2012 McLaren AUTOSPORT BRDC Award

[Deemun]

It’s that time of year again. The latest Autosport magazine has published its list of “Possible Nominees” These are:

Jake Cook
Cavan Corcoran
Jake Dennis
Jack Hawksworth
Josh Hill
Jordan King
Matt Mason
Melville McKee
Chris Middlehurst
Seb Morris
Matt Parry
Kieron Vernon
David Wagner
Macauley Walsh
Josh Webster
Dan Wells

Of course these names are only suggestions and may or may not contain all six of the eventual finalists. One wonders why the name of Mitchell Gilbert is not included, as German F3 has certainly been eligible in past seasons, but then as we saw last year this doesn't mean anything as Emil Bernstorf made it to the final six having not been included in the initially published long list.

I know that I am biased, because I have followed his career for a long time, but I am disappointed to see that the name of Scott Malvern is missing from the list above while 5 drivers from the championship that HE is currently leading are all included. But yes of course I do realise that he has already had two bites of the cherry and he is now “just” over the age limit currently being quoted although this appears to be a moveable feast looking at past seasons as Duncan Tappy, Nathan Freke and Nick Tandy were all older than him when they were last selected and Scott is less than a year older than Kieron Vernon who does appear in the above list.

Early days but I think Jake Dennis has to be a very strong candidate for overall honours this year.

[boyndie]

Yep, will be Jake Dennis this year.

[Peter Cammish]

Looks a strong season from Jake but Jack Hawksworth might well be favourite and I guess he like Jake has a program in place for 2013 which is sure fire good news once the action starts, I expect both to make it expect no real suprises so some late season form could get a few of the better funded and connected guys in as well, but Jake and Jack look like standouts for me from what I have seen of the single seaters guys this year.

[kipper]

Originally Posted by Deemun

One wonders why the name of Mitchell Gilbert is not included, as German F3 has certainly been eligible in past seasons

I don't think Mitchell Gilbert is eligible as being an Australian. I presume German F3 is still on the list of eligible championships; however, the only Brits to have raced in it so far have been Tom Blomqvist (who isn't eligible on account of having raced in Euro F3) and Sheban Siddiqi (who is too old).

In terms of the final nominees, I suspect that they will include Jack Harvey and Jack Hawksworth (one of which will probably win the award). I would imagine that the final six will also include Josh Webster and/or Seb Morris and potentially some drivers from Formula Renault NEC. Given that this creates a very Formula Renault dominated list, I would suspect that the final spot would be Matt Parry or Luke Williams/Jake Cook.

[Deemun]

Originally Posted by kipper

I don't think Mitchell Gilbert is eligible as being an Australian. I presume German F3 is still on the list of eligible championships; however, the only Brits to have raced in it so far have been Tom Blomqvist (who isn't eligible on account of having raced in Euro F3) and Sheban Siddiqi (who is too old).

In terms of the final nominees, I suspect that they will include Jack Harvey and Jack Hawksworth (one of which will probably win the award). I would imagine that the final six will also include Josh Webster and/or Seb Morris and potentially some drivers from Formula Renault NEC. Given that this creates a very Formula Renault dominated list, I would suspect that the final spot would be Matt Parry or Luke Williams/Jake Cook.

Thanks Kipper. I actually thought Mitchell had a British Passport but yes you are right if he is not either UK born or the holder of a British passport then he is not eligible.

Jack Harvey was a finalist in 2010 when he was runner up in Euro F-BMW but he has raced for the past 2 seasons in British F3 in the International class so this will exclude him from eligibility.

[kipper]

Originally Posted by Deemun

Jack Harvey was a finalist in 2010 when he was runner up in Euro F-BMW

For reasons best left unexplored, when I wrote Harvey, I actually meant to write Jake Dennis. Oops.

[Deemun]

Originally Posted by kipper

For reasons best left unexplored, when I wrote Harvey, I actually meant to write Jake Dennis. Oops.

I shouldn't worry about it Kipper. I call it having a "senior moment" & I do it all the time!!

[alias99]

Find it hard to believe that within 4 years the level of drivers being considered for the award has changed dramatically.

FF (EcoBoost) and Intersteps drivers have had about 6 - 8 cars at the most each weekend with the field being split from anywhere between 2 - 5s. Hardly a high level of competition and drivers who have no chance at the title are considered!

Seb Morris, Chris Middlehurst etc these guys are good but not good enough for this award (yet! I'm not saying they cant be good enough just not yet).

IMO the following should be nominees:

Denis, King, Hawksworth, Webster

Shame that Scott Malvern cant enter, he would have had a very good chance at the award this year!

[bella]

Originally Posted by alias99

Seb Morris, Chris Middlehurst etc these guys are good but not good enough for this award (yet! I'm not saying they cant be good enough just not yet).

is it not about finding a driving talent worth getting behind rather than finding someone who has been producing the results already?

in that theme, i'd say melville mckee is an interesting prospect from the eurocup. he doesn't seem to have quite got there on consistency yet but he's put in some very tidy drives - his race at the nurburgring in which he gained 30 places on his starting position in tricky weather conditions has been one of the best drives of the year in that series.

[EastonNeston]

For results in his first season in cars, and remember he can only race against people on the track, Jack Aitken, from Fortec is worth consideration.

Also, as 2nd year drivers, on limited resources, both Matt Mason & David Wagner from MGR deserve to be considered.

It is noteworthy, and a great achievement that MGR, a new team, less than 18 months old have had 3 drivers on the list of suggested nominees.

[DiamondJim]

Why can't Scott Malvern enter?

[EastonNeston]

He fails to meet the age criteria. ie he is above the age limit.

As organisers of the competition the BRDC/hay market/McLaren are able to set whatever selection criteria they desire, provided the criteria do not break any UK discrimination legislation.

[Deemun]

Originally Posted by EastonNeston

He fails to meet the age criteria. ie he is above the age limit.

As organisers of the competition the BRDC/hay market/McLaren are able to set whatever selection criteria they desire, provided the criteria do not break any UK discrimination legislation.

That is quite correct Easton but interesting that the age limit has obviously been lowered in recent years. Freke, Tandy & Tappy were all older than Scott Malvern is now. I would have rather seen a rule that states that a driver cannot be selected as a finalist more than twice (I don't think anyone ever has though I may be wrong) rather than see him discriminated against on the basis of his age. Yes he is 23 but wasn't in a position to begin competing until at 20 and his record since then is arguably more impressive than any of the other suggested candidates.

[EastonNeston]

One can only assume that the organisers feel a revised age limit is more appropriate in finding the person they feel has the best chance of proceeding to reach the highest levels of the sport.

The judging panel are experienced people, with extensive knowledge of the in & out of car skills needed to reach the upper levels of the sport. Therefore, and it is the organisers private competition, we have to accept the rules and decisions reached.

[Flavio Galtieri]

Originally Posted by bella

is it not about finding a driving talent worth getting behind rather than finding someone who has been producing the results already?

It is fairly unlikely in my opinion that an underfunded driver would ever win this award, however talented. Whilst £100k is a useful sum it's not likely to get you very far, unless you could double it up and maybe enter Formula Two. The problem is, what next after that even if you managed to raise the money?

The Autosport awards play a vital part in securing the magazine's role as central to the industry. The event gives the publisher, journalists and advertising staff the opportunity to network with contacts from the top teams and suppliers and cements their role as the "leading' publication in the field.

Although the vast majority of the inevitably declining circulation is still bought by "fans" or consumers of motorsport, the advertising hence the major revenue, is increasingly business facing these days, catering to the small, yet important, number of business readers they have. Hence it is a true hybrid in publishing terms. Facing both ways. Probably the only way to survive as without the incredibly successful show at the NEC I doubt the figures would add up.

The winner needs to be a "credible" candidate for progression to F1, therefore many talented drivers may well in effect be excluded by dint of their background.

The criteria for selecting the winner is published, but the results of the tests are not. Autosport magazine proclaims "You pick the Next Star!" which of course you can't!

Is any of this illegal? No, of course not. Is it unethical? No, it's just business. Is it unusual? Not really, most industries have magazine "awards" similar to this, though not often with such a prize.

Are we all daft to take it so seriously every year?

Probably, Yes!

[FFfan]

This morning on Facebook a copy of the 1980 Formula Ford Festival programme has been posted. A displayed page gives names of 15 of the top drivers fancied that year for Festival honours. None of the drivers are in their teens including Ayrton Senna who was already 21. Yet many of them went onto greater things and a third of them made it to F1. These days they would all be considered too old!

Naturally I am biased here as a parent of a driver who is just a few months over the age limit currently set at under 22 for January 2012. But we have run up against this before. At 21 Scott was told he was too old to be considered by Racing Steps Foundation even though strangely knowing his age they eveluated him putting him through written on line tests, a simulator assessment, fitness test and interview.

As an earlier poster points out this is, like it or not, AGE discrimination! Frankly to be considered over the hill in your early 20's is a joke. Damon Hill didn't race a car until he was 23, didnt make to F3 until he was 26, then F1 at 33 and was World Champion at 36 and that is just one example of many that I could point out. I know it wouldn't happen today!

But let's not be churlish here. I realise Scott has already had two bites of the cherry and is privileged and grateful to have done so. It ranks among the best experieneces of his short but successful motor racing career. By all means have a rule that a driver is only eligible to be selected on two occasions, I think that is fair enough; but to be written off because of an arbitary age limit which seems to be decreasing on a sliding scale from earlier years of the competition is a bitter pill!

Good luck to all the 2012 finalists whoever they may be. Looks like they are all going to have first time finalists this year. Enjoy every moment of a great experience which is wonderful.

Dominic Malvern

[kipper]

Originally Posted by Deemun

I don't think anyone ever has though I may be wrong

Guy Smith was nominated three times for the award and failed to win.

[krt917]

Originally Posted by Flavio Galtieri

The winner needs to be a "credible" candidate for progression to F1, therefore many talented drivers may well in effect be excluded by dint of their background.

The criteria for selecting the winner is published, but the results of the tests are not. Autosport magazine proclaims "You pick the Next Star!" which of course you can't!

Is any of this illegal? No, of course not. Is it unethical? No, it's just business. Is it unusual? Not really, most industries have magazine "awards" similar to this, though not often with such a prize.

Are we all daft to take it so seriously every year?

Probably, Yes!

Hi Flavio,

You raise interesting points about Autosport being for fans and the industry, but I shan't comment any further, partly because I don't have all the facts!

What I can say is none of that has an impact on the Award winner. As I have said before, the judges are very much left to get on with it and it all comes down to what the drivers do over those two days.

Now, you may say that the best driver/prospect won't necessarily perform on those days, but I don't see how it could be any fairer. Since we have had access to the F2 cars we can put all six finalists out at the same time. Previous experience aside, it doesn't get much fairer than that!

Over the years I've heard the argument that 'well obviously x will win because he has loads of money and is going somewhere anyway' and also the argument that 'y will win because they lack funding and need the help'.

Neither is correct in my experience. We can all make arguments why some people will/won't make it based on their funding, probably with some accuracy, so the least MABA can do is give an honest appraisal of who does the best job during the tests.

As ever, thanks for your interest,
Kevin Turner
McLaren Autosport BRDC Award judge

[krt917]

Originally Posted by FFfan

Naturally I am biased here as a parent of a driver who is just a few months over the age limit currently set at under 22 for January 2012. But we have run up against this before. At 21 Scott was told he was too old to be considered by Racing Steps Foundation even though strangely knowing his age they eveluated him putting him through written on line tests, a simulator assessment, fitness test and interview.

As an earlier poster points out this is, like it or not, AGE discrimination! Frankly to be considered over the hill in your early 20's is a joke. Damon Hill didn't race a car until he was 23, didnt make to F3 until he was 26, then F1 at 33 and was World Champion at 36 and that is just one example of many that I could point out. I know it wouldn't happen today!

By all means have a rule that a driver is only eligible to be selected on two occasions, I think that is fair enough; but to be written off because of an arbitary age limit which seems to be decreasing on a sliding scale from earlier years of the competition is a bitter pill!

Dominic Malvern

Hi Dominic,

Long time no see!

I have some sympathy with the age issue, but it was changed (I believe ahead of last year, but I'd have to check) to reflect the way the sport has gone. Totally agree that there is an obsession with ever-younger drivers at the moment, but if F1 thinks someone is too old by a certain age then it seems pointless for us to be assessing them for the Award.

As you say, at least Scott has had a couple of shots at it and I am pleased to hear he found the experiences positive.

All the best to Scott for the rest of the year and I hope he can find something for 2013,

Kevin

[bella]

thanks for posting, kevin. it's good to hear from the other side of the fence, particularly since this seems to raise the same old points every year.

i wonder whether it'd be "fairer" to judge this sort of thing on number of races competed in rather than age. you get some guys who have been on circuits since they were 15 or 16, and by the time they're 21 have more racing experience than two drivers in the same series combined.

letting the fact that f1 is obsessed with young drivers with prodigous talent direct the award is understandable but imo a bit short sighted. surely by definition those young guys will have been picked up and already contracted to a f1 team within a season of them demonstrating those talents. if you're trying to pick up the borderline guys who deserve and justify an attempt at a good career then surely you have to cast the net a little wider? having said that i don't believe a driver should be able to be a finalist more than twice, say.

obviously there's going to be people disgruntled as a result of the rules no matter which approach is taken though, so you can't really win either way

[FFfan]

Thanks to both Kevin & Bella for taking the trouble to respond & I agree with much of what you both have to say. Only point I will take issue with Kevin on is that I still think it is wrong to have such a low age limit. As Bella rightly says wouldn't it better to cast your net wider?

Sure in the current market place Scott is too old for F1; but then there are lots of other reasons why he won't make it to F1 regardless of age, the main one being the vast amount of money it takes to get you there & in that respect £100k is not going to go very far!!!

On the other hand £100k would go a long way to buying someone like Scott a seat in the "Road To Indy" programme, where age is not seen as such an important issue, and if they are successful can make it all the way to Indycar and that is not such a bad place to be; just ask Dario?

That said I wouldn't be against a two goes and you are out rule. With there being such a high number of possible candidates this year I could see some people being upset if Scott were given a third opportunity. But if this had been a couple of years ago he'd have still been eligible and as Kipper points out Guy Smith was a finalist three times.

[bella]

maybe it's wrong to assume at the competition level that a young driver should be aiming for f1 and f1 alone. single seater racing is still one of the best ways to prepare for an endurance racing career, and they certainly don't discriminate on age grounds.

[FFfan]

Originally Posted by bella

maybe it's wrong to assume at the competition level that a young driver should be aiming for f1 and f1 alone. single seater racing is still one of the best ways to prepare for an endurance racing career, and they certainly don't discriminate on age grounds.

Very much agree Bella!

[Flavio Galtieri]

I suppose the year we don't start a thread about this award will be the year Kevin and Autosport get worried!

Seriously though, it's a fun discussion and the awards are a damn good excuse for an end of year beano, nothing wrong with that.

The fact is though, that the lastest British additions to F1 are Max Chilton, straight to F3 at 16 therefore ineligible (not that he needed the money) and Susie Stoddart, a finalist in 2003 but who has still not won a single motor race in more than a decade of trying.

So "prestigious" though it may be, winning this award doesn't seem to have a notable effect on a drivers's F1 career these days, unless perhaps you were to meet your future spouse at the party....

[FFfan]

As you say Flavio it is a fun discussion but then isn't everything on 10/10ths? Surely none of us are vain enough to think that anything we say on here really has any bearing on actual events? Like any chat board I just liken it to a virtual discussion in the pub (Harry Enfield sketch springs to mind!)

In that spirit I am going to (just for fun) have a stab at predicting the six finalists. Of course as the championships the drivers are being evaluated in are all still in progress so things could change in a week or two but right now this minute I will predict:

Jake Dennis, Jack Hawksworth, Jake Cook, Dan Wells, Josh Webster, and either Jordan King or Josh Hill depending on who takes the higher championship position in the FR NEC.

As I said this is just for fun (I certainly wouldn't put money on it) & I may want to change my mind next week!

It's actually quite nice to have a detatched attitude from it all this year and not be going through the stress I was the previous two seasons wondering whether Scott would be fortunate enough to be selected.

DM