How long did the Porsche factory develop the 962?

[JAG]

Was the '89 short tail Joest 962 the last factory developed 962?

Were subsequent development's from the teams alone, i.e Joest twin wing '92-'93 IMSA GTP car?

Did Porsche ever lobby to keep the fuel formula regs?

Did they have plans for a 3.5l car?

Potentially the 962 could have been competitive at Le Mans right upto the end of the Group C era in '93-'94, even Jaguar developed the V12 XJR-12 into a final evolution, though this car eventually only competed at Daytona in 1993, not at Le Mans, which was a shame!

[PorscheFanNo1]

Originally Posted by JAG

Was the '89 short tail Joest 962 the last factory developed 962?

Were subsequent development's from the teams alone, i.e Joest twin wing '92-'93 IMSA GTP car?

The Joest cars from 92-93 was the same chassies as the WSPC Joest cars from 89, altho heavily remade especially in the front end with a totally new suspension and lots of other things. Those where the 144 and 145 chassies I belive. Those where not the last chassies tho. But I belive they where of the last generation of factory cars, Porsche made the last big changes in 88 I belive. (someone probably knows this better)

Originally Posted by JAG

Potentially the 962 could have been competitive at Le Mans right upto the end of the Group C era in '93-'94, even Jaguar developed the V12 XJR-12 into a final evolution, though this car eventually only competed at Daytona in 1993, not at Le Mans, which was a shame!

The 12D?, low downforce low drag, was it? Great looking car that. Raced in GroupC-GTP now (as you probably know).

[The359]

From what I've seen, the last 962s built for Joest were in 1990 (#012 through #015), although they might have been a final chassis in 1992 (#016).

Customer 962s were apparently still being built into 1991.

As for still being competitive into 1994, ignoring the Dauer 962s, ADA Engineering ran a Richard Lloyd Racing 962C GTi in 1994, the last hurrah of the Group C category. It did not finish.

[Lola T92/10]

As far as I can remember the last Joest chassis was 016 which was completed in 1991.

[minimangler]

The '89 Joest car was modified by Joest- so i'm not sure developed by the factory is the right term.

[MulsanneMike]

Joest's short tail was their development, though Singer was the consultant and present at the tunnel tests if not directing the development outright. Same goes for the twin-tier '93 evolution. Post 1988 that seems to be the model for Porsche's involvement, supply consultants and provide tunnel facility, but team pays for all.

The XJR-12D was a bit of a disaster, according to Tony Dowe and David Fullerton, this is what I've written for my new book:

In 1993 the final version of the XJR-12 V12-engined Jaguar prototype arrived at Daytona. Arrived being the operative word as it showed up at the track having been sent from TWR SVO in Broadstone UK with no input from TWR Valparaiso. Best described as an engineering “lash up”, it utilized bits and pieces from the TWR parts bin and while a seemingly interesting concept with potential as it brought together the best of the XJR-14/16 aero concepts and applied them to the V12 XJR-12, to be fair its execution left much to be desired. Rolled out, briefly shaken down, the car never had the benefit of any kind of tunnel program much less a track development session.

“It was a disaster,” says Dowe. “What really ****ed me off about this was that the money wasted we could have done a nice job on the V12 for another year.” David Fullerton, TWR Special Vehicle Projects Design Engineer adds, “When you get a guy like John Nielsen, to me one of the bravest drivers, who can do things other drivers can’t do, when he gets out of the car and says, ‘I’m scared to drive this car on the banking, its just not going where its supposed to go,’ its awful.”

Entered as the #32, this XJR-12 had a XJR-14 style rear engine cover, XJR-16 twin-tier rear wing, modified MXR-01 rear wing endplates, and was on XJR-12 Group C tunnels. All the Jaguar V12s at Daytona that year were running to the Le Mans Invitational class, with the purported reasoning behind the entry of the #32 V12 was to use Dayton as a toe-in-the-water exercise for this new variant of XJR-12 with the idea of running it at Le Mans, should sponsorship be secured. Alas the Daytona entry of this car wasn’t particularly serious and while the #32 did take the green flag, it was withdrawn a few hours in due to its erratic handling thus ending rather ignominiously Jaguar’s V12 IMSA history.

[cmk]

Neat stuff, Mike, thanks for the insight. Tony Dowe always tells it like it is, and his insight is among the most illuminating in the sportscar world.

Off-topic...please don't take this the wrong way, but you might want to edit that last sentence for the book!

[The359]

Originally Posted by MulsanneMike

Arrived being the operative word as it showed up at the track having been sent from TWR SVO in Broadstone UK with no input from TWR Valparaiso.

I wish I had lived in Valpo years earlier when TWR was still there. I had been past the former (tiny) shop several times.

[templer]

According to the book "Porsche 956/962" from Ulrich Upietz the 1989 short tail car was a factory development, the latest on this car made by the Porsche Company. The major development on the areo ( short tail with two element rear wing and gurney on the rear and a new front with splitter) was done by Norbert Singer and H. Reiter. Also the refinement of the engine was done by Porsche.
Plans for a new 3,5l car never materialized. There were plans for a replacement of the old aluminium monocque with a new carbonfibre monocoque built by BASF. This monocoque so the idea could be a basis for a new 3,5l car engined by the V12 formula 1 engine. But this never happenend cause Porsche's main target was F1 and this new car was planned to be ready for 1993 or later. But the Sportscar Championship was dead after 1992.

[JAG]

All very interesting, thanks.

I'm in the process of collecting 1/43rd, 80's onwards, sports protoype coupes, and the variety of 962's is staggering.

[The Badger]

I might have a few Starter kits 956/962 that I need to get rid of Jag ..... if your interested , let me know , and I will have a root through my stuff .

Just Group C or what ?

What about Toyota , Mazda and Nissan ..... I know someone who might have some rare stuff available .

[JAG]

Originally Posted by The Badger

I might have a few Starter kits 956/962 that I need to get rid of Jag ..... if your interested , let me know , and I will have a root through my stuff .

Just Group C or what ?

What about Toyota , Mazda and Nissan ..... I know someone who might have some rare stuff available .

I'm buying built stuff, but PM me with what you have.

[The Badger]

Originally Posted by JAG

I'm buying built stuff, but PM me with what you have.

Might take a little time .... It might be better if you tell me exactly what your looking for . Cuz im not sure what my brother wants to get rid off , he has a lot of Group C "Irish Drivers" ..... Toyota , Jag , Nissan , Mazda , AMR..... all are kits and all are untouched .

Daly-Roe-Donnelly-Acheson-Watson-Kennedy .

[JAG]

Originally Posted by The Badger

Might take a little time .... It might be better if you tell me exactly what your looking for . Cuz im not sure what my brother wants to get rid off , he has a lot of Group C "Irish Drivers" ..... Toyota , Jag , Nissan , Mazda , AMR..... all are kits and all are untouched .

Daly-Roe-Donnelly-Acheson-Watson-Kennedy .

Anything from 1991 onwards, or IMSA GTP, would be of interest

No rush.