Will Indycar gain attraction with F1s new engine regs?

[Marcus666]

Do you people think Indycar will rise in popularity when F1 introduces the new 1.6 V6 turbo formula? After what I've heard from the Renault V6T sample (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g8jz_Dgb8D4) The sound will probably be the same and if Indycar can loose up the rules over boost pressure, wouldn't the cars be the most powerful open wheelers in 2014? What do you guys think?

[rwintle]

My guess is no. The massive amount of fans worldwide who watch F1 will by and large not care what kind of engine is in F1 cars, and certainly won't care if it's higher/lower power, higher/lower displacement, louder/softer, etc. than the engines in any other series.

As for IndyCar - again, 99% of the fans watching don't care what the engine is. It's the kind of thing that's interesting to many of us here on ten-tenths, but not to the vast bulk of the fans that watch the races.

That's my guess, anyway.

[Aysedasi]

Exactly so, IMO. I fear the question assumes rather more technical understanding than the average fan possesses (or wants or needs).

[Peat]

What i find interesting is that Max Moseley's 'World Engine' idea was rejected and yet, down the line, we have found ourselves at a place where all the top tier series (F1, WEC, IndyCar, WRC) will all be running 1.6-1.8L V6 Turbos.

[Teretonga]

Originally Posted by Aysedasi

Exactly so, IMO. I fear the question assumes rather more technical understanding than the average fan possesses (or wants or needs).

I find this interesting in the light of arguments about the shape and style of the DW12 cars being of a nature that is unexciting/ugly/not attractive to fans as being a reason for the poor public responses to watching on TV (ratings) or in attending race meetings in large numbers.

While I may agree with some of the comments, surely if the average fans doesn't possess a technical understanding sufficient to be interested in the engine structure / configuration then the styule of car is beyond their wants or needs too.
The previous model Dallara was also heavily criticised for ugly looks and not a contemporary look and it makes me wonder just how really considered the negative comments about the last two generations of Dallara have been.

[Mike E]

Originally Posted by Peat

What i find interesting is that Max Moseley's 'World Engine' idea was rejected and yet, down the line, we have found ourselves at a place where all the top tier series (F1, WEC, IndyCar, WRC) will all be running 1.6-1.8L V6 Turbos.

Thank goodness engine configuration and capacity are free in WEC from next year. Variety is a huge part of the appeal of sports car racing.

[Paradise City]

Originally Posted by Teretonga

I find this interesting in the light of arguments about the shape and style of the DW12 cars being of a nature that is unexciting/ugly/not attractive to fans as being a reason for the poor public responses to watching on TV (ratings) or in attending race meetings in large numbers.

While I may agree with some of the comments, surely if the average fans doesn't possess a technical understanding sufficient to be interested in the engine structure / configuration then the styule of car is beyond their wants or needs too.
The previous model Dallara was also heavily criticised for ugly looks and not a contemporary look and it makes me wonder just how really considered the negative comments about the last two generations of Dallara have been.

Style has almost universal appeal and is understood. Technical details are dry and complex to most.

[MagVanisher]

Originally Posted by Peat

What i find interesting is that Max Moseley's 'World Engine' idea was rejected and yet, down the line, we have found ourselves at a place where all the top tier series (F1, WEC, IndyCar, WRC) will all be running 1.6-1.8L V6 Turbos.

At least they didn't use 4-cylinder engines in those major series.

On the other hand, it would be better if they'll just adapt Formula Nippon's engine regulations in 2014. But then again, it won't happen.

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by Peat

What i find interesting is that Max Moseley's 'World Engine' idea was rejected and yet, down the line, we have found ourselves at a place where all the top tier series (F1, WEC, IndyCar, WRC) will all be running 1.6-1.8L V6 Turbos.

Both the Chevy IndyCar V6 and the HI12R are 2.2 L (2,200 cc). Honda originally used one turbo charger but now uses two like Chevrolet.

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by Teretonga

I find this interesting in the light of arguments about the shape and style of the DW12 cars being of a nature that is unexciting/ugly/not attractive to fans as being a reason for the poor public responses to watching on TV (ratings) or in attending race meetings in large numbers.

While I may agree with some of the comments, surely if the average fans doesn't possess a technical understanding sufficient to be interested in the engine structure / configuration then the styule of car is beyond their wants or needs too.
The previous model Dallara was also heavily criticised for ugly looks and not a contemporary look and it makes me wonder just how really considered the negative comments about the last two generations of Dallara have been.

Aesthetics play a large part in whether people like something or not so I don't believe the style of car is beyond the average fan's wants or needs. Ironically the DW12 has produced some excellent racing unlike its predecessor the IR5.

[Teretonga]

Originally Posted by bjohnsonsmith

Aesthetics play a large part in whether people like something or not so I don't believe the style of car is beyond the average fan's wants or needs. Ironically the DW12 has produced some excellent racing unlike its predecessor the IR5.

Now that the cost of the chassis has exploded perhaps the myth of spec chassis reducing costs can be put to bed and at some point there can be a look at opening up the situation to a variety of makers.
Or do they go to a composite tub that is off the shelf for everyone but what they attach to it is up to the team or constructors.

Moving away from flat bottoms back to tunnels is common sense for indy car racing but the reality is that the whole concept projected in the mid nineties was flawed and US Open Wheel is still paying the price for it. What is even more difficult is that its people from the 'other side' who are having to prop up the miss or come in to sort it out.
Which all kind of indicates the management and philosophy of present open wheel racing is still central to the problems that need to be resolved....

[rwintle]

Again, not certain that most fans really care that much about looks either. F1 cars change from year to year but most fans don't notice or care, I think. Just try explaining "platypus nose" to someone watching an F1 race. Only people who really follow the regulations probably noticed.

In IndyCar - the DW12 sure does look, er, "different", but most fans I spoke with at the Toronto Indy over the last couple of years hardly noticed. Red and white Target car = Dixon or Franchitti. Verizon car = Power. Bright green GoDaddy car = Hinchcliffe, and didn't that used to be Danica's car? Etc. The body style is again something that ten-tenthers worry about a lot, and most of the rest of the world doesn't.

That's my take on it, anyway.

[JacobP]

The F1 engines are far more complicated and expensive. They have higher RPM, pneumatic valves, and KERS systems. Of course, a company that designed good F1 engines could in theory work on a successful IndyCar engine as a side project, if they wanted to. It would be cool if Mercedes built an IndyCar engine. Does anyone know if the same divisions within Honda are working on F1 and IndyCar engines?

[Marcus666]

Here's an idea for improving the sound, and I know its far from accurate but anyways:



By having a 6 into 1 (or 2 into 1 if you wanna call it that) exhaust layout. The engine tone would change and we would get a more "open Wheel sound". Just listen to the Honda HSV-010: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lCqY-vAX4EA

Although the HSV has an V8, the V6 wouldn't really be much of a difference except a little darker "high pitch" sound.


GP2 also uses the same kind of exhaust solution:



/Marcus

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by Marcus666

Here's an idea for improving the sound, and I know its far from accurate but anyways:



By having a 6 into 1 (or 2 into 1 if you wanna call it that) exhaust layout. The engine tone would change and we would get a more "open Wheel sound". Just listen to the Honda HSV-010: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lCqY-vAX4EA

Although the HSV has an V8, the V6 wouldn't really be much of a difference except a little darker "high pitch" sound.


GP2 also uses the same kind of exhaust solution:



/Marcus

GP2 doesn't run turbos and as I said in my post #9 the engines used in IndyCar are a completely different spec from what's going to be used in F1 next year.

[Marcus666]

Sorry for being unclear. It was an idea of how you could improve the engine sound. Right now they sound really booring to me, and also those mufflers that keep the beautiful noise down.