US F1, Campos Grand Prix and Manor F1 - The silence is deafening - Page 3

Marbot · 22 Jul 2009, 17:01 (Ref:2506202)

Quote:

Originally Posted by cmk

The test mule idea has been floated before - remember the rumours that Peugeot's 908HY LMP1 testbed was really acting as a mule for Ferrari's KERS system in a deal brokered by Jean Todt?

It was just a rumour,and what would be the point anyway.Factory simulations would be just as good,less costly and more relevant.

jab · 22 Jul 2009, 17:04 (Ref:2506204)

Quote:

Originally Posted by cmk

I take it that in this parlance, 'good' means 'cripplingly foolish'?

Well they need someone with experience. Plus he's well-known in North America. He doesn't necessarily have to be any good as Campos have shown by going after de la Rosa, and he's not going to be any worse than him...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marbot

I wonder who their number one driver will be ?

...umm...Graham Rahal?...

Elsewhere, is this Manor's car for next year?

Marbot · 22 Jul 2009, 17:19 (Ref:2506217)

Quote:

Originally Posted by jab

Elsewhere, is this Manor's car for next year?

If it is,they're doing well !

Never thought that I'd see the 'White Rose' on an F1 car.

kartracer41 · 22 Jul 2009, 17:37 (Ref:2506225)

Quote:

Originally Posted by cmk

The test mule idea has been floated before - remember the rumours that Peugeot's 908HY LMP1 testbed was really acting as a mule for Ferrari's KERS system in a deal brokered by Jean Todt? I think the powers that be are not foolish enough to let obvious mules slide - F1 teams are pretty high-profile organizations and would have a hard time hiding, too!

I take it that in this parlance, 'good' means 'cripplingly foolish'?

I could see them easily fitting engines, transmissions, suspensions, brakes, etc. onto a completely different platform, whether it be a full bodied car, an A1GP car, etc. I would imagine drivers could get good experience with the feel for the many systems in a situation like that. I know the car would have much different weight and aerodynamic characteristics, but the driver could gain much knowledge and feel for the steering, throttle, brake, and handling traits.

On the other end, fit some aero devices to a lesser formula car (A1GP, FRenault F BMW etc.) with specific sensors to see how they react on the road, beyond what simulations or wind tunnel are able to achieve. I know it's not a perfect situation, but with the smarts they have, they should be able to measure the benefits of changes quite easily.

Marbot · 22 Jul 2009, 17:44 (Ref:2506231)

Sounds expensive,particularly when simulators are available (which are said to be extremely realistic) and are probably less costly.

kartracer41 · 22 Jul 2009, 17:51 (Ref:2506235)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marbot

Sounds expensive,particularly when simulators are available (which are said to be extremely realistic) and are probably less costly.

I agree on the expense. But aren't many teams wanting to spend much more than many think they should?

If the simulators are that realistic, why are the teams testing to the limits when they can?

Marbot · 22 Jul 2009, 17:54 (Ref:2506237)

Quote:

Originally Posted by kartracer41

If the simulators are that realistic, why are the teams testing to the limits when they can?

Because nothing beats testing new parts on your new F1 car on a real track.

Jacques Rabbit · 22 Jul 2009, 18:13 (Ref:2506243)

The JV rumors appear to be false: http://www.auto123.com/en/racing-new...ampaign=social

Then again, Team US F1's financial position seems to be pretty false. It'll be amateur hour if they go with an all-Yank squad (there's some talent in the lower series like Josef Newgarden and Alex Rossi, but no one is even close to qualified. When Summerton's your greatest hope, you know you're in a bad position. Oh well, they put themselves in that position by being a bit xenophobic, I suppose).

jab · 22 Jul 2009, 18:37 (Ref:2506253)

I'd not rule JV completely out of the equation yet just because he has denied the rumours. Alonso and Ferrari have both categorically denied their impending partnership and people are keen to not believe them. But we shall see

Gingers4Justice · 22 Jul 2009, 19:37 (Ref:2506278)

Watching JV race in F1 will cause my physical pain. He will be awful, if it happens. I honestly think Danica Patrick could do a better job.

jab · 22 Jul 2009, 19:45 (Ref:2506281)

Why would he be awful? I don't see why he would be. I know he's done a few NASCAR races and whatnot, but I don't think that would suddenly turn him from a competant driver that was matching Heidfeld in 2006 to a complete idiot 4 years later, especially as these cars will be a lot closer to the ones he drove when he was successful in F1. Alan Jones had a similar comeback in 1986 5 years after "retiring" and wasn't that bad

JV has been in this situation before - joining a new upstart team that's taking a slightly different approach to things. I don't think he'll set the world on fire but his knowledge and experience will be invaluable to a team like US F1. And he always has a good race or 2 during a season - he's the sort of guy who could sneak a point or 2 in a crazy race for a little team. The new teams need guys like him, de la Rosa, Barrichello and Heidfeld more than the youngsters

ECW Dan Selby · 22 Jul 2009, 19:46 (Ref:2506282)

I don't understand this anti-JV stance. He was putting in some good drives before he was kicked out of BMW.

Selby

kartracer41 · 22 Jul 2009, 19:47 (Ref:2506283)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gingers4Justice

Watching JV race in F1 will cause my physical pain. He will be awful, if it happens. I honestly think Danica Patrick could do a better job.

Man, you'd think he was never World Champ, let alone ever been in an F1 car the way some people talk.

**Born Racer** · 22 Jul 2009, 22:20 (Ref:2506347)

Villeneuve was/possibly is still a good driver.

He did say the odd odd thing though, like when he was trying to provide a boxing-like build-up to Button's first season at BAR, making reference to the championship leader being better off in a boy band or something than in F1. Button then beat him.

Quote:

Oh well, they put themselves in that position by being a bit xenophobic, I suppose).

I'm not overly keen on the national team approach in F1, but it's extreme to call it xenophobic. After all, one wouldn't call a national team in football for instance xenophobic because all the players come from that country.

Jacques Rabbit · 23 Jul 2009, 01:23 (Ref:2506389)

The other thing about bashing JV is...who do you want Team US F1 to hire? Ralf Schumacher? Sébastien Bourdais? There aren't exactly many guys with a lot of F1 experience who have proven themselves in these cars for them to employ.

@Born Racer, fair enough, xenophobic probably was a bit harsh. I just don't like to see someone (or someones) who can barely obtain a Super License (no US-born driver other than Scott Speed can without an exception being made) getting a drive in F1 when there are some capable young drivers racing in GP2 and F3 right now.

**Born Racer** · 23 Jul 2009, 01:35 (Ref:2506391)

Scott Speed is fairly capable. Do you think he would be willing to come back?

Welcome to Ten-Tenths, Jacques Rabbit.

Jacques Rabbit · 23 Jul 2009, 02:57 (Ref:2506405)

Thanks, Born Racer.

I doubt we'll see Scott back, though I would have liked to see what he could do with a faster car, a better-managed team, and a toned down attitude. He just got married to a girl who used to work on his NASCAR team (may have been one of the mechanics, not sure), so I'm not sure he'll be looking to leave the US anytime soon.

Taprobane · 23 Jul 2009, 08:56 (Ref:2506469)

There are a few guys out there with F1 experience who I think would be better options than JV (although not necessarily for USF1 due to their North American aims) such as Ant Davidson, Taku, Klien, Liuzzi, Speed...

Not to mention guys like Barichello who are likely to be out of a drive next year...

csirl · 23 Jul 2009, 09:35 (Ref:2506484)

JV won the championship the year that the cars were being driven by computers and could be controlled from the pits. He only won the championship because he was in the car with the best electronic aids. His decline was directly proportional to the scaling back of electronic aids on F1 cars. I dont think that he is capable of driving a F1 car without assistance.

**Born Racer** · 23 Jul 2009, 09:35 (Ref:2506485)

Quote:

Not to mention guys like Barichello who are likely to be out of a drive next year...

After failing to do a huge amount of note at Brawn except whine, and faced with a less competitive car, I wonder whether Rubens would call it a day if dropped by Brawn.

Marbot · 23 Jul 2009, 10:45 (Ref:2506511)

Quote:

Originally Posted by csirl

JV won the championship the year that the cars were being driven by computers and could be controlled from the pits.

I hadn't noticed that ! I must have been watching something else.

Last2LiftOff · 23 Jul 2009, 11:13 (Ref:2506523)

Standard ECU.

**Born Racer** · 23 Jul 2009, 12:12 (Ref:2506555)

I don't know where this computer-controlled car idea has come from. Traction control was banned in 1997 so it can't be that.

If FOTA form a breakaway series, they can differentiate themselves from F1 by having the skills of Ross Brawn and Adrian Newey operating radio-controlled cars from the pitwall. Perhaps if the FIA want to cut costs, they can hold Scalextric races.

**Bononi** · 23 Jul 2009, 12:15 (Ref:2506560)

I remember that... who was the guy from the pits who pushed the button "smash JV" in the last race of the season ?

**Bononi** · 23 Jul 2009, 12:16 (Ref:2506562)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Born Racer

If FOTA form a breakaway series, they can differentiate themselves from F1 by having the skills of Ross Brawn and Adrian Newey operating radio-controlled cars from the pitwall. Perhaps if the FIA want to cut costs, they can hold Scalextric races.

Breakaway series ? That's non-sense, never heard of it before.

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