Silverstone Classic 2009 - Comments/Suggestions

[Ken Prichard Jones]

There will be a bigger and better Silverstone Classic in 2010. The gossip is put about by talkers rather than doers. We put on a very successful event this year and have learned a lot for next and subsequent years. Any suggestions for improvement will be welcome.

[John Turner]

Ok, apologies to James Wiseman, as he is no longer thread starter! I really don't have time to do loads of editing so have moved a great many posts 'en masse'. Seems appropriate that it is now Ken's thread, so keep the constructive comments/ideas coming for him!

[Al Weyman]

Do you have a date for next year as it was a shame the CTCRC Autoglym Historic Festival was on the same day as I would have like to have attended both, maybe we could work together on dates to ensure no clash for the mutual benifit of all of us.

[brands]

Originally Posted by Al Weyman

Do you have a date for next year as it was a shame the CTCRC Autoglym Historic Festival was on the same day as I would have like to have attended both, maybe we could work together on dates to ensure no clash for the mutual benifit of all of us.

from the official website........The provisional 2010 dates for the Silverstone Classic are 23, 24 and 25 July 2010.

[Peter Mallett]

Hmm,

Ignoring discussions about the cost, or indeed who is the organiser I think it would be better concentrate on content and attractions, because after that it costs what it costs, so to speak.

I wasn't there but I must say the 90s STs and the Minis (or at least an all mini race) just doesn't seem to fit into an historic festival. And indeed I doubt if it/they attracted any new enthusiasts. However a 70's/80's Touring Car race does and if it were planned well in advance would probably garner a better, more cohesive entry than that which appeared this year.

As to single seaters it would be nice to see F3 screamers on the bill.

Side attractions such as the old Scarf and Goggles were always well received, together with air displays which provide a diversion from two dimensional entertainment.

The idea of club assemblies is also good because there are many who like their old cars in road as well as track form.

Once upon a time, the Norwich Union Classic run used to terminate at Silverstone, does this still run? It's another way to get people into the event.

[Tim the Grey]

The NU Classic certainly ran last year, I think I missed it this.

Ah, I didn't, and of course, it's now the AVIVA Classic. I forgot the adverts with Bruce, and Ringo...

http://www.msaclassic.co.uk/

Yes, THAT would combine nicely, I reckon!

Where to put them all is a challenge, though...

[SZRacer]

Well, I think that the runway area could be a lot better planned.

With apologies to the FOC, I| think that rows and rows of red 355s and 328s are not the best use of such a prime area (but then I used to think that the Porsche OC's displays were equally boring - I can understand that car club memebers are proud of their cars, but rows and rows of fairly modern identical cars bore the pants off me. Would be great to see more of the themed car displays in this area. Le Mans? Targa Florio? British GP winners?

James

Originally Posted by Tim the Grey

Where to put them all is a challenge, though...

[Tim the Grey]

The Avante Classic Run has around a thousand cars in it... I don't remember much more than a hundred Ferraris.

[dirty boy]

Originally Posted by SZRacer

Well, I think that the runway area could be a lot better planned.

With apologies to the FOC, I| think that rows and rows of red 355s and 328s are not the best use of such a prime area (but then I used to think that the Porsche OC's displays were equally boring - I can understand that car club memebers are proud of their cars, but rows and rows of fairly modern identical cars bore the pants off me. Would be great to see more of the themed car displays in this area. Le Mans? Targa Florio? British GP winners?

James

Nice idea, a row of 'Greats' would be a nice touch, or rather than rows of Fezzas, mix it up with supercars F40, McLaren F1, CGTs, Zonda, XJ220 etc? Might be easier than getting some rare racers?

Another thought, runway rides? I suspect a few owners would be happy to take punters up the runway for a couple of £ a pop? This way the public could get to see and hear a good variety of 'invited' cars actually running.

I suppose the difficulty there is having moving cars around the public to get them on site.

Just a thought anyway, as at a classic festival the other week, I had the pleasure of watching everything from a gordon keeble to a full on rally spec short wheel base quattro blast up a country house driveway, was a really nice treat.

[KA]

Originally Posted by Peter Mallett

Hmm,

Ignoring discussions about the cost, or indeed who is the organiser I think it would be better concentrate on content and attractions, because after that it costs what it costs, so to speak.

I wasn't there but I must say the 90s STs and the Minis (or at least an all mini race) just doesn't seem to fit into an historic festival. And indeed I doubt if it/they attracted any new enthusiasts. However a 70's/80's Touring Car race does and if it were planned well in advance would probably garner a better, more cohesive entry than that which appeared this year.

The 90's ST race was probably a worthwhile experiment, but maybe their time as a historic racing category hasn't arrived just yet.

On the upside though, looking at the pics John posted on the other thread, it did bring out an interesting and varied selection of cars- I definitely like the idea of a 70's/80's Touring Car race, given the time to pull together a more cohesive and representative entry

[john ruston]

Can't rember the NU event finishing at the Festival ,it was the much smaller Footmans Insurance job.
There are to many cars on new NU event for it to use Festival weekend.

All Mini races are very historic as I remember one at the 1960 BGP.The problem at the festival were the specials.

[Tim the Grey]

It was the lack of Minis. It takes a LOT to fill Silverstone with Minis... Things looked empty.

I agree, cut the 'non-mini's out though.

[Peter Mallett]

Originally Posted by john ruston

Can't rember the NU event finishing at the Festival ,it was the much smaller Footmans Insurance job.
There are to many cars on new NU event for it to use Festival weekend.

I think it did at the beginning.

Originally Posted by john ruston

All Mini races are very historic as I remember one at the 1960 BGP.The problem at the festival were the specials.

Yup a bunch of 850 Minis would have looked good at the 1960 GP especially as that was within a year of the launch and celeb races were good for business. Not so sure it works as a reflection of historic racing though. But as you say the specials possibly made it less relevant. As a contrast perhaps next year they can have a race for Anglias? No, I didn't think that would be a good idea.

[morninggents]

As a contrast perhaps next year they can have a race for Anglias? No, I didn't think that would be a good idea.[/QUOTE]


Au contraire -I think that's the best idea put forward so far. I'm sure Simon D would fulfill his dream of buying an Anglia and our Spanish/Kentish man would postpone his retirement.

[simon drabble]

Originally Posted by morninggents

As a contrast perhaps next year they can have a race for Anglias? No, I didn't think that would be a good idea.

Au contraire -I think that's the best idea put forward so far. I'm sure Simon D would fulfill his dream of buying an Anglia and our Spanish/Kentish man would postpone his retirement.[/QUOTE]

dont tempt me!! I think the problem with the smaller engined "slower" cars is that on a large track like the Silverstone GP circuit they will be boring to watch however mix them up and have a pre 63 saloon race (i.e. Jaguars and Zephers etc at the front with A40's and Anglias and mini's dicing it at the rear with their European counterparts and of ocurse Wilmot Cortina GT's) and you really have something worth watching.... I hope Joe, Ben and Carol are tempted to run this in parallel with their other great Pre 63 GT race....

[Al Weyman]

Thanks Brands I will take that info to the CTCRC committee meeting on Thursday as a clash does no one any good when we are fielding a lot of similar old cars that would appear at the Classic and I think we all need to work together with the ever depleting competitors.

[andy97]

The GT90 series?

[John Turner]

Is that the SRO series, Andy? If the ST race has come in for stick for being too modern, then I suspect that would, too. I also think that we would struggle to get a worthwhile grid.

On the Anglia front, whilst they are great to watch, do you think that we could get 40 odd to the grid? I doubt it.

What about pre spaceframe mod saloons? Question is, how many survive? Could we get a big enough grid?

[andy97]

John, Yes, I am talking about the SRO series. I think it has struggled for numbers and decent dates so far. It's probably a bit chicken and egg, which comes first, a decent grid or decent dates. The cars are out there, though, & as far as I am concerned they are "Classics". I think that there should be room for one more recent series on the bill (perhaps the STs and GT90s could rotate every two years?). I love seeing the older cars, too, but I think its right to encourage the owners of the Super Tourers and the GT cars to keep them in raceable condition, otherwise it will become even more difficult to encourage them out when they are 20 years old or whatever & we may never see them. Owners will need an excuse to invest their time and money in them, and if they know that they will get entries to prestige events like the Silverstone Classic then that might be the encouragement they need.

[John Turner]

Originally Posted by andy97

but I think its right to encourage the owners of the Super Tourers and the GT cars to keep them in raceable condition, otherwise it will become even more difficult to encourage them out when they are 20 years old or whatever & we may never see them. Owners will need an excuse to invest their time and money in them, and if they know that they will get entries to prestige events like the Silverstone Classic then that might be the encouragement they need.

I agree in principle but wonder whether, rather than have them at the Classic, we don't have the seed of an idea for another (yet another, I hear the groans) big historic meeting for post 1980's cars. We already have the 'future classics' series, HSCC looking at 1980's roadsports, CTCRC, Toyo Tyres saloons, GT90s etc, and FF2000s ran into the 80s didn't they, so there you have the makings of another festrival for the later cars. The Classic, like the Goodwood Revival caters for a very big period of history, so already has a massive range of cars to select from. You could then have a bit of cross pollenation, The Classic featuring a race from the new 'Post Classic' festival and vice versa! Sorted! Now for the easy bit, organisers?

[Peter Mallett]

Originally Posted by John Turner

Is that the SRO series, Andy? If the ST race has come in for stick for being too modern, then I suspect that would, too. I also think that we would struggle to get a worthwhile grid.

On the Anglia front, whilst they are great to watch, do you think that we could get 40 odd to the grid? I doubt it.

What about pre spaceframe mod saloons? Question is, how many survive? Could we get a big enough grid?

IMO the main issue with the STs is that in inviting them the organisers missed an entire (and very important, in racing terms) period of touring car racing. This of course was partially remedied due to the lack of STs.

As to one make races, I'm not sure of the relevance simply because (as I alluded to above) they were really a showcase for new models. Where would it stop at the MG Metro? Does anyone remember the escort Mexico races at the GPs? Or indeed the BMW County Championship?

Again pre spaceframe super/mod saloons would also appear to be limited. I think a race really has to be built upon what is running in the clubs just make it a bigger grid, such as the U2TC or the Top Hat events. This would bring in the cars from the CTCRC also.

How about a Group 4/5 race? There are plenty of those cars around. And to see a Lancia or a Moby Dick in anger would be fantastic.

[john ruston]

You have Masters events at Festival and they promote what is the best race of all WSCM.
Carol has Pre 63 and U2TC with Duncan Wiltshire with his three races.Added to HSCC and Mr White thats about enough.F1 needs to be thought through as there are not enough cars and they will not accept F2 as they are to quick.Seems you need Group C and FJ/F3.
You can get away with another Touring car race to bring in BSCC V8's and things
What else is there to show what International racing was all about.No FF or F2000 etc needed or any other Webb inspired bits.
The type of races will have very little effect on attendance and each race needs a full grid at 700 Quid a time and upwards.
The shopping area needs sorting as does the club area .Concerts add value and does it matter if the punters do not bother to go to the racing bit or the old codgers not to the concert.
It has to be a paying concern and more bits the better.Understand the Harley lot made a big contribution and then most failed to show.
Ken ,Edwardians for you and much the same on the racing front will work.Polish up other bits and you are in long term business

[Peter Mallett]

Phew well that's it then, thread closed, Ruston has sorted it nicely. Well done.

[john ruston]

Thank you Mr Mallet and I do have a handle and have never knowingly been wrong unlike others who post on here!
.What are the alternatives apart from buggering about with different categories of racing .That's not going to make much difference to the show.
It's the package that matters .

[John Turner]

Ok, you two, stop making me laugh!

John, whilst I agree that the basic format is right, I think it needs a fresh couple of races each year. It's one of the reasons why I didn't go to the Goodwood Revival last year and may not again this year as fabulous though the cars are, it's all become a bit predictable. I'd love to see an Edwardian race but I don't think that we could get enough of them out, and most would look incredibly slow on the GP circuit (I suppose you could add some aero engined specials to the mix).

As for the overall event; it just needs a bit of tweaking along the lines many of our posters have already discussed. It'll never suit everybody but let's be clear; it was a success this year. In fact I thought it was pretty good last year, and frankly I think we should stop saying that as a business model it'll nevr match Coys because I reckon it's pretty close already.