How much time did Caltex Chase add?

Dazz · 19 Apr 2006, 00:55 (Ref:1588184)

I've done a search but cannot find anything.

Does anyone know approximately how much time Clatex Chase added to a lap of Mount Panorama?

I was comparing some current Group Nc times to those of the same cars (although in slightly different spec) from the 1972 race, and was wondering what time penalty The Chase would have added back then.

racer69 · 19 Apr 2006, 01:03 (Ref:1588190)

Klaus Ludwig's pole time in 1987 (with Caltex Chase) was quicker than Gary Scott's pole time in 1986 (without Caltex Chase).................

Dazz · 19 Apr 2006, 01:11 (Ref:1588192)

I think we need to find cars that were a: the same type, and b: as unchanged as possible from 1986 to 1987.

I'll look through all my Bathurst books at home tonight. Possibly some of the privateer car might be the best examples as a lot of them pretty much only came out for Bathurst and were changed very little from year to year.

retro · 19 Apr 2006, 01:16 (Ref:1588196)

.........storyline should have all the details to give an accurate answer on this.

storyline · 19 Apr 2006, 01:29 (Ref:1588207)

hmmm I posted a reply to this before - don't know what happened to it. What I suggested was to compare the 1986 and 1987 times or, better yet, try and get hold of a support categories times as these would have been more 'stable' between the two years (and no sorry, I don;t have those available).

From the Tuckey 1986/87 Great Race book, cars qualified with a fastest time of 2:17.159 (Garry Cott's Skyline), then Allan Grice in the Commodore with a 1:17.246. Fastest laps in the race were 2:18.99 (Grice's Commodore) then the Moffat and Brock Commodore with a 2:19.02.

1987 race - qualifying say Ludwig in the Sierra 2:16.969, Rouse 2>18.468, Soper 2:18.663 - the first Commodore was back in 7th (Grice) with a 2:21.48. So, if you take Grice as the benchmark - it added about 4.2 seconds in qualifying. Race fastest lap, for a Commodore, went to Grice wuthg a 2:23.50 on lap 30 - again about a 4.5 second difference in times. (Naturally the Sierra's were quicker than everything else but they didn't run in 86 so there is nothing to compare them to.

Hope thse figures help - get holdof Tuckey's books as all this data is in the 1986/87 and 1987/88 editions.

Dazz · 19 Apr 2006, 01:54 (Ref:1588222)

Thanks for that.

I'll also look at the Corolla's and the like, basically lookinf for things running about in around the 2:35-2:45 bracket for a comparison as well.

storyline · 19 Apr 2006, 02:09 (Ref:1588227)

OK - Corolla's in 1986 - the Quinn/Faulkner Toyota Team Australia entry - fastest lap in the race was 2:33.15. The same car/team in 87 posted a 2:40.17 - so about 7 seconds on fastest lap.

Interestingly - Bob Holden was five seconds slower in his Corolla from Quinn/Faulkner in 86 and also 5 seconds slower in 87 - and about 7 seconds different from 86 to 87 times.

Hope these help.

johnny yuma · 19 Apr 2006, 03:40 (Ref:1588257)

You also need to factor in the relatively primitive state of the roadway and track width variations in say early 70s compared to the precisely engineered smooth surface of today.With this considered I've heard it said 3 seconds is realistic.

Dazz · 19 Apr 2006, 03:43 (Ref:1588261)

Cheers for that, exactly what I was looking for.

storyline · 19 Apr 2006, 03:57 (Ref:1588270)

Whilst it may now be 3 seconds, the comparison between 86 and 87 would be realistic. Keep in mind that between 87 and today improvements in cars, suspension, engines, tyres etc would account for the other 4 seconds.

So the Chase, and whatever else was changed between the two events, would be the primary cause of the 7 seconds difference.

johnny yuma · 19 Apr 2006, 06:47 (Ref:1588344)

If threadstarter Dazz wants to compare 1972 times to 2006 times though,he should consider factors which have made the track slower,like The Chase,and faster- like all the other improvements.In other words to see how much better or worse you and your car are compared to Fred Bloggs in 1972 add 3 seconds to Fred's time and you have it.

storyline · 19 Apr 2006, 07:32 (Ref:1588361)

Actually he only asked what time penalty the Chase would have added back in 1972 - not when compared to todays variants of the same cars - so doing a comparison the way he has would be a true indication of what impact the Chase had.

johnny yuma · 20 Apr 2006, 04:30 (Ref:1589341)

I don't believe in anything anymore.....I'm goin' to Law School!
the simpsons.

storyline · 20 Apr 2006, 04:35 (Ref:1589343)

eBay has dummies that can be bought quite cheaply.

johnny yuma · 20 Apr 2006, 06:35 (Ref:1589382)

well next time you're wasting time on the internet looking on eBay see if you can get yourself a cheap home enema kit

Dazz · 20 Apr 2006, 19:34 (Ref:1590080)

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnny yuma

well next time you're wasting time on the internet looking on eBay see if you can get yourself a cheap home enema kit

How many seconds a lap would that take off your lap of Bathurst?

johnny yuma · 21 Apr 2006, 00:18 (Ref:1590347)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dazz

How many seconds a lap would that take off your lap of Bathurst?

a ****load

Sultan · 21 Apr 2006, 01:51 (Ref:1590391)

Yeah, Storylne hit the nail on the head. The general consensus at the time was around the 4 second mark...

I wonder how today's car would go on the old track? 2-3 pad changes (maybe even complete rotor change!), definitely a taller diff ratio. A theoretical Murphy lap of 2:02?

Interesting thought though, would they have launched over the infamous 2nd hump with the extra downforce they have?

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