Holden losing their rising talent to Ford?

Pro Racer · 30 Jul 2007, 12:53 (Ref:1976374)

well with Holden losing it's rising talent to ford in Whincup and Courtney when they were just about to bring in the resaults and have shown themselves since they left, will Holden be looking to protect the and keep the likes of Holdsworth, Price and Perkins (although i doubt we will see Perkins leave daddy's team anytime soon) or will they just follow the trend breed them and when they are about to show them selves let them go?

Momohead · 30 Jul 2007, 13:22 (Ref:1976388)

I think it ultimatly comes down to the best offer on the table at the time.

Biggy G · 30 Jul 2007, 20:34 (Ref:1976678)

How was Courtney about to bring in the results? He hadnt even driven a round by himself yet

barney551 · 30 Jul 2007, 22:02 (Ref:1976738)

I didnt realise that Courtney, Whincup, Holdsworth and others started with Holden...

As has been stated in other threads the drivers come up from many and varied beginings ... but generally Karts.

These guys are professional drivers now and will all take the best opportunities, with the most appropriate $$$, to further their future. I am sure if you look over the years the same could be said for ford drivers being wooed to the red side.

**GTRMagic** · 30 Jul 2007, 23:15 (Ref:1976782)

Its ok, Holden are working on their own youth plan... to bring Rusty back to the fold

SSbaby · 30 Jul 2007, 23:49 (Ref:1976791)

Quote:

Originally Posted by GTRMagic

Its ok, Holden are working on their own youth plan... to bring Rusty back to the fold

I wish he'd stay with Ford as it's the best decision he's ever made to leave Holden.

Obviously Rusty loses direction quite easilty without a 'Marcos' around to develop the racecar.

SSbaby · 30 Jul 2007, 23:55 (Ref:1976793)

In any case, the shift to Ford only arose because Ford were more prepared to take some gloss away from Holden's strong links with motorsport and their performance sedan heritage by signing successful Holden drivers, longterm.

Now that the money has run out at Ford, they won't be so generous or aggressive in luring big named Holden drivers. And vice versa, I'd imagine.

SSbaby · 31 Jul 2007, 00:01 (Ref:1976794)

Quote:

Originally Posted by barney551

I didnt realise that Courtney, Whincup, Holdsworth and others started with Holden...

As has been stated in other threads the drivers come up from many and varied beginings ... but generally Karts.

These guys are professional drivers now and will all take the best opportunities, with the most appropriate $$$, to further their future. I am sure if you look over the years the same could be said for ford drivers being wooed to the red side.

Uuuummmm, don't forget Jason Bright. He started out with the Garry Rogers Valvoline Cummins team... if I'm not mistaken.

Driver TBA · 31 Jul 2007, 00:04 (Ref:1976797)

Since when was Courtney a 'Holden rising talent'? He was a contracted endurance driver for 2 races, he then wanted a fulltime gig for the following season. The best Skaife could offer was a third HRT car using a licence he did'nt have, so what was courtney to do?

I think Holdsworth, Price and Perkins are safe from the Ford Cheque book considering the talent in most of the Ford teams now. Also I'm sure that the 'Ford Cheque Book' is almost empty and in overdraft.

mac · 31 Jul 2007, 00:05 (Ref:1976798)

It's got nothing to do with the manufacturers.

It comes down to which team offers the best deal - irrespective of the brand.

Maybe not in the past, but certainly now the manufacturers are no longer paying driver retainers...

barney551 · 31 Jul 2007, 01:24 (Ref:1976809)

Quote:

Originally Posted by SSbaby

Uuuummmm, don't forget Jason Bright. He started out with the Garry Rogers Valvoline Cummins team... if I'm not mistaken.

UMMMMM .. whats that got to do with it .... all i am saying is that these guys are professional drivers and dont have the loyalty of the past.

The almighty $$$ is what rules the heart and that is where the loyalty starts and ends.

Just because a young guy gets a start in what ever colour doesnt make him a holden or ford man ... just the colour/team that has chosen to give him a start.

James63 · 31 Jul 2007, 01:42 (Ref:1976814)

Well when you look at it....you have 5 options if you want to be in a competitive car, judging by the resutls this year - on the Holden side you have TWR...not many options there...on the ford side however, you have FPR, 888, DJR and SBR. These young guns have looked for a competitive drive, and with no room at TWR the next best option was ford - whincup 888, Davison DJR, Courtney SBR..

Driver TBA · 31 Jul 2007, 02:12 (Ref:1976823)

Quote:

Originally Posted by SSbaby

Uuuummmm, don't forget Jason Bright. He started out with the Garry Rogers Valvoline Cummins team... if I'm not mistaken.

But did Garry offer Jason a fulltime drive for the following year? SBR did and this was before Ford went on a driver spending spree. In 2000 most people still saw Bright as a 'Ford Man', but then signed with HRT, why? They gave him the best chance of winning.

The real questions, is it Ford chasing the drivers? Is it the teams chasing the drivers? or are the drivers looking for a new team?

Would Ford have gone after Ingall if none of their top teams wanted him? From memory Ingall was the one who instigated the talks with SBR.

Whincup probably saw the writing on the wall and jumped to 888 before he could be pushed by Murphy.

MPA · 31 Jul 2007, 03:34 (Ref:1976834)

Quote:

Originally Posted by barney551

The almighty $$$ is what rules the heart and that is where the loyalty starts and ends.

Just because a young guy gets a start in what ever colour doesnt make him a holden or ford man ... just the colour/team that has chosen to give him a start.

So where does this leave the fans? Remember them?

They're the ones that have been sold the ford/holden tribal battle since daddy drove them around in his HQ/XA. Most of them use all their cerebral powers keeping their knuckles off the ground, how will they cope when they realise they have a choice.

Maybe we shoul' all go an' lynch the next redman what pulls on a blue suit......that'll fix it.....

Its too much.

gkmarshall · 31 Jul 2007, 03:47 (Ref:1976836)

Dick Johnson started in a Holden didn't he.

SSbaby · 31 Jul 2007, 04:01 (Ref:1976841)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Driver TBA

The real questions, is it Ford chasing the drivers? Is it the teams chasing the drivers? or are the drivers looking for a new team?

To re-jog your memory... Geoff Polites wooed Lowndes when there was word of a potential conflict b/w Lowndes and HRT/Crennan... the statement was something along the lines of "Lowndes is welcome at Ford".

Of course, Holden could have slotted Lowndes into a Perkins Commodore quite easily however Lowndes was more interested in the better money... which Ford were willing to pay. The move was also seen as a marketing boon for Ford at the time.

Chucky · 31 Jul 2007, 04:04 (Ref:1976843)

And ever since, Holden Motorsport have had a policy of backing established brands rather than untried potential.

Pro Racer · 31 Jul 2007, 04:38 (Ref:1976853)

Quote:

Originally Posted by barney551

I didnt realise that Courtney, Whincup, Holdsworth and others started with Holden...

As has been stated in other threads the drivers come up from many and varied beginings ... but generally Karts.

These guys are professional drivers now and will all take the best opportunities, with the most appropriate $$$, to further their future. I am sure if you look over the years the same could be said for ford drivers being wooed to the red side.

i mean in V8's of coarse they didn't start there racing in a Holden or a Ford, but i mean in Supercars, they come into V8's start to put in decent performances get the fans keeping an eye on them then the next thing you know they are on the other side of the fence.

barney551 · 31 Jul 2007, 05:34 (Ref:1976870)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pro Racer

i mean in V8's of coarse they didn't start there racing in a Holden or a Ford, but i mean in Supercars, they come into V8's start to put in decent performances get the fans keeping an eye on them then the next thing you know they are on the other side of the fence.

Of Course you do.... I guess as supporters we have to decide whether we follow the make or the driver ... in my case, while I will always be ford supporter I follow Canto ... and I am sure that is quite obvious from some of my other posts!!!

Axeman444 · 31 Jul 2007, 07:09 (Ref:1976899)

with ya there Barney!

Brock also drove **GASP** a Ford, and a Bimmer...

its all about money and getting the win

SSbaby · 31 Jul 2007, 07:42 (Ref:1976922)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chucky

And ever since, Holden Motorsport have had a policy of backing established brands rather than untried potential.

You mean like Dumbrell, Perkins, R Kelly etc... oh but they were signed by the team owners ... so they don't count right?

Pro Racer · 31 Jul 2007, 09:05 (Ref:1976995)

Quote:

Originally Posted by barney551

Of Course you do.... I guess as supporters we have to decide whether we follow the make or the driver ... in my case, while I will always be ford supporter I follow Canto ... and I am sure that is quite obvious from some of my other posts!!!

i am a Holden man and mostly like Holden drivers as you can tell in my posts also (Greg Murphy and Lee Holdsworth) but i follow Brighty in a Ford and as you can tell by my posts and my avatar i supported Brocky no matter the car he drove.

MRJUCY · 31 Jul 2007, 14:54 (Ref:1977317)

Quote:

Originally Posted by GTRMagic

Its ok, Holden are working on their own youth plan... to bring Rusty back to the fold

They've already snared those wipper snappers Seto & the Rat so maybe the next promising young Ford rookie they're after is John Bowe.

mac · 31 Jul 2007, 23:53 (Ref:1977736)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Axeman444

Brock also drove **GASP** a Ford, and a Bimmer...

And a VOLVO!!!

As part of their reduction of costs, I understand manufacturers have canned their driver retainers. All a driver earns now is what the team pays him. It is unlikely that you will see a manufacturer-initiated coup like the Lowndes one in the near future...

cavvy · 1 Aug 2007, 00:57 (Ref:1977757)

Quote:

Originally Posted by gkmarshall

Dick Johnson started in a Holden didn't he.

Tom Walkinshaw was a Ford works driver.

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