "agree" with it, they would tell him to stop.

[Inigo Montoya]

Silliness. Hamilton did nothing wrong. Bring on China please.

[ralf fan]

Originally Posted by Inigo Montoya

Silliness. Hamilton did nothing wrong.

And this is exactly why he will be punished.

[Adam43]

Originally Posted by Chaos81

The question I have, is since he was doing it during the race, Button I believe complained about him during the race, why is it the stewards, didn't tell him to stop?

Maybe it's just me, but one would think the stewards would notice it, we sure all saw it, and if in fact they didn't "agree" with it, they would tell him to stop.

I agree with Martin Brundle's coment that Lewis Hamilton was being "silly" behind the SC and someone should have a word with him. However it wasn't the Vettel incident that provokes that most it was many other incidents that were on the TV at the time. All of which they ignored.

[Super Hans]

As I've said all along, this safety-car gamesmanship has been going on for a few seasons now, and in several categories of racing. It isn't in the spirit of the rules, and needs to be stamped out. A strong warning in the next driver's briefing should sort it out, along with a clarification of the rules. It'd be unfair in a sense to punish Lewis individually, as I've no doubt that had any of the other top-line drivers would've behaved similarly in his position.

[Graz]

Originally Posted by REALIST

Where does one buy these Hamilton tinted glasses, then?

Firstly, he was meant NOT to go alongside the safety car.

No, he isn't entitled to accelerate and brake with total disregard for the safety car and other race cars.

While the safety car had its lights on, there was no need to "accelarate (sic)and brake as he sees fit to keep his brakes warm"

It looked to me, through 'Raikonnen tinted glasses' that Hamilton was deliberately trying to trap the followers into passing him, in order to get them penalised.

:-)

I'm not actually a Hamilton fan, I just think too much is being made of this as is usual in F1 these days. If the drivers behind (rightly or wrongly) believed Hamilton was driving erratically behind the safety car, they should have made allowance and not driven so close. The race officials had enough time to examine Hamiltons driving with the amount of laps run under caution and didn't do anything at the time. I suppose Webbo is not used to being so far up the field that he didn't know what to do...

And yes, sorry for the poor spelling. I'll try harder next time. You still knew what I meant though!

[Chiefy]

Originally Posted by Baroche

When you have backmarker "Monkeys" who suddenly find themeselves near the lead of an F1 race, I do not find it unreasonable that Lewis was as nervous with Webber that close to him.

I think you're a bit off the racing line there, Baroche. I said before that I thought everyone should just apologise for the incident and take a third of the blame. But the arguments rage on. I also said that I thought Lewis' driving behind the SC was a bit inappropriate/dangerous/whatever - and that's the opinion growing more and more inside me. Too much acceleration near the SC - and I believe anyone who says it looks like he was slowing to retire, because he went bloody slow and he was well out of the way (if he hadn't been driving so fast this could have been avoided). It took Webber a fair old while to catch up to Lewis and the SC, so it's unsurprising that in poor visibility he hadn't seen Lewis diving out of the way of the SC. Vettel, like I said before, played his part - but I just don't think you can condone Lewis being right alongside the SC. What in blazes was he doing there?

I think a grid penalty for Hamilton would be justified. His erratic displays could have caused an accident with Alonso earlier and then certainly contributed to one later on. Had he not moved over and confused Webber, he'd have hit the SC anyway... But he's inexperienced, too - so we can hate him no more than we hate Vettel (even though I don't hate Vettel). Two grid penalties, one for each man, or no grid penalties at all. I'm sure Fernando wouldn't object to the former.

[Ralf's Girl]

Originally Posted by Chaos81

The question I have, is since he was doing it during the race, Button I believe complained about him during the race, why is it the stewards, didn't tell him to stop?

Maybe it's just me, but one would think the stewards would notice it, we sure all saw it, and if in fact they didn't "agree" with it, they would tell him to stop.

This is why I think it would be difficult to punish him now - that's an admission that the stewards weren't really doing their job at the time, because if he'd been warned about it the first time, the whole issue of the collision between Webber and Vettel and whose fault it was could have been avoided.

[pottiella]

well I'm not going to make comment anymore about it, as clearly any legitimate criticism of how Lewis drove on Sunday is seen as "having a problem with him" (I don't think Martin Brundle has a problem with Lewis, yet even he had a problem with how Lewis was driving!)

All I wanted to say was, did you guys read the press conference with Vettel, Webber, Kubica, Kimi and Fernando?! lol I loved it! It was the best driver press conf I've read in years...pure quality! I quickly opened it up at work today to skim-read it, but it totally cracked me up, and was so hard not to laugh out loud in the middle of work!!

The best bits cannot be repeated on this forum for expletive reasons even kimi's "whatever you call it.." comment about the FIA and Alonso's "diplomacy" were just pure classic! fabulous stuff from the drivers...

[Leighton Irwin]

Does anyone know if the race stewards this weekend are the same as in Japan? If they are not all the same does this not raise more questions as they might not have even seen the conditions first hand.
I know Charlie travels to each race but there used to be different stewards at each race.

[Adam43]

Warning, what follows is a rant and does not necessarily represent the opinions of Ten-Tenths. (To be honest, it probably doesn't even represent the opinions of the poster when they aren't ranting.) Originally Posted by pottiella ... any legitimate criticism of how Lewis drove on Sunday is seen as "having a problem with him" ... and equally defending him is nationalistic bias, or blinkers, or whatever. *yawn* It is all extremely tiresome and why people can't see that their posting is like Newton's third law? Every Hamilton* post has an equal and opposite Hamilton post. *please substitute another in F1 for the same effect. We now return you to our normal ramblings.